Tamwulf

I am kinda worrying and fretting as it's 11 October, and we still have no idea when this is going to be, how many points, rules, etc. etc. Please don't drop the website on us a week before the tournament! Some of us have to make arrangements for work, get a hotel or place to stay, etc. etc. Can you at least confirm it's Oct 29th-30th? Can you at least tell us how many points (1850)? Anything on Detachments and Allies? Scenarios? I'm just thinking I'd like to get a couple practice games in, and not knowing anything at all about how to write my army is a bit frustrating. We also only have 18 days until Oct 29-30th. Dropping a big name tournament packet like this only two weeks out will hurt attendance.

LOL someone that posted in this very thread ripped me a new one for saying 40K is going to be Sig-marized next year with a new edition, and now this post and everyone is all "Oh, hey! Look what's happening! Woooo!"

How many points is the Mournghoul? Where is his Warscroll? Also, you really want to win, eh? I'm just a bit put off by seeing this list. I have no chance at all of winning against such a list, and as a matter of fact, I'd have an incredible amount of "unfun" seeing so many models brought back every turn, all the wounds I inflict being healed, all your rerolls to hit and wound, all the auto wounds... yeah, this list would just suck to face.

That means if 3 of your guys die, you have to pass a Leadership Test at the beginning of every turn or you lose the game. Taking objectives will be extremely difficult for you. Just saying games could be difficult for you against Xeno armies.

If I'm understanding this correctly, for a pitched battle with an army of all Ironjawz warscrolls: I'm Destruction for the Grand Alliance, meaning I get the Battle Trait, Command Trait, and Artifact Trait of Destruction. My army allegiance is Ironjawz, so certain warscrolls listed in the Generals Handbook, can be taken as Battleline units. I also get all the army wide benefits from belonging to Ironjawz for my army. Now, what happens if I add a couple warscrolls that are Destruction, but not Ironjawz? I can still be Destruction, but my army is no longer Ironjawz, so I lose the Battleline Ironjawz units. However, all my other Ironjawz warscrolls are still Ironjawz for abilities (except the non-Ironjawz warscrolls). ??

It looks like I can't field an entire army of Ironjawz in a Pitched Battle and use the Allegiance Destruction abilities. Ironjawz only have Battleline units when you declare Ironjawz Allegiance. If I'm reading the Generals Handbook FAQ correctly, you select one Allegiance, and that's your Allegiance for the battle. Does that mean you "lose" the other keywords? Really sucks that I'm gonna have to pick up a couple units of non-Ironjawz models to fill in my Battleline units for Pitched Battles for Destruction.

If it's all Failcast or Finecrap, I'll pass. If it's plastic then awesome. Nice to see GW becoming more and more customer friendly again. I shudder to think how much this service will cost. And the amount of time an order will take to process and then actually be made. GW charges a lot for shipping. I can totally see GW rotating what they offer, as in limiting what they will make for say, a couple weeks. I doubt they have the facilities or the manpower to pull the molds out of storage, and then cast 100 Sisters of Battle (someone will do it...) along with a single Empire Rifleman #2. Just one. And then someone else will request 23 old Ork Nobs, and a single Imperial Preacher with P-fist. Yeah... initial demand will be fairly large, and this whole process could be very labor intensive. It would seem GW wants to reduce it's standing inventory- product on the shelves is not making the company money, and takes up space. Not to mention when it comes to tax time, that excess inventory... whew. The old Bitz Wagon was awesome, as was the time when you could buy bitz from GW. Returning to this service seems like a no-brainer, as long as you can get the bitz you want. I'd rather have a Bitz Service then have them make a model on demand for me.

I'm not sold on an extra shot the turn something deepstrikes. Yes, it could be powerful, but... you still have to put something on the table turn 1. The Gladius Strike Force gives you free points...

