Need 3 volunteers Attrition league beta test

[Guest]

Actually, skipping tonight isn't a bad idea. I'm struggling to make it, as is. I'll face someone on Wednesday. 

[peter.cosgrove]

Chad/Carl can you two play wednesday/GG?

[peter.cosgrove]

ok.. chris and I played our first game. Have an important change to make.

Change 1:

Play on a 4x4, roll off to choose deployment type and player side. winner chooses deployment type, other player chooses deployment edge.

Each game will have 5 objectives. 3 neutral caches and 2 deployment caches. Winner of deployment type roll off places first/third neutral caches. Other player places second neutral cache. Place the 3 neutral caches into non-deployment areas 12" from other caches and the table edge. (12" from the table edge "shouldn't" be a problem, but if it is place the cache as far from the table edge as possible and 12" from any other cache)

The player that lost the deployment type roll off places first unit.

After all units are deployed, starting with the player who placed the last unit first, each player places a deployment cache in their opponent's deployment zone 12" from other cache objectives and 6" away from any table edge.

The player who has the closest units furthest from the closest cache chooses to go first or second. If both players have the closest unit equidistant then roll off for choice of first/second turn with the player that placed the last unit first gaining a +1 to the die roll.

You can sieze initiative on a roll of 6 at beginning of first turn.

Replaces the following:

Play on a 4x4 using normal matched play rules for choosing a deployment type.

Each game will have 5 objectives. 3 neutral caches and 2 deployment caches. Roll off for placing the first neutral cache. 

Place the 3 neutral cache into non-deployment areas 12" from other caches and the table edge. The player who lost the objective roll off chooses the deployment side and places the first unit.

After all units are deployed, starting with the player who placed the last unit first, each player places a deployment  cache in their opponent's deployment zone 12" from other cache objectives and 6" away from any table edge.

The player who has the closest units furthest from the closest cache chooses to go first or second.

You can seize initiative on a roll of 6 at beginning of first turn.

[peter.cosgrove]

Also, a model can control/carry multiple cache's.

[happycamper]

I can play Thursday I think

[peter.cosgrove]

Carl I can play you 500 on Wed if you want. what time do you normally show up? unless you can meet chad on thur

[Guest]

Just now, peter.cosgrove said:

Carl I can play you 500 on Wed if you want. what time do you normally show up?

6pm. I can show up earlier, if you want. 

Just takes me about 2 hours to get there, via public transit. So I try to leave at 4pm. The route is very simple and pretty reliable, so I'm not complaining. But the time required just means that I can't cater to sudden changes in schedule. 

[Guest]

Where do you want us to post the Narrative stuff (and the "friendly" jabs at our opponent)? I mean, I could do it in this thread, or I already have a thread going for the Smiling Skulls Space Marines, so could use that. 

[happycamper]

137th Cadian “Lost Hope” company reporting in.

Discovery of A renegade Blood Angle Detachment was made in sector 7.  Heretics were purged to the last man.  No casualties taken.

[peter.cosgrove]

Note to self.

ignore the following.

75 points instead of 100. 

Keep the attrition at a 1 on a d6.

placement of deployment obj’s 12” and 6” from both table edge and models

[Guest]

Regarding Upgrades and stuff allowed. Can I change my legion? There's no cost change involved. Also, Can I downgrade to cheaper weapons?

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, happycamper said:

137th Cadian “Lost Hope” company reporting in.

Discovery of A renegade Blood Angle Detachment was made in sector 7.  Heretics were purged to the last man.  No casualties taken.

Don't lump them in with us. Cowards and Deserters, but not heretics to the false emperor. My Smiling Skulls, dedicated to the almighty Khorne and the true God-Emperor Horus, also encountered these Blood Angels. They fleed from cultists, took wounds from Brother Crombie, and spend the remainder of the encounter hiding behind a wall as their medic patched them up. Sanguinus would be ashamed, but sanguinus deserves his shame. 

No casualties taken. Blood was spilt, but not enough blood the please the blood god. 

[peter.cosgrove]

Once somethings on your roster it's there until the model dies. You have to buy the units legally but you can allow the unit to attrit normally if you roll 1's, i/e you can have a short squad that you don't pay to reinforce. You also can't change the factions either, that would mean changing the roster.

Once a unit or model gets dropped into the atmosphere of The Triple Canopy Jungle Planet of DOOOOOOM, it's stuck. To leave you have to collect what your master's want, which is enough caches for them to deign to recover your worthless carcasses.

