Nurgle Plague Tower, looking for help on stats.

[VonVilkee]

7 minutes ago, paxmiles said:

Correct. The AM datasheets aren't adjusted, but those renegade heavy weapon teams are stuck at BS5+ and the traitor guard inventory has no point difference for their heavy weapons. 

Truth you pay a premium for mixing with chaos sometimes. 

[peter.cosgrove]

1 hour ago, VonVilkee said:

I totally want to bring back the plague reaper and just use the acheron flame cannon (forge world knight variant weapon) for the pus cannon. 18" heavy 2d6 str7 AP -2 damage 3 auto hits. 

I think 3 Damage is a bit too powerful for the pus cannon, The plague spitter on the Plagueburst Crawler is only 1 damage.

[Guest]

Just now, VonVilkee said:

Truth you pay a premium for mixing with chaos sometimes. 

Expect that that makes it sound like traitor guard should be regarded as more elite than regular AM...

[Guest]

Just now, peter.cosgrove said:

I think 3 Damage is a bit too powerful for the pus cannon, The plague spitter on the Plagueburst Crawler is only 1 damage.

The Banewolf Chem Cannon would probably be the most nurgle appropriate. 8" range, Heavy d6, ap-3. Wounds non-vehicles on 2+. Vehicles require a 6+.

Though I still like the Hellhound Inferno cannon 16" range, heavy 2d6, s6, ap-1, damage 1. 

On topic, there's also the Helldrake Baleflamer 18" assault d6, S6, ap-2, 2 damage

[VonVilkee]

1 minute ago, peter.cosgrove said:

I think 3 Damage is a bit too powerful for the pus cannon, The plague spitter on the Plagueburst Crawler is only 1 damage.

I don't that thing kicked ass in the previous edition. Keep in mind that str7 wounds most things in 3s instead of 2s like before. It should be at least damage 2 it was also ap3 could reasonably kill vehicles in a single hit... keep in mind with no templates it won't be able to hit multiple units any more. 

 

I used it allot previously and regularly wiped out a transport or two and 3+ squads of infantry in a single shot cuz of the placement rules. It's damage is more focused now instead of spread out. 

[VonVilkee]

2 minutes ago, paxmiles said:

The Banewolf Chem Cannon would probably be the most nurgle appropriate. 8" range, Heavy d6, ap-3. Wounds non-vehicles on 2+. Vehicles require a 6+.

Though I still like the Hellhound Inferno cannon 16" range, heavy 2d6, s6, ap-1, damage 1. 

On topic, there's also the Helldrake Baleflamer 18" assault d6, S6, ap-2, 2 damage

 hell drake cannon keeps it in faction too so another good choice. 

[peter.cosgrove]

1 hour ago, paxmiles said:

The Banewolf Chem Cannon would probably be the most nurgle appropriate. 8" range, Heavy d6, ap-3. Wounds non-vehicles on 2+. Vehicles require a 6+.

This looks far better. What is the str on the Chem Cannon?

[peter.cosgrove]

1 hour ago, VonVilkee said:

 hell drake cannon keeps it in faction too so another good choice. 

Thing is.. it's not a flamer, it's spewing noxious plague ridden liquid that rots and diseases instead of burning.

[VonVilkee]

Just now, peter.cosgrove said:

This looks far better. What is the str on the Chem Cannon?

 none and is a basic tank weapon. Your super heavy should have one big boy toy along with multiple more standard weapon systems. I really would look more at other titanic weapon systems for the pus cannon. 

[VonVilkee]

2 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

Thing is.. it's not a flamer, it's spewing noxious plague ridden liquid that rots and diseases instead of burning.

 It had the exact same stats back in 7th as the weapon I quoted fyi which is why I recommended it.  

 

Also corrodes things and could slip into vehicles to get at crew. Totally similar damage to flame. 

[peter.cosgrove]

The interesting bit is the Plagueburst Crawler Plaguespitter is S user, which is S7/6/5 descending modified, The pus cannon is also S7.

[VonVilkee]

4 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

The interesting bit is the Plagueburst Crawler Plaguespitter is S user, which is S8, The pus cannon is only S7.

 true enough plague spitter didn't exist... and is only on weaker things right? I'd say you could go either way, just don't change the range more likely to wound some things close but for less damage or a little less likely to wound but when it does OUCH

 

Edit: give your data sheet the option of both weapons! Tradsies like. 

[peter.cosgrove]

1 hour ago, VonVilkee said:

 true enough plague spitter didn't exist... and is only on weaker things right? I'd say you could go either way, just don't change the range more likely to wound some things close but for less damage or a little less likely to wound but when it does OUCH

I was wrong on the S8. It's S7.

