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Dusldorf

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Dusldorf last won the day on February 17 2019

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  1. Some more test games are proving that things like the knight or GMNDKs push me too far into an elite style of army, and I just need more bodies to compete against obsec spam. My latest list features a couple of mechanized guard units and Karamazov, whose leadership auras synergize really well with both guard (to prevent failed morale tests) and grey knights (to maximize damage via Purge Soul): he gives Ld11 to every imperial unit within 12", and gives -1 Ld to enemy infantry within 12". Crowe is also a nice cheap body for generating command points and/or completing psyker-related secondary objectives. Finally, I've added a Techmarine Master of the Forge to my Black Templars detachment so that my Invictors (MVPs in quite a few games) can hit better and stick around longer. 2k imperial soup [978] SM patrol (-1cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) warlord refund (+2cp) Strats master of the forge (-1cp) No slot chapter: black templars [100] culexus HQ [100] captain in phobos armor (93), master-crafted instigator bolt carbine (5), camo cloak (2), relic: aurilian shroud [40] techmarine (40), chainsword, warlord, master of the forge, WT: master the machine Troops [70] 5 scouts (70), bolters Elites [165] invictor (135), twin ironhail autocannon, 2 ironhail heavy stubbers (10), heavy bolter (15), fragstorm grenade launcher (5) [165] invictor (135), twin ironhail autocannon, 2 ironhail heavy stubbers (10), heavy bolter (15), fragstorm grenade launcher (5) Heavy [140] thunderfire cannon (85), techmarine gunner (45), plasma cutter (5), flamer (5) [130] 5 devastators (75), 4 grav cannons (40), cherub (5), combi-melta (10), chainsword Transport [68] drop pod (65), storm bolter (3) ==== [310] GK battalion (-3cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) Strats arbiter of the emperor's will (-1cp) No slot [125] inquisitor karamazov, WT: formidable resolve HQ [85] castellan crowe (85), empyrean domination Troops [100] 5 strikes (85), stormbolters (15), staves, purge soul ==== [712] AM patrol (-3cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) Strats tank ace (-1cp) No slot custom regiment: gunnery experts, jury-rigged repairs [100] vindicare (100) HQ [190] tank commander (155), executioner (15), lascannon (20) Troops [50] 10 guardsmen (50), chainsword [52] 10 guardsmen (50), sniper rifle (2), chainsword Heavy [145] manticore (130), heavy flamer (15), tank ace: full payload Transports [85] chimera (65), heavy flamer (15), multilaser (5) [90] taurox (60), 2 autocannons (30) ==== total points: 2000 total units: 19 starting cp: 12 -2 (patrol) +2 (warlord refund) -2 (patrol) -2 (patrol) -3 (strats) = 5
  2. Totally! I'm not an engineer (though I work with plenty) and the difficult process you're describing is what I was trying to allude to by saying "port over". Seeing all the negative reactions to the app, I'm shocked that they didn't just hire the team that makes Battlescribe; if they hadn't considered that, maybe they should now...
