Random 40k-specific thought thread

[StygianArcanum]

4 hours ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

I feel like Earth and Mars have moved south, Ultramarines east, and Tau substantially south with an empire reduction.

I see what you're saying, though I think the Tau actually got bigger. Admittedly, the last map I saw was in Fifth Edition, so my info's a little out of date. It is a great frustration to me that planets can't stay where they are on these damn maps (Looking at you, Chogoris). I set up a homebrew sector near Nocturne only to find out that it had mysteriously moved several thousand light years south and west of its last position.

[Guest]

So knight pilots are in diapers?

[InfestedKerrigan]

46 minutes ago, paxmiles said:

So knight pilots are in diapers?

Do airline pilots wear diapers? Do tank crews wear diapers? Then why in the nine hells would a Knight pilot? 

The answer is they don't. 

[Guest]

31 minutes ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

Do airline pilots wear diapers? Do tank crews wear diapers? Then why in the nine hells would a Knight pilot? 

The answer is they don't. 

Airlines have bathrooms. I believe jetfighter pilots do have some sort of diaper. Regarding tank crews, I think it would probably depend on how long the crew was intended to stay in the tank. I've heard about tanks design for more long term uses that did have bathrooms, though I don't think it's very common.

Knight pilot is sitting on a throne, could be a toilet...

EDIT: Apparently the British Challenger 2 tank has a toilet built in. Not on the wikipedia, but there's enough other sites mentioning it where I think it's really there. Wiki site seems to be focused on non-crapper related points of the tank...

[WestRider]

6 hours ago, paxmiles said:

Is there a bathroom on the imperial knight?

Yes. It's mentioned in that one CCR song 😉

More seriously, not an actual bathroom, but probably some sort of catheter system.

[andy]

Honestly, I doubt it. It's just easier to replace the digestive tract with bionics, and change the filter every 25000 miles.

[InfestedKerrigan]

2 hours ago, andy said:

Honestly, I doubt it. It's just easier to replace the digestive tract with bionics, and change the filter every 25000 meals.

Ftfy

[Guest]

5 hours ago, andy said:

Honestly, I doubt it. It's just easier to replace the digestive tract with bionics, and change the filter every 25000 miles.

That does sound very 40k.

[WestRider]

I got the Space Wolves Codex, and have been reading through it, and there are some bits in here that are either more egregious contradictions than usual for GW, or something very odd about the biology of Fenrisians. Specifically, there's the usual note about how Space Marines need to be recruited and receive their first implants before puberty, but there are also mentions of things like Njall Stormcaller having a full beard, Arjac Rockfist being an experienced and accomplished blacksmith, and Lukas the Trickster having banged a dozen women in one night. In all cases, these were clearly stated to have occurred before they were brought to The Fang and inducted into the Chapter. Arjac, I don't know, maybe he was some sort of smithing prodigy, and was hammering away by the time he was 4 or something, but the other two are really hard to square with the fact that they must have been prepubescent at that time.

[Psilence]

I would imagine the average life span for a normal human on Fenris (or any death world for that matter) is considerably shorter than on other imperial planets, or even our modern earth.

When 35 is an ‘old man’, and everything everywhere wants to kill you it might accelerate maturity levels a bit.

[InfestedKerrigan]

Might is a bit of an understatement, I feel, although I've never thought about 40k in this light.  Creatures that die "young" start reproducing "younger" in order to ensure survival. After 15k years of obscene death, I wouldn't put it past evolution to push for an Enders Game reproductive range.

[WestRider]

I was thinking more in hormonal/biochemical terms rather than social. The geneseed has to be implanted before the kind of hormonal changes that cause dudes to grow facial hair or become fully sexually functional occur. That's reiterated in the same book as those descriptions of those particular Space Wolves.

[Psilence]

I would argue that living in such a cold climate that body hair in general would be a dominant evolutionary trait.

Although 20k years might not be a long enough time line to see that sort of shift...

There are other blurbs throughout the wolf fluff that suggest the original settlers of fenris (and likely the fauna) were engineered to be able to survive on the planet.

That would be my last hope for any sort of justification of the points you raise.

🙂

[PourSpelur]

Could be a witty lampshade on the boasting Sons of Fenris are known for.

Could be lousy writing.

I like to think it's the first, probably the second though.

[Guest]

[dalmer]

Steering back to the Space Wolves thoughts...

Wolves (on Earth) mate after about 2-3 years, with a lifespan around 5-6 years.  So, the first third of their life they start reproducing.

If lifespan in the 40k universe is shorter due to how grimdark things are (say 40), then yes I can see reproducing earlier.  Heck even now it's not uncommon for teens to be with child.

With respects to the body hair, there are no wolves on Fenris...

[Guest]

Can you place models on top of other models? Like if your friendly tank is flat enough to place models on top of it, can I have an infantry unit deployed on top of it? Any rule against this?

[InfestedKerrigan]

53 minutes ago, paxmiles said:

Can you place models on top of other models? Like if your friendly tank is flat enough to place models on top of it, can I have an infantry unit deployed on top of it? Any rule against this?

This isn't a rules thread. Please, take your rules questions to a rules thread.

[Ish]

Rogal Dorn was left-handed, famously so. That’s why the Imperial Fists’ chapter badge and that of most of their successors is a left hand. 