[Guest]

11 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

This looks far better. What is the str on the Chem Cannon?

I didn't list one because it doesn't have one. It wounds on 2+ unless the target is a vehicle. Vehicles are wounded on 6+. Which is very similar to how the Pus Cleaver (CSM artefact) functions (that one lists S user, despite the strength having no bearing on the weapon...).

Hellhound is on the list of Traitorguard vehicles. I'm unclear if the Banewolf is a legal option, since they are one datasheet, but two very different vehicles. 

[peter.cosgrove]

How would the Nurgle Infestation work?

"Any unit assaulting the Plague Tower will be attacked by Nurglings. The enemy units suffers 3d6 S3 hits at I3.

[VonVilkee]

Just now, peter.cosgrove said:

I was wrong on the S8. It's S7.

 The new wounding charts change a lot of the math on these weapons. Also you should be forced to take a flesh mower! The old picture called out the spikes with corpses... it will make it slightly better in combat (don't change the ws) but increase your points for the custom nature of the vehicle. 

[Guest]

Just now, peter.cosgrove said:

How would the Nurgle Infestation work?

"Any unit assaulting the Plague Tower will be attacked by Nurglings. The enemy units suffers 3d6 S3 hits at I3.

Simple. You'd call that a melee weapon. It would have a fixed strength. I'd suggest against auto hits, since those rules are for when vehicle had no attacks of their own. I'd suggest something like titan stomp, where they get 3 attacks per attack with that weapon. 

[peter.cosgrove]

1 hour ago, VonVilkee said:

 The new wounding charts change a lot of the math on these weapons. Also you should be forced to take a flesh mower! The old picture called out the spikes with corpses... it will make it slightly better in combat (don't change the ws) but increase your points for the custom nature of the vehicle. 

ya, I know. I haven't put that part on yet. Wanted to keep the model durable so pieces don't break off moving it around.

[VonVilkee]

4 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

How would the Nurgle Infestation work?

"Any unit assaulting the Plague Tower will be attacked by Nurglings. The enemy units suffers 3d6 S3 hits at I3.

 back when that existed you couldn't over watch as a vehicle nor fight normally. You could do two things. First make it kinda like a chain sword additional attacks at str 3 for sombre points. Or make it a defense gun range like 6" and fits in the steel behemoth rule of shooting certain weapons at assaulters.

 

Edit: you could also stream line and just drop that fiddly rule.  You now get to over watch with auto hitting weapons so prolly don't need it. Personally I say why bother?

[peter.cosgrove]

1 hour ago, paxmiles said:

Simple. You'd call that a melee weapon. It would have a fixed strength. I'd suggest against auto hits, since those rules are for when vehicle had no attacks of their own. I'd suggest something like titan stomp, where they get 3 attacks per attack with that weapon. 

That makes sense. Keep it S3, and 3d6. What are nurglings WS?

WS4.

[VonVilkee]

1 minute ago, peter.cosgrove said:

That makes sense. Keep it S3, and 3d6. What are nurglings WS?

 don't bother mixing... 4+ I believe try not to get too fiddly...

[Guest]

Just now, peter.cosgrove said:

That makes sense. Keep it S3, and 3d6. What are nurglings WS?

 

They have a 4+ WS. I would suggest against giving the weapon a fixed WS. I'd just go with the vehicle's profile. Having WS degrade would make sense. 

The other thing you could do here would be to have a "Fire Point"-like rule where embarked Nurglings could attack in melee (and be attacked), treating the space the plague tower occupies as their model for determining who can attack.  

[peter.cosgrove]

I was thinking for the descending modifiers do Movement 5"/4"/3" and BS 4/5/6. 

oh.. and the NPT can't advance or charge.

[VonVilkee]

1 minute ago, paxmiles said:

 

They have a 4+ WS. I would suggest against giving the weapon a fixed WS. I'd just go with the vehicle's profile. Having WS degrade would make sense. 

The other thing you could do here would be to have a "Fire Point"-like rule where embarked Nurglings could attack in melee (and be attacked), treating the space the plague tower occupies as their model for determining who can attack.  

All kinds of fun things can be done but be sure to ask yourself if they should be done. The more straight forward and simple a custom is they more likely others will accept it. 

[VonVilkee]

1 minute ago, peter.cosgrove said:

I was thinking for the descending modifiers do Movement 5"/4"/3" and BS 4/5/6. 

oh.. and the NPT can't advance or charge.

 don't take away it's charge! How did those corpses get there? Crush things please.