  3. October is a bit more than two months away though?
  4. Seems pretty clear cut that they would get hit with double fees then right? After all they're choosing to pursue a freemium pricing model. I think the delay has more to do with outsourced development and needing to port what were originally Android app design assets & architecture into Apple's framework. But who knows 🙂
  5. I've been playing a lot of TTS and iterating on my list. Some of the biggest changes have involved transitioning away from Sisters, since I don't need two different 4+ deny stratagems, and replacing them and Guilliman with Guard and a Knight, respectively. I've also gravitated toward a few scouting units, because in 9th starting the game already in the middle of the board is extremely valuable. While Ultramarines have access to a redeploy strat, my Templars have to rely on sheer resilience in the form of the Aurilian Shroud relic: once per battle round (almost always the first) I get a 4++ on all units within 3" of the bearer until the end of the battle round. This gives my Invictors the resilience they need to survive the heat that they draw away from the knight. Right now I'm 4-1 with an earlier variation on this list (same factions: Guard, Templars, and a knight). This latest variation features the addition of a grav devastator squad, which I added after my recent loss to Death Guard -- one of the best factions in 9th ed. 2k imperial soup [943] SM patrol (-0cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) warlord refund (+2cp) No slot chapter: black templars [100] culexus HQ [100] captain in phobos armor (93), master-crafted instigator bolt carbine (5), camo cloak (2), warlord, WT: frontline commander, relic: aurilian shroud Troops [80] 5 scouts (70), boltguns, combi-melta (10), chainsword Elites [165] invictor (135), twin ironhail autocannon, 2 ironhail heavy stubbers (10), heavy bolter (15), fragstorm grenade launcher (5) [165] invictor (135), twin ironhail autocannon, 2 ironhail heavy stubbers (10), heavy bolter (15), fragstorm grenade launcher (5) Heavy [130] thunderfire cannon (85), techmarine gunner (45) [135] 5 devastators (75), 4 grav cannons (40), cherub (5), combi-melta (10), power axe (5) Transport [68] drop pod (65), storm bolter (3) ==== [490] IK superheavy auxiliary (-5cp) Detachment superheavy auxiliary (-3cp) Strats heirlooms of the household (-1cp) exalted court (-1cp) No slot house: mechanicus freeblade LoW [490] knight crusader (395), thermal cannon (75), ironstorm missile pod (15), heavy stubber (5), heavy flamer (0), WT: ion bulwark, relic: mark of the omnissiah freeblade quality: legendary hero freeblade burdens: exiled in shame, impetuous nature ==== [567] AM patrol (-3cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) Strats tank ace (-1cp) No slot custom regiment: gunnery experts, jury-rigged repairs [100] vindicare HQ [185] tank commander (155), executioner (15), heavy bolter (15) Troops [52] 10 guardsmen (50), sniper rifle (2), chainsword Heavy [145] manticore (130), heavy flamer (15), tank ace: full payload Transport [85] chimera (65), multilaser (5), heavy flamer (15) ==== total points: 2000 total units: 14 starting cp: 12 -2 (patrol) +2 (warlord refund) -2 (patrol) -3 (superheavy auxiliary) -3 (strats) = 4
  6. Just can't open all the doors as easily anymore, which is a good thing imo. Also with that much terrain it'll be tough if not impossible to completely screen off sections of the board.
  7. Today I'm trying out a variation that solves a few of the problems we were discussing. My previous list suffered from some glaring issues: weakness to haywire spam (since every asset except the triumph was a vehicle), vulnerable (read: transport-less) troops, and character taxes; the latter has always been an issue with soup but matters more now because of the way cp work in 9th. I've replaced the GK patrol with a supreme command featuring Guilliman. He gives me bonus cp, removes the need for separate re-roll auras like the Canoness (he even gives re-rolls to the assassins!), and makes my entire army more mobile. The sisters detachment is much leaner without the Canoness, allowing me to afford an Immolator for my precious obsec unit. I've also replaced the Astra Militarum patrol with a patrol of Black Templars. The assault centurions are wicked tough: with the litany of divine protection and the apothecary's relic aura, they'll be rocking a 2+/5++/5+++ base, and once per game I can increase the invul to a 4++ using the Aurilian Shroud; plus, I can heal them twice per turn with the chief apothecary. The Black Templars' mobility stratagems from Faith & Fury are even better in 9th edition since people are swarming the midboard (i.e., I don't have as far to travel), and allow me to advance and charge or even consolidate