I wasn't aware of it until I saw a thread at the Dakka Dakka AoS forum and not really paying much attention to my General's Handbook that there is a whole section on Grand Allegiances Abilities (Order, Chaos, Death, and Destruction). I knew there was Command Traits and Artifacts, but the bit I missed was Battle Traits. Each of the Allegiances have special abilities as long as your entire army can claim that allegiance. For Destruction (aka Ironjawz), any unit within 8" of your General or another Hero may move an extra d6" in the Hero Phase, but may not run in the movement phase. This movement has no other restrictions on anything the unit may do later in the turn. Basically, the one thing that was really holding my Ironjawz back was the 4" movement. Now, I get an extra d6" in the Hero Phase. So now my army can move d6+4"+2d6" charge, or 7"-22" in a turn! If it's my 'Ardboys, they get even more movement with the Drummer. The Cavalry (Gore-Gruntas) are speed 9", meaning 12"-27"! Truely, the Ironjawz are a massive, rolling juggernaut of destruction! Anyone else find any cool little things like that about their army now with the General's Handbook?

<--- This guy, and any other Veteran of the Military. They taught me how to iron, polish shoes, make a bed, wash laundry, wash dishes, clean my room... you know, all the stuff that most kids don't know how to do now? Yeah, not sure what Gee Dub is thinking about this mat. Several other companies out there make 4x4, but some will make 4x6 too. Frontline Gaming comes to mind. /shrug

Every Sunday at Guardian Games a small group of people have been showing up to play (around 6-10 people I think). I'm not sure how "casual" they are, as I've seen some pretty brutal lists and really shying away from playing with them. But they do seem to meet up regularly to play. X-Wing seems to be one of those games that is either hot or cold. When it's hot, you get a ton of people show up to play, and after a bit, they stop playing and the game goes cold. I have a hypothesis why, and maybe someday I'll research it, but I have so many other irons in the fire right now... I'd expect it to pick back up around the Holidays when Rogue One comes out and people get bit by the Star Wars bug again. Someone mentioned to me a Portland area Facebook page for X-wing, so maybe a bunch of people stopped posting here and have been using Facebook?

"this is not a games day per se". But are we not all showing up with our little plastic and metal toy soldiers to play make believe war? And don't we play games to have fun? So let's have some fun! Right now, your tournament is no different from any of a hundred others I have ever been to. The only difference is you cap the number of players that can bring a certain army. Secondary objectives revealed after the game starts- do you have some random table with 100 thrilling objectives such as "Make a 12" charge" or "hold Objective 3 for two turns!" or "Fight a challenge this round!" How is that any different from Tactical Objectives or Mysterious Objectives? Its not, because every veteran player has played that style of 40K over the last two years. It's stale, it's boring, and no one will remember it because that's whats expected. You have a fantastic opportunity to actually make a tournament that everyone will remember because it will be so different from what everyone else has already played in. Otherwise, the 6th Elvensword Ambassadorial Tournament will be just like the five Elvensword Ambassadorial Tournaments before it, and the same as every other 40K tournament out there and the only thing people will remember is that they didn't get to play the army they wanted to because Bob registered his army first, and that a three Wraith Knight list won last year. Shake up the status quo, make your tournament unique and something everyone will remember and have fun at.

