Ish Posted January 14, 2019 Report Share Posted January 14, 2019 Most of you probably saw this already, but figured I’d share anyway. Nothing too unexpected: https://www.warhammer-community.com/faqs/ 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted January 15, 2019 Report Share Posted January 15, 2019 Hey folks, Those of you who like to keep up to date on the finer points of Warhammer 40,000 rules will have seen yesterday that we posted a new FAQ and Errata for several books that came out across December. Namely: Chapter Approved, Wrath and Rapture and Vigilius Defiant. As usual, for the most part, these covered questions we’d been sent in about some of the more unusual rules interactions and the odd typo. One of the changes, however, proved slightly controversial. You know the one. The errata published yesterday updated Haarken Worldclaimer’s rules so that, as a Black Legion special character, his abilities worked specifically with the Raptor vanguard of the Black Legion, in line with the studio’s original intent for the character. However, lots of you got in touch yesterday to say that you really liked the idea of him leading a combined force of Raptors for the Legions of the Eye, both from a narrative and rules standpoint. And on reflection, we agree – the idea that Abaddon’s right-hand-Raptor would lead ALL the Raptors of the traitor Legions is pretty cool – so we’re removing that change from the errata. After all, Haarken is the personal herald of the Warmaster who commands Heretic Astartes from all the traitor Legions. So now, Harken’s rules synergise with Raptors of all varieties, and you can use him to spearhead (literally) a charge alongside a raging band of World Eaters jump-troops or add his morale-sapping aura to a Night Lords terror wing. Have fun with the character, Chaos Space Marine fans, and you’d better hurry – Haarken promised Vigilus to the Warmaster, and by our count, he only has 49 days left to deliver. He’d better get a move on… 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted January 15, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2019 Wow. The new GW really is a different company than the old. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 15, 2019 Report Share Posted January 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, Ish said: Wow. The new GW really is a different company than the old. Right! What have they done with the old GW? What ever it is, I hope thrt buried that one deep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted January 15, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2019 19 minutes ago, Lyraeus said: Right! What have they done with the old GW? What ever it is, I hope thrt buried that one deep. At the crossroads outside of town, with a stake through its heart, a mouthful of garlic, and communion wafers over its eyes... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 15, 2019 Report Share Posted January 15, 2019 7 minutes ago, Ish said: At the crossroads outside of town, with a stake through its heart, a mouthful of garlic, and communion wafers over its eyes... You forgot the salted earth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPaceORK Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 They are still the same GW. They just fix mistakes faster, kinda. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 3 hours ago, SPaceORK said: They are still the same GW. They just fix mistakes faster, kinda. I would argue that the way they approach a lot of things are different. They know that you sell more models with honey than vinegar now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewgeddon Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 4 hours ago, SPaceORK said: They are still the same GW. They just fix mistakes faster, kinda. How do you figure? I haven't been playing 40K the longest (started day 1 of 5th ed), but the community engagement didn't even exist back then. The old GW would have out the Vigilus FAQ out 6 months later, and if you didn't like it... too bad! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 4 minutes ago, Andrewgeddon said: How do you figure? I haven't been playing 40K the longest (started day 1 of 5th ed), but the community engagement didn't even exist back then. The old GW would have out the Vigilus FAQ out 6 months later, and if you didn't like it... too bad! Community engagement in 5th was mostly 'Ard Boyz and Cease and Desist notifications. 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Andrewgeddon said: How do you figure? I haven't been playing 40K the longest (started day 1 of 5th ed), but the community engagement didn't even exist back then. The old GW would have out the Vigilus FAQ out 6 months later, and if you didn't like it... too bad! 6 months? That's a very optimistic time frame 😜 pretty sure we never even got some faq's 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewgeddon Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 20 minutes ago, Lyraeus said: 6 months? That's a very optimistic time frame 😜 pretty sure we never even got some faq's Very true! No lie, I just had a Facebook memory today about me complaining about the CSM FAQ that came out like 4 years into the edition. Old GW's solution? Wait until the next edition! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted January 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 51 minutes ago, Andrewgeddon said: Old GW's solution? Wait until the next edition! Which was an acceptable practice in the Nineties when the Internet wasn’t a thing and publishing cycles were lengthy... But it quickly became problematic in the mid-2000’s when internet access became all but ubiquitous. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 3 minutes ago, Ish said: Which was an acceptable practice in the Nineties when the Internet wasn’t a thing and publishing cycles were lengthy... But it quickly became problematic in the mid-2000’s when internet access became all but ubiquitous. We're not talking about the 90's. We're talking about 5 to 10 years ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted January 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 Which would be well into the “it became problematic” period. I’m saying it was something acceptable in the Nineties, something I could put up with in the early 00’s (if only out of inertia), but definitely something annoying in the later 00’s. Post-2010 it was wholly unacceptable for them to continue the old “just figure it out yourself of wait for the next edition” attitude. Compound that with their Cease and Desist letter-writing campaigns, zero social media presence, and indifference (if not hostility) towards fan-organized events and GW was in a bad place 2008-2012. They’ve turned it around and I think it’s worth recognizing. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Ish said: They’ve turned it around and I think it’s worth recognizing. Well they did kick that ceo out, he retired and everyone was excited about that. You know the one who said they were a modeling company not a game company... The new guy definitely deserves his paycheck 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SPaceORK Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 3 hours ago, Andrewgeddon said: How do you figure? I haven't been playing 40K the longest (started day 1 of 5th ed), but the community engagement didn't even exist back then. The old GW would have out the Vigilus FAQ out 6 months later, and if you didn't like it... too bad! Still sell overpriced toys. Still dont know how to write rules and all the problems that come from that. Do they engage with customers now? Absolutely and its amazing. Is GW in a better place than it's ever been? Heck yea! They are more the overly friendly used car salesman now, rather than the drug dealer that knows your going to buy regardless. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted January 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 Baby steps. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewgeddon Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 37 minutes ago, SPaceORK said: Still sell overpriced toys. Still dont know how to write rules and all the problems that come from that. Do they engage with customers now? Absolutely and its amazing. Is GW in a better place than it's ever been? Heck yea! They are more the overly friendly used car salesman now, rather than the drug dealer that knows your going to buy regardless. Fair points! I feel they've been expensive since I started playing, but I will never not complain about $35 single infantry characters, which seem to be all the rage. Can't help but feel that 8th is a massive improvement over 7th or 6th, and as much as I loved 5th, the codex creep was pretty brutal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 50 minutes ago, SPaceORK said: Still sell overpriced toys. Still dont know how to write rules and all the problems that come from that. Do they engage with customers now? Absolutely and its amazing. Is GW in a better place than it's ever been? Heck yea! They are more the overly friendly used car salesman now, rather than the drug dealer that knows your going to buy regardless. They own the market on that. They also produce their own molds and base their prices off what they figure they will sell. Besides your overpriced plastic nets you the enjoyment you put into it 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 They weren't really using Vinegar before. There's no honey now. They just kinda ignored us, and now they kinda interact with us a little. The customer relationship with GW is abusive. They were keeping us in the basement with no contact, now they are interacting with us a little and we're jumping for joy at the little bit of human contact they offer, but it's not a healthy relationship. We've been starved attention so long, any contact, even that from the abuser, is regarded a huge step. Regarding FAQs, we still don't have any formal way to report issues and get responses in an official capacity. They sometimes pay attention to large events and to large gatherings on social media. They're still basically only answering the questions they want to answer and leaving anything else up to vaguely written rules. It's better than it was, but that's not to say it's good, or even at a reasonable level. For cost/profit of the products, the amount of attention they "grace us" with is negligible. We're junkies and they're taking advantage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 51 minutes ago, paxmiles said: They weren't really using Vinegar before. There's no honey now. They just kinda ignored us, and now they kinda interact with us a little. O. O you do know that GW is actually using out of house play testers? They talk to the community, have a podcast now, stream not only in house games but events like LVO. You might be thinking more 7th edition but I got back in because of 8th and the interaction of the warhammer community team. 51 minutes ago, paxmiles said: Regarding FAQs, we still don't have any formal way to report issues and get responses in an official capacity. They sometimes pay attention to large events and to large gatherings on social media. They're still basically only answering the questions they want to answer and leaving anything else up to vaguely written rules. Most all questions get covered and if they find things getting abusive they fix is in the big faq and points fixed in Chapter Approved. For instance they left smash captains alone until they became too abusive then fixed it. In 5th and 6th they would ignored it and not cared about the community. Their fixes come up due to the competitive ayers and what is and is not used. Those cheaper Broadsides and crisis suits you have now are because GW wanted to see those more and had their play testers work things out. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted January 16, 2019 Author Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 GW gives more feedback and interaction with their player base than most gaming companies do. It could be better, sure, but it’s above average in comparison to the rest of the industry. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 2 minutes ago, Lyraeus said: (1) O. O you do know that GW is actually using out of house play testers? They talk to the community, have a podcast now, stream not only in house games but events like LVO. You might be thinking more 7th edition but I got back in because of 8th and the interaction of the warhammer community team. (2) Most all questions get covered and if they find things getting abusive they fix is in the big faq and points fixed in Chapter Approved. For instance they left smash captains alone until they became too abusive then fixed it. In 5th and 6th they would ignored it and not cared about the community. (3) Their fixes come up due to the competitive ayers and what is and is not used. Those cheaper Broadsides and crisis suits you have now are because GW wanted to see those more and had their play testers work things out. Added numbers. 1: For the amount people pay into the game, the amount of attention given is nothing. Go look at another company, rather than comparing GW to earlier incarnations of itself. GW went from being worse than, to being slightly better than, comcast... 2: They didn't resolve it when it came up, they waited for it to be regarded publically as abusive in major tournaments before resolving it. Waiting until the last minute to fix a problem, then fixing it, is still lacking. 3: You say they got cheaper because of play testing. I think they planned to make things cheaper so they could increase sales without creating additional products. Just like how things got cheaper in the index vs the codex. I don't think it was feedback related, I think it was planned. They purposely had less effective units in the indexes, then purposely improved them with the codex, then purposely made some units cheaper in the Chapter Approved, and then again with the next chapter approved. I think certain things may have been adjusted as a result of playtesting, but I think most of the issues are very foreseeable problems. Granted, this assumes GW is a smart business with foresight, but all signs point to that, even if people like to dismiss GW competancy as luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted January 16, 2019 Report Share Posted January 16, 2019 6 minutes ago, paxmiles said: Added numbers. 1: For the amount people pay into the game, the amount of attention given is nothing. Go look at another company, rather than comparing GW to earlier incarnations of itself. GW went from being worse than, to being slightly better than, comcast... 2: They didn't resolve it when it came up, they waited for it to be regarded publically as abusive in major tournaments before resolving it. Waiting until the last minute to fix a problem, then fixing it, is still lacking. 3: You say they got cheaper because of play testing. I think they planned to make things cheaper so they could increase sales without creating additional products. Just like how things got cheaper in the index vs the codex. I don't think it was feedback related, I think it was planned. They purposely had less effective units in the indexes, then purposely improved them with the codex, then purposely made some units cheaper in the Chapter Approved, and then again with the next chapter approved. I think certain things may have been adjusted as a result of playtesting, but I think most of the issues are very foreseeable problems. Granted, this assumes GW is a smart business with foresight, but all signs point to that, even if people like to dismiss GW competancy as luck. What are yoy expecting them? To each customer to have their own individual representative? 1) I don't understand how yoy say next to nothing. This makes no since to me because they have more interaction and work than most other companies. Even Wendy's would be hard pressed to beat them. 2) that's because they resolve things in these dedicated documents that come out what, once a year and have basic explanations and fixes within what 2 weeks? 3? Stop creating an expectation that is impossible to appease. They have to see an issue and see it often to be fixed otherwise it's a knee jerk reaction that could be fixed by the community finding ways around them. Remember, things like chapter approved are finalized months in advance, the Big FAQ takes lots of data to get from various sources. 3) Silly comment as most Tau players have tons of suits any ways. Especially with the start collecting boxes. Next you will say orks only became good so they could sell the new buggies which is asinine as they are crap and need a a point decrease by about 20 to 30% to be worth a look at. Stop using your blinded ideas of what is going on just because you choose not to see the reality. The fact that GW made a change to their own faq the very next days is an amazing improvement and something not many companies would do. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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