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Space Marines new Beta Rule


Lyraeus

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Just now, InfestedKerrigan said:

Also, they don't need legion

No < Legion > keyword, no Legion Trait... Pax was specifically talking about giving them the Iron Warriors’ Legion Trait.

But, as Pax points out, the Rubric Marines in Codex Chaos Space Marines have the < Legion > keyword (p. 133, I double checked myself) whereas the Rubric Marines in Codex Thousand Sons do not have the < Legion > keyword.

This seems like 🐮 to me, like running Ultramarines Wulfen or something, but it’s apparently completely kosher.

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5 minutes ago, Ish said:

That’s some 🐄 💩 right there that is.

 

Not really. The imperium has chaos far outgunned. Just about everything chaos does, imperium can do better and in a more evil way.

Deathwatch already has "special" ammo to boost their intercessor Bolt Rifles to -3 ap.

 

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5 minutes ago, Ish said:

But, as Pax points out, the Rubric Marines in Codex Chaos Space Marines have the < Legion > keyword (p. 133, I double checked myself) whereas the Rubric Marines in Codex Thousand Sons do not have the < Legion > keyword.

This seems like 🐮 to me, like running Ultramarines Wulfen or something, but it’s apparently completely kosher.

It is the first CSM codex to feature the "cult" troops with generic legion options. Berserkers, noise marines, and plague marines all have the <Legion> keyword and are elites (or troops if you are World Eaters or Emperor's Children).

It is notable that the deity keyword (Tzeentch) on the rubric marines prevents them from being fielded with World Eaters or Emperor's Children (which are mono-deity legions).

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Just now, paxmiles said:

Not really. The imperium has chaos far outgunned. Just about everything chaos does, imperium can do better and in a more evil way.

Deathwatch already has "special" ammo to boost their intercessor Bolt Rifles to -3 ap.

I’m looking at it from a “fluff” perspective, not a mechanical one. I agree that vanilla Codex: Chaos Space Marines need a boost mechanically to make them competitive and live up to their “fluff” role as the Big Bad Evil Guys of the setting.

(I say give’em all two Wounds, +1 Attack and +1 Leadership. Make their default kit a boltgun, bolt pistol, chainsword, and grenades. That’d make them more or less on par with Indomitus Crusaders Detachment Veteran Intercessors... and Chaos Space Marines have been doing their thing a heck of a lot longer.)

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4 minutes ago, Ish said:

No < Legion > keyword, no Legion Trait... Pax was specifically talking about giving them the Iron Warriors’ Legion Trait.

But, as Pax points out, the Rubric Marines in Codex Chaos Space Marines have the < Legion > keyword (p. 133, I double checked myself) whereas the Rubric Marines in Codex Thousand Sons do not have the < Legion > keyword.

This seems like 🐮 to me, like running Ultramarines Wulfen or something, but it’s apparently completely kosher.

Nope, it's like Plague Marines. The Black Legion and other Legions have warriors of different aspects. In fsct most chaos sorcerers come from rubrik marines

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5 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

In fsct most chaos sorcerers come from rubrik marines

They come from the Thousand Sons Legion, but are not Rubric Marines. All Rubric Marines are Thousand Sons, not all Thousand Sons are Rubric Marines.

The “Rubric Marines” are the piles of dust in animated suits of armor. The unit is called “Rubric Marines,” but fluff-wise the Aspiring Sorcerer leading the squad is not a Rubric Marine.

Also, Rubric and Rubik aren’t the same word. Just, FYI... Although the idea of evil undead super-soldier armor being piloted by a multicolored cube is amusing.

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11 minutes ago, Ish said:

I’m looking at it from a “fluff” perspective, not a mechanical one. I agree that vanilla Codex: Chaos Space Marines need a boost mechanically to make them competitive and live up to their “fluff” role as the Big Bad Evil Guys of the setting.

Well, if you start reading between the lines of the fluff, the Imperium is the bad guys of the setting. They're the invaders that are attacking everyone else, typically for reasons of races alone, they practice genocide regularly, destroy planets, and so forth.

Chaos isn't good guys either, but "big bad evil guys" of the setting is a title that only the imperium can claim. And, on top of that, CSM are an enemy that most people in the 40k universe can't distinguish from regular SM.

6 minutes ago, Ish said:

They come from the Thousand Sons, not the Rubric Marines. The “Rubric Marines” are the piles of dust in animated suits of armor. The unit is called “Rubric Marines,” but fluff-wise the Aspiring Sorcerer leading the squad is not a Rubric Marine.

Also, Rubric and Rubik aren’t the same word. Just, FYI... Although the idea of evil undead super-soldier armor being piloted by a multicolored cube is amusing.

https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/rubric#Alternative_forms

He's using it right. And I'm pretty sure that GW has alternated between the spelling with a k or a c.

You are correct that the rubric marine sorcerer is not techinically a rubric marine, but he is in that unit.

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3 minutes ago, fluger said:

Orks aren't bad guys, just like lions aren't evil for killing zebras.

Orks are really the least evil faction of the setting. They just want to get drunk and party; they're a bunch of big, green frat boys. They're not *evil.* For that matter, neither are Tyranids, they're just really hangry. 

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1 hour ago, Ish said:

They come from the Thousand Sons Legion, but are not Rubric Marines. All Rubric Marines are Thousand Sons, not all Thousand Sons are Rubric Marines.

The “Rubric Marines” are the piles of dust in animated suits of armor. The unit is called “Rubric Marines,” but fluff-wise the Aspiring Sorcerer leading the squad is not a Rubric Marine.

Also, Rubric and Rubik aren’t the same word. Just, FYI... Although the idea of evil undead super-soldier armor being piloted by a multicolored cube is amusing.

I know, I am adding the k on purpose 

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32 minutes ago, Sgt. Rock said:

Orks are really the least evil faction of the setting. They just want to get drunk and party; they're a bunch of big, green frat boys. They're not *evil.* For that matter, neither are Tyranids, they're just really hangry. 

If you start justifying it, you can find reasons that all the armies aren't evil.

Maybe in the time of Horus the Rebel Alliance that is now the Chaos Space Marines, was an evil faction, but they're now they're just fighting for survival against the tyrannical Imperium which is an unforgiving faction that believes in racial superiority and doesn't accept freedom of religion.

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6 minutes ago, paxmiles said:

If you start justifying it, you can find reasons that all the armies aren't evil.

Maybe in the time of Horus the Rebel Alliance that is now the Chaos Space Marines, was an evil faction, but they're now they're just fighting for survival against the tyrannical Imperium which is an unforgiving faction that believes in racial superiority and doesn't accept freedom of religion.

While I really want to start justifying it, I'm not going to; I don't want to get into an hours-long debate on the politics and theology of a fictional universe that will keep me tied to my computer all day long. 😛

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1 minute ago, Sgt. Rock said:

While I really want to start justifying it, I'm not going to; I don't want to get into an hours-long debate on the politics and theology of a fictional universe that will keep me tied to my computer all day long. 😛

Good call. I don't need that either.

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