[peter.cosgrove]

obtw chad, don't count the 2nd or third round, you need to play someone else besides me. it's round robin so your next "official" matchup is with carl/chris.

same thing with Carl/Chris. 

Can everyone show up on next Tue?

i/e is anyone NOT available to play on TUE.

[peter.cosgrove]

Note to self:

Ignore this bit.

Instead of 100 points make it 75 points.

Keep the Attrition on a 1.

A player can concede by surrendering a cache. The winner then gains 1+D3 caches, the player conceding either loses a cache already in inventory or doesn't receive the end-game cache.

ah. It looks like I already made notes.

[peter.cosgrove]

Ok so. Here is the next bit to think about. I would like everyone's input.

in Shadowwars each player rolled on a table before each game for random effects during the game. 2 players, 2 separate, sometimes incremental effects.

So what kind of things would be ok to roll randomly for to make the game more finicky. Things like, Night Fighting, Slippery Terrain etc.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, peter.cosgrove said:

Ok so. Here is the next bit to think about. I would like everyone's input.

in Shadowwars each player rolled on a table before each game for random effects during the game. 2 players, 2 separate, sometimes incremental effects.

So what kind of things would be ok to roll randomly for to make the game more finicky. Things like, Night Fighting, Slippery Terrain etc.

None. Random elements just make the game take longer. Instead, the Organizer, you, should roll these things and make a Game 2 scenario that everyone follows based on your results. So it's random, but it doesn't slow the game down. 

2 hours ago, peter.cosgrove said:

Once somethings on your roster it's there until the model dies. You have to buy the units legally but you can allow the unit to attrit normally if you roll 1's, i/e you can have a short squad that you don't pay to reinforce. You also can't change the factions either, that would mean changing the roster.

Once a unit or model gets dropped into the atmosphere of The Triple Canopy Jungle Planet of DOOOOOOM, it's stuck. To leave you have to collect what your master's want, which is enough caches for them to deign to recover your worthless carcasses.

My understanding is that we are allowed to upgrade units. For example, if I have a marine with a bolter and a bolt pistol, I can upgrade it to have a missile launcher at a later date. That said, why would the reverse not be true? If I have a model with a missile launcher, why am I unable to give him a bolter instead?

Regarding faction changes, recall that in this edition I have lots of factions. It's just as accurate to call my faction Khorne, as it is to call them World Eaters, Chaos, or Hereticus Astartes. And, in this edition, If I add a unit to my roster, say I add a Chaos Daemon, my detachment defaults to common faction keyword, which would be a chaos or khorne. And with us not using detachments, this again becomes murky. And for clarity, my army is Smiling Skulls Space Marines, not World eaters or whatever, I'm just using those rules to represent them. 

Also, been wondering, are we allowed to field understength units, due to attrition.

[Guest]

2 hours ago, peter.cosgrove said:

obtw chad, don't count the 2nd or third round, you need to play someone else besides me. it's round robin so your next "official" matchup is with carl/chris.

same thing with Carl/Chris. 

Can everyone show up on next Tue?

i/e is anyone NOT available to play on TUE.

I'm planning to attend. 

[Guest]

Would be nice to have all the lists posted, so we can be sure we're following the same rules in list creation...I'll start.

 

Smiling Skulls Space Marines (World Eaters) 500pts

HQ Chaos Lord on Juggernaut (Warlord, Bladed Horn, Power Fist, Combi-Flamer, Chaos Artefact: Brass Collar, Warlord Trait: Unholy Fortitude) 158pts

Elites "Brother Crombie" the Hellbrute (Twin Lascannon, Missile Launcher) 147pts

Troops Cultists (10, Autoguns) 40pts

Troops Berserkers (5, 2 Chainaxes) 82pts

Dedicated Transport Rhino (Combi-Bolter) 72pts

Total: 499pts

 

So for Increases, I lost last game, so 1 Cashe. I also gain 200pts for the very short narrative and taunt:

13 hours ago, paxmiles said:

Don't lump them in with us. Cowards and Deserters, but not heretics to the false emperor. My Smiling Skulls, dedicated to the almighty Khorne and the true God-Emperor Horus, also encountered these Blood Angels. They fleed from cultists, took wounds from Brother Crombie, and spend the remainder of the encounter hiding behind a wall as their medic patched them up. Sanguinus would be ashamed, but sanguinus deserves his shame. 

No casualties taken. Blood was spilt, but not enough blood the please the blood god. 

So, if I'm doing this right, I now add 200pts, and if I want, I can burn my cashe for an extra 100pts giving me up to 300pts to add to the list. Because I spent 499pts of the starting 500pts, do I carry over the unspent 1pt, or is it gone?