into combat (i.e., ignoring overwatch!) for 1cp each. I would have liked to include one of the new Judiciars to make an enemy unit fight last, but the Culexus can fill that role: for 2cp, every enemy unit within 3" will fight last and lose any fight first abilities. Finally, the scouts are an extremely useful tax since on turn 1 they can move block, allow me to use a 4+ deny strat by being within range of key psykers, or contribute to key secondaries like Raise the Banners High or Engage On All Fronts. I have quite a bit less long-range shooting than before, and fewer obsec units, but I think this list is better suited to 9th's missions and smaller board size: 2k imperial soup ==== [940] AS patrol (-3cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) Strats heroine in the making (-1cp) No slot conviction: valorous heart [100] culexus (100) HQ [195] triumph of st katherine (195) Troops [85] 5 sisters (55), 2 meltaguns (20), simulacrum imperialis (5), cherub (5), chainsword Elites [45] imagifier (45), WT: beacon of faith, tale of the stoic Heavy support [195] exorcist (150), exorcist missile launcher (30), heavy bolter (15) [195] exorcist (150), exorcist missile launcher (30), heavy bolter (15) Transports [125] immolator (80), immolation flamer (30), heavy bolter (15) ==== [680] SM patrol (-7cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) chapter: black templars Strats master of sanctity (-1cp) chief apothecary (-1cp) 2x hero of the chapter (-2cp) 1x relics of the chapter (-1cp) No slot [100] vindicare (100) HQ [105] chaplain with jump pack (105), master of sanctity, WT: wise orator, relic: aurilian shroud, litanies of the devout: divine protection, fervent acclamation Troops [70] 5 scouts (70), combat blades Elites [60] primaris apothecary (60), chief apothecary, WT: selfless healer, relic: healer's aegis [345] 6 assault centurions (270), 12 flamers (60), 1 hurricane bolter (15, on sergeant), 5 assault launchers (free) ==== [380] SM supreme command (+5cp) Detachment supreme command refund (+2) chapter: ultramarines [380] rowboat gorillaman (380), warlord (+3cp), WT: nobility made manifest ==== total points: 2000 total units: 13 starting cp: 12 -2 (patrol) +2 (warlord refund) -2 (patrol) -6 (strats) +3 (gorillaman) = 7
  8. The GMNDK can fill that role well enough I think, but if it becomes an issue I'll revisit things. Really appreciate the ideas! That's a big part of why I like posting here, to get feedback/criticism. The issue here is that since I'm running soup and start with only 4cp, I'd be dropping to 2cp to do that. I'd really like to stay at 4 if I can, but like I mentioned to Inquisitor66, if this aspect of my build ends up being a liability I'll definitely revisit it.
  9. Chimera is 85 w/ multilaser and heavy bolter now. Immolator is 125 w/ the flamers. I'm trying to find a way to run an Immolator, but it's tough. I want the guard bodies for 1st/2nd turn move blocking or objective stealing, but they also die so quickly that it feels like a trap. I'll keep noodling on it... Yep, and this is fine with me -- Vindicare and Culexus are far and away the better assassins in this edition IMO.
  10. Played my first game of 9th ed yesterday over TTS using the above list; we played No Man's Land (Eternal War Strike Force Mission 4) and my opponent was running Armageddon guard (Emperor's Fist Vigilus battalion) with 50 guardsmen, 4 chimeras, 2 Tank Commanders, a Vulture with twin punishers, a Valkyrie with rocket pods, 2 Hellhounds, 2 Basilisks, 3 Bullgryns, and a Company Commander (maybe a couple odd things I'm forgetting but that's most of it). Some general lessons learned/confirmed: I was a little afraid that 9th's primary objectives would feel lopsided and give players a huge advantage depending on their ability to alpha strike or stick on objectives. But in 9th it seems like both players are on a largely equal playing field in terms of scoring mechanics: both have to survive on objectives for an entire enemy turn before they can score points. This feels really good; it forces you to be aggressive, leads to more tense situations/rolls, and lots more trading of objectives throughout the game. You really can't play a traditional gunline and expect to win. Because staying power is at a premium, transports filled with obsec troops are a huge pain. My opponent got first turn and parked every Chimera and Hellhound in the center of the board; if I managed to kill a transport, the obsec bodies simply spilled onto the objective, making it even harder for me to contest. (Tabletop Titans have been showing off and explaining the strength of this strategy for weeks but experiencing it first hand is a trip.) You need the familiar combination of tank- and troop-killing power PLUS your own obsec units to steal objectives back from your opponent. It's a pretty big shift in incentives for list construction, movement, and target priority. Not all secondaries are created equal. I know this is pretty obvious to anyone who's read the secondary objectives, but it's worth saying because the design behind 9th's secondaries is very different from that of past ITC/Nova/GW secondaries, which seemed like they were designed to put a wide variety of lists on a level playing field. 