Now, it’s a very traditional trope that left handed people are untrustworthy, suspicious, and just generally sinister. In fact, the very word sinister comes from Latin where it literally just means “left or on the left side of” and yet even in Ancient Rome it was being used as a metaphor for untrustworthiness or betrayal. Conversely, the Latin word for “on the right,” dexter, would go on to become a root for words about “usefulness” and “skillful,” like dexterity... An important and trusted advisor is your “right hand man,” Christianity teaches that Jesus “is seated at the right hand of the Father,” and so forth.

But, picture a fully armored fighting-man with spear and shield. Which hand is he holding his shield in? 

Dorn is metaphorically the Shield of the Emperor. He is his father’s left hand.

Meanwhile, it was Horus, the Emperor’s “right hand man” who betrayed his father... and the lightning claw that he has passed down to Abaddon the Despoiler known as the Talon of Horus? Yeah, it’s right handed.

I don’t know if Rick Priestly and Jervos Johnson intended all of this or if it’s just a happy accident... But it’s kinda neat.

[Guest]

7 hours ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

This isn't a rules thread. Please, take your rules questions to a rules thread.

For starters, I created this thread. And a rules question is still a random 40k thought. That said, you don't have to answer and your reply above is perfectly reasonable response, as it too is a 40k thought.

Anyway, not looking for a debate. The question was just a random thought, not something I really need an answer to.

[Ish]

9 hours ago, paxmiles said:

Can you place models on top of other models? Like if your friendly tank is flat enough to place models on top of it, can I have an infantry unit deployed on top of it? Any rule against this?

No, you cannot place a model on top of another model. Models can only "be moved vertically in order to climb or traverse ... scenery." (WH40k Core Rules, pg. 3)

 

Quote

Moving
A model can be moved in any direction, to a distance, in inches, equal to or less than the Move characteristic on its datasheet. No part of the model’s base (or hull) can move further than this. It cannot be moved through other models or through terrain features such as walls,  but can be moved vertically in order to climb or traverse any scenery. 

 

[Guest]

Ever think about how fluff regarding a model's life expectancy seems directly related to the racial average ballistic skill? I mean, the SM, Eldar and necrons are mostly BS3+. The rank and file imperial guardsmen and the TAU are BS4+. And then the orks are bs 5+.

[WestRider]

9 hours ago, paxmiles said:

Ever think about how fluff regarding a model's life expectancy seems directly related to the racial average ballistic skill? I mean, the SM, Eldar and necrons are mostly BS3+. The rank and file imperial guardsmen and the TAU are BS4+. And then the orks are bs 5+.

Counter-examples: Gretchin and Termagants.

[Ish]

Quote

6. MORALE PHASE
To take a Morale test, roll a dice and add the number of models from the unit that have been slain this turn. If the result of the Morale test exceeds the highest Leadership characteristic in the unit, the test is failed.  For each point that the test is failed by, one model in that unit must flee and is removed from play. You choose which models flee from the units you command.

-- Warhammer 40,000: Battle Primer (p. 9)

Quote

AND THEY SHALL KNOW NO FEAR
You can re-roll failed Morale tests for this unit. 

--Codex Adeptus Astartes: Space Marines (p. 131)

Quote

Re-rolls always happen before modifiers, so the re-roll ability is triggered before applying modifiers.

--Designer's Commentary (p. 1)

So the intent of ATSKNF seems pretty clear, right? Botch your Leadership test with your Spess Mahreens and throw the dice again for a second chance. But there's a pretty big problem here: The Morale Test is resolved by rolling a D6 and then adding the number of casualties to obtain the final result which is compared against the unit's base leadership (Leadership 7 or 8 with a Sergeant). But since re-rolls happen before modifiers ATSKNF can never actually be triggered! No matter what you roll on the die, it will be less than the highest Leadership characteristic in the unit and the test will be passed. So no ATSKNF trigger. Then you apply the number of casualties. Then you fail... 

Obviously, this is cannot be how the Game Designers' intended ATSKNF to function, but...

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, Ish said:

So the intent of ATSKNF seems pretty clear, right? Botch your Leadership test with your Spess Mahreens and throw the dice again for a second chance. But there's a pretty big problem here: The Morale Test is resolved by rolling a D6 and then adding the number of casualties to obtain the final result which is compared against the unit's base leadership (Leadership 7 or 8 with a Sergeant). But since re-rolls happen before modifiers ATSKNF can never actually be triggered! No matter what you roll on the die, it will be less than the highest Leadership characteristic in the unit and the test will be passed. So no ATSKNF trigger. Then you apply the number of casualties. Then you fail... 

Obviously, this is cannot be how the Game Designers' intended ATSKNF to function, but...
 

I would argue that modifiers they are talking about are the modifiers to existing morale check. D6+dead models vs leadership is not a modifer, that is the test. The modifier would be things that modify this test, either by modifying the leadership stat or by increasing/decreasing the numbers rolled for the check .

I don't really want to paint them, but there's a nasty CSM list waiting to happen with the night lords legion and a couple of Renegade Knights, where they can generate a pretty fierce -6 or so leadership penalty. Especially against multi-wound + multi-model units, like primaris marines, leadership penalty armies have some scary potential (since you lose models per point you fail morale by, not wounds, and you also can't FNP them away).