Yes, I mean Detachment in the vein of a Combined Arms Detachment. Make one for the tournament- call it "Ambassador Detachment" and give it it's own rules. Possibilities include: - Anytime you score a Victory Point, score +1 VP - You can re-roll all the dice for one roll once per game (like re-roll all the to hit rolls of a shooting attack, or re-roll an invulnerable save). You still can't re-roll a re-roll. To use this ability, the player must make a short speech detailing why he is making the reroll and how it will help his faction. "In the Name of the Emperor, we MUST make our armor saves to preserve the foundation and way of life for Humanity in the Galaxy!" or some such. Make it fun! - Anytime you fight a Challenge, you may declare a "Diplomatic Solution": Instead of fighting a close combat, each model in the challenge makes a Special Leadership Test unaffected by Fearless or any abilities: The model that passes the Leadership Test AND rolls the lowest wins the Diplomatic Solution: The losing model must be removed from the table as he takes the "Diplomatic Proposal" back to HQ. You may use Heroic Intervention to remove another model instead (you've selected a courier to take the message back). The winner of the Diplomatic Solution wins the Challenge and the loser MUST make a fall back move, even if they have a special rule that says they never fall back. The power of Diplomacy! - Select one HQ Character from your army, but not your Warlord: This model is your Ambassador to the enemy: He gains the Independent Character ability, and becomes a friendly model to BOTH players, but may never shoot or fight in close combat. This model must join the enemy Warlord and stay within coherency with him, and if the enemy Warlord starts in reserve, the Ambassador joins his unit and comes in with him. Thereafter, the model must always stay within coherency of the enemy Warlord, but does not count as a model for transport capacity or restrictions for movement/special abilities. Once per game, at the beginning of the enemy turn before Reserves are rolled, the Ambassador may use "Lend me your ear". If the Ambassador passes a Leadership Test, he has gained the attention of the enemy Warlord, and the Enemy Warlord and any unit he has joined, may not move, shoot, charge or use any special rules/abilities, as they listen to what the Ambassador has to say. If they are locked in close combat, they immediately fall back 2d6" (and the enemy unit may only consolidate d3") to listen to the Ambassador. At the end of the turn, the enemy Warlord may roll a Leadership test (Fearless or automatically passing LD tests do not apply): If he passes, he takes the Ambassador prisoner and scores an extra victory point. If he fails, the Ambassador is recalled. In both cases, remove the Ambassador from the table. The Detachment itself would be: Compulsory: 2 HQ (one Warlord, one Ambassador), 1 Elite (must be an "honor guard" for one of you HQ's), and 2 Troops. Optional: 1 HQ, 4 Troops, 2 Elites, 3 Fast Attack, 3 Heavy Support, 1 Fortification, 1 Lord of War. If your Ambassador survives to the end of the game, you gain +1 VP. The compulsory elite choice must be a Command Squad, Honor Guard, etc. for the Warlord, (all Generals are surrounded by a staff of people...). If the army does not have such a unit available, then you must take an elite unit to represent such a squad. During the tournament, you can have a "Diplomatic Conclave" consisting of only the Ambassadors from your army. Set up all the Ambassadors from the tournament on one table. Randomly select one to be the Speaker, and another to be the Master of Arms. Set these two models in front of all the others. Then, randomly select a player. They may attempt to debate the Speaker, or fight the Master of Arms: To debate the Speaker, each player rolls 2d6 and adds their Leadership: The player that rolls highest wins the debate, scores +1 VP, and becomes the new Speaker. If you fight the Master of Arms, both players immediately fight a Challenge: The winner of the challenge scores +1 VP and becomes the new Master of Arms. Any ties in both the Debate or Challenge ends the player's turn, and both players score +1 VP, but the Speaker or Master of Arms stays the same. At the same time, you can use this as an opportunity to judge the best Ambassador model that best represents their army as another special prize for the tournament.

Massive model that comes with a massive price: About $975. /whistle I'm starting to see a trend from Forge World: Rhino -> Land Raider -> Land Raider Spartan -> Mastodon Drop Pod -> Legion Dreadnought Drop Pod -> Legion Anvilius Dreadclaw Drop Pod -> Legion Kharybdis Assault Claw Storm Raven -> Storm Eagle -> Thunderhawk -> Sokar Pattern Stormbird Dreadnought -> Contemptor Dreadnought -> Contemptor Cortus Dreadnought -> Deredeo Dreadnought -> Leviathan Pattern Siege Dreadnought I wish I had more money to spend at Forge World!

Is that a TL Autocannon on the turret and a heavy stubber on the pintle mount?

This is true, but when you get locked into CC with a Dread, it's nice to know that you have a chance. And sometimes you go up against something that has a high Toughness that your Bolters will have a hard time wounding. It's nice to have at least a chance of wounding something.

I want to get a couple more games in with the DW and I actually want to try out Harlequins.

Wahoo! 8", S6 AP4 assault1 incoming! Or maybe 8" S3 AP - Assault 1 BLAST! People always forget about grenades.

Awesome! Thanks Sam. I've been busy assembling and painting for the big 30K Megabattle and haven't made it up for any more games. I'll see about making it up on Tuesday (4 Oct).

Because in their opinion, BA and DA are a "minor variant" that represents the Space Marines. The Space Wolves are apparently divergent enough that they get their own slot. I like the idea of an Ambassador Tournament. Maybe with a unique CAD for just this tournament?