9th's secondaries are intentionally lopsided (well, at least the ones in the core book -- we'll see what the GT missions look like soon). For example, slay the warlord gives you 6 points if you succeed and that's it...you don't even have the opportunity to get 15 points by killing other characters. In yesterday's game I picked Bring It Down, Thin Their Ranks, and Secure No Man's Land (a unique one attached to the mission), while my opponent picked Abhor the Witch, Engage on All Fronts, and Secure No Man's Land. Mission-specific secondaries like Secure No Man's Land create really interesting choices. Secondaries are chosen in secret before deployment, and if either player chooses not to pick Secure No Man's land, for example, which gives you points at the end of your player turn equal to the current game turn, then they're forgoing any reward for displacing the enemy with their own units. That is, if I had a pure shooting list and wanted to prevent my opponent from scoring this secondary then I could accomplish that by shooting him off the center objective each turn, but I actually have close combat threats that I want to use in the midboard as well; if I don't pick this secondary then I'm forgoing the points I would have accumulated from their presence after killing/outnumbering my opponent. Overall it's an interesting dilemma that also depends on lists/terrain, but I think most balanced lists will get more benefit from choosing this secondary (and ones like it) than from passing on it. Some takeaways about my list: Crowe can't actually use the 1cp strat to extend the range of his psychic powers since he doesn't have the Rites of Banishment ability. Oh well, back to the drawing board. Despite the fact that I pulled out the win on turn 5, I feel like my list didn't have enough close combat punch. I struggled too long to kill the transports that swarmed the middle of the board. This would also be a problem against Custodes, Centurion-heavy lists, Lord of Skull lists, etc. Strike squads are cool, and the purge soul + inquisitor combo worked well, but they die to a stiff breeze. These takeaways in mind, I've swapped Crowe and two Strike squads for a Grand Master in Nemesis Dreadknight. This puts me up to six highly durable assets, two of which (it and the Triumph) have big melee potential; whereas the Triumph excels in melee against hordes, this guy will be better at assaulting vehicles and the like. Here's the updated list: 2k imperial soup [682] AM battalion (-2cp) Detachment battalion (-3cp) warlord (+3cp) Strats vigilus: emperor's fist (-1cp) tank ace (-1cp) No slot doctrine: gunnery experts, jury-rigged repairs [100] culexus HQ [190] tank commander (155), heavy bolter (15), battlecannon (20), tank ace: master mechanic, relic: hammer of sunderance (free) [205] tank commander (155), heavy bolter (15), punisher (35), tank ace: master mechanic [37] company commander (35), bolt pistol (2), chainsword, warlord Troops [50] 10 guardsmen [50] 10 guardsmen [50] 10 guardsmen ==== [882] AS patrol (-4cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) Strats open the reliquaries (-1cp) arbiter of the emperor's will (-1cp) No slot conviction: valorous heart [65] ordo hereticus inquisitor (60), inferno pistol (5), chainsword (free), psyker, terrify, relic: blackshroud, WT: formidable resolve HQ [60] canoness (50), blessed blade (10), bolt pistol, relic: wrath of the emperor [195] triumph of st katherine (195) Troops [55] 5 sisters (55), chainsword Elites [45] imagifier (45), tale of the stoic Fast Attack [72] 5 dominions (60), 4 stormbolters (12) Heavy support [195] exorcist (150), exorcist missile launcher (30), heavy bolter (15) [195] exorcist (150), exorcist missile launcher (30), heavy bolter (15) ==== [435] GK patrol (-2cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) No slot [100] vindicare HQ [250] grand master nemesis dreadknight (180), gatline psilencer (20), heavy psycannon (25), greathammer (15), teleporter (10), sanctuary Troops [85] 5 strikes (85), halberds, purge soul ==== total points: 1999 total units: 18 starting cp: 12 -3 (battalion) +3 (warlord refund) -2 (patrol) -2 (patrol) -4 (strats) = 4
  11. Yeah, sorry, I don't mean to make light of what's obviously a [big bad swear word]ty situation for horde players. Just pointing out that game duration is one small ray of sunshine in that regard.