Now, if I wanted to swap weapons on a guy, for example, giving a Cultist a Heavy Stubber instead of an Autogun, Can I? Or if I wanted to replace one of the Hellbrute weapons with something else because those weapons are overkill at 500pts, can I?

Next, if I want to add a Chaos Daemon or Building to my army, can I? 

[peter.cosgrove]

5 hours ago, paxmiles said:

My understanding is that we are allowed to upgrade units. For example, if I have a marine with a bolter and a bolt pistol, I can upgrade it to have a missile launcher at a later date. That said, why would the reverse not be true? If I have a model with a missile launcher, why am I unable to give him a bolter instead?

You can upgrade, but you can't throw away a weapon/model once you have upgraded it.  The only mechanic to remove a model is the attrition.

Regarding faction changes, recall that in this edition I have lots of factions. It's just as accurate to call my faction Khorne, as it is to call them World Eaters, Chaos, or Hereticus Astartes. And, in this edition, If I add a unit to my roster, say I add a Chaos Daemon, my detachment defaults to common faction keyword, which would be a chaos or khorne. And with us not using detachments, this again becomes murky. And for clarity, my army is Smiling Skulls Space Marines, not World eaters or whatever, I'm just using those rules to represent them. 

Once you declare a legion/chapter etc. on your roster it's fixed.

Also, been wondering, are we allowed to field understength units, due to attrition.

Yes. You have to buy them full strength, but if they attrit you can have them be understrength. In addition, if you attrit models from a unit you are not required to buy back models to full strength if you only want to buy some models to raise the model count of the unit.

 

[peter.cosgrove]

5 hours ago, paxmiles said:

Because I spent 499pts of the starting 500pts, do I carry over the unspent 1pt, or is it gone?

Once you play the unused points are gone.

Now, if I wanted to swap weapons on a guy, for example, giving a Cultist a Heavy Stubber instead of an Autogun, Can I? Or if I wanted to replace one of the Hellbrute weapons with something else because those weapons are overkill at 500pts, can I?

If you buy a weapon for a model, you retain the previous weapon. So you CAN swap between weapons before each game, and you can transfer weapons between eligible models, but ALL weapons on the roster have to be on the model/board, even if they are not equipped and if the model carrying the un-equipped weapon is attrited then you lose both weapons. Just like in Shadowwars.

Next, if I want to add a Chaos Daemon or Building to my army, can I? 

As long as the roster retains the single faction keyword  within the roster then it's fine. no mixing Imperial guard with necrons, or orks with eldar etc.

 

[Guest]

All that sounds fine except the upgrade thing. You don't really upgrade weapons in this edition. You pay for the model and you pay for their weapons. They don't really start with any weapons you don't pay for. Those Autoguns are zero cost, but you still have to buy them (for 0pts). As for retaining weapons lost when replacing them with higher cost weapons, that is certainly not something done in this edition.

"For Every ten models in the unit, one Chaos Cultist may replace their autogun with a heavy stubber or a flamer."

But, sure, if I want additional weapons options for my Hellbrute, can I purchase alternates and choose a legal loatout before the battle begins?

[Guest]

Anyway, here's my updated list. Okay, 200pts of list additions for attrition league next week. Adding a jump chaos lord and some cheap raptors. List is now

 

World Eaters 700pts

HQ (Warlord: Undying Fortitude) Chaos Lord on Juggernaut (Bladed Horn, Power Fist, Combi-Flamer, Chaos Artefact: Brass Collar) 125+10+12+11=158pts

HQ Chaos Lord on Jump Pack (Chaos Artefact: Murdersword, Chainsword) 93+4=97pts

Elites Hellbrute (1 Twin Lascannon, 1 Missile Launcher) 72+50+25=147pts

Troops Cultists (10, 10 Autoguns) 40pts

Troops Khorne Berserkers (5, 5 Bolt Pistols, 3 Chainswords, 2 Chain Axes) 80+2=82pts

Dedicated Rhino (Combi-Bolter)7+2=72pts

Fast Raptors (5, 3 Bolt Pistol, 3 Chainsword, 2 Flamers) 85+18=103pts

Total 699pts. 2 CP (3 Base, -1 for the second artefact, 2 total)

[Guest]

Not this time around, but for the future, it would be nice if certain units could upgrade into other units. Like starting with upgrading a unit of troops CSM into Chosen, and then later, one or two of those into Characters, like Exalted Champions or Chaos Lords.

[peter.cosgrove]

No, that would be changing the list. I like the idea in general for a narrative campaign, but for a non-narrative league, no.