  12. Oof. 10 Gretchen costing 50pts has to hurt, too.
  13. (Wasn't sure where to reply, in your thread or mine :P) The lower model count is a big deal for sure, but then again with only 5 turns you don't need to last quite as long.
  14. The punisher and ample storm bolters are the obvious answers to horde lists, but Crowe is the sleeper pick. He's a new budget choice for me because of 9th's sweeping point increases, but he excels against both hordes and tough characters: with a d6 smite and inner fire, he does an average of 5-6 mortal wounds for 1cp (to extend his powers' range by 6" for the phase), and in combat he can get up to 24 attacks (6 + extras for each successful wound roll + auto fight again on death).
  15. After much noodling before points dropped today, plus some additional cuts/edits once they did, I settled on a list with which to start playing games of 9th ed. I've always liked soup for the utility options it provides; this list may not deliver the strongest board control, or shooting, or mobility, but it can do all three competitively, and it's designed to take all comers. A couple of combos that are worth pointing out: The inquisitor and GK strike squads: the former's warlord trait gives me a 12" radius Ld 10 bubble that buffs the Purge Soul power, plus I can Terrify a unit to give them an additional -1 Ld. Against otherwise tough units like Riptides, suddenly each strike squad is doing up to 7 mortal wounds on the turn it drops in. Taking three detachments lets me start each game with both a Culexus and a Vindicare. Basically I'm getting extra value out of my third detachment, since I'll rarely if ever have to pay 2cp to swap either of these assassins for a Callidus or Eversor. (As a side note, the Callidus' cp tax ability feels much less valuable in 9th ed because everyone gains 1cp at the start of each turn; if I can't deplete someone's cp pool early, or force them to make really tough choices, then I'm not as into it.) Here's the list: 2k imperial soup (AM, AS, GK) [680] AM battalion (-2cp) Detachment battalion (-3cp) warlord (+3cp) Strats vigilus: emperor's fist (-1cp) tank ace (-1cp) No slot doctrine: gunnery experts, jury-rigged repairs [100] culexus HQ [190] tank commander (155), heavy bolter (15), battlecannon (20), tank ace: master mechanic, relic: hammer of sunderance (free) [205] tank commander (155), heavy bolter (15), punisher (35), tank ace: master mechanic [35] company commander (35), chainsword, laspistol, warlord Troops [50] 10 guardsmen [50] 10 guardsmen [50] 10 guardsmen ==== [880] AS patrol (-4cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) Strats open the reliquaries (-1cp) arbiter of the emperor's will (-1cp) No slot conviction: valorous heart [63] ordo hereticus inquisitor (60), storm bolter (3), chainsword, psyker, terrify, relic: blackshroud, WT: formidable resolve HQ [60] canoness (50), blessed blade (10), bolt pistol, wrath of the emperor [195] triumph of st katherine (195) Troops [55] 5 sisters (55), chainsword Elites [45] imagifier (45), tale of the stoic Fast attack [72] dominions (60), 4 storm bolters (12) Heavy support [195] exorcist (150), exorcist missile launcher (30), heavy bolter (15) [195] exorcist (150), exorcist missile launcher (30), heavy bolter (15) ==== [440] GK patrol (-2cp) Detachment patrol (-2cp) No slot [100] vindicare HQ [85] castellan crowe (85), inner fire Troops [85] 5 strikes (85), halberds, purge soul [85] 5 strikes (85), halberds, purge soul [85] 5 strikes (85), halberds, purge soul ==== total points: 2000 total units: 20 starting cp: 12 -3 (battalion) +3 (warlord refund) -2 (patrol) -2 (patrol) -4 (strats) = 4
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