OK... if the IG and Genestealer Cult are Allies of Convenience, they will still not be able to use a Baneblade in a Detachment together. Remember, Allies of Convenience is that the ally is still an enemy model. They can't benefit from each others abilities, can't move within 1" of each other (people always forget that one...), etc. etc. You'll have a detachment of GSC, and a detachment of IG or Bugs, but they won't be able to use each others abilities or vehicles, and will have some pretty big limitations toward each other on the battlefield. Might be a moot point if I set up a unit of Basiliks in the back corner of the table and never move them, but... LOL Have any of the formations been leaked yet? Those I suspect will be very interesting.

I said DA are awful because anything they can do, another army can do better. Even Brandon in his commentary said that he lacked a lot of things other armies get, and that it was his practice and experience along with having a game plan before every game that saw him through. His army did nothing well, but it could do everything in a passable fashion. He listed several hard counters to his list, but from looking at the armies he faced in the tournament, he never faced any of them. This is a bit surprising, as such lists tend to be plentiful in larger tournaments. He never faced a Marine Skyhammer Force, never saw Warpspider Spam, or fought a Tau list, never fought a Deathstar, and didn't face a Necron list. He was a good player and knew his army and went into every game with a plan. He did face a Cabal Star, which could have been terrifying if his opponent rolled the right psychic powers, or just a very over priced unit of Chaos Sorcerer. Hard to tell. Again, I'd love to see the lists of the opponents he faced. He never had a bad match up. My assertion was more about if you go all DA infantry, another army does that better. If you go all Ravenwing Bikes, White Scars do it better. If you go all Deathwing, Ultramarines or Space Wolves do it better. Flyers? Other armies have better flyers. The DA are outclassed in every single mono category. When they are used in a comprehensive fashion and the right formation, they become equal to a lot of armies. The disadvantages are still there, it's just that they are now mitigated somewhat by play style, experience, and practice. The list was complicated, and a very much "All Comers List" that he practiced with and knew very well. He had a plan for every game, and executed that plan. He never "winged it" (get it? LOL Sorry, couldn't resist) and very much used probabilities and statistics to measure the expected performance of his army vs. his opponents army. Any player that does that with any army will do well. I do agree that Black Knights are a pivotal unit for DA, and all the "successful" lists of DA I have seen include at least 1-2 units of them. If DA become the new "meta"- awesome! Just means people will adapt, change their own lists, and then the DA will be replaced by another successful army and a new "meta" will emerge. What will be fun is playing all those DA players that will now be "Net Listing" this army. Fun times ahead!

Armorcast! Thanks, I was racking my brain trying to remember that name. LOL They are still in business making stuff too.

I guess we'll find out when the codex drops, eh? This could purely be a marketing campaign to sell more models. Remember, in Unbound Lists you can take anything, and GW considers Unbound to be the de facto way to play 40K. So of course they want you to buy a Baneblade! And just because you can't use the Baneblade in a CAD for Genestealer Cults doesn't mean that you can't play an Unbound army...

Jinking would not affect Brandon's Lion's Blade force at all, as he had no units in it that could jink. The bikes and speeder were in the Ravenclaw formation. And being blind is such a rare thing- I can think of a psychic power that does it, and maybe a grenade from Grey Knights/Witch Hunters? Oh, and some Eldar weapon that no one ever takes too. I'm not sure on that one. I would think the real weakness is the inability to really do anything in close combat. The list is 100% shooty, with nothing in close combat. Though it has a lot of units, and the inability to consolidate into close combat anymore really hurts assault based armies (not to mention overwatch at BS 4... LOL). If you could make it, and engage enough of his units at once, I think the list would have fallen. The question is, what kind of list? An infantry heavy list of Orks or Bugs maybe? Or a smaller, elite force, like maybe Deathwatch? It would have been very interesting to see the lists of the people he faced. I know he faced at least one Daemon player- but I wonder if it had a Greater Daemon of Khorne or Nurgle in it? Or I wonder how well it would have done against a massed Cultist-spam army? I was surprised that he won against the Imperial Knight list, until I realized that the Knights wouldn't be able to take objectives, and with 10+ units, Brandon's list would be very adept at taking objectives. About the Tau being "non-competitive"- it's because ITC has pretty much locked down and nerfed any real cheese that the Tau can bring to the table. Everyone was so scared of multiple Riptides when in reality, they turned out to be a paper tiger. Stormsurges are pretty awesome, but again, ITC has locked those down tight. Multiple units firing overwatch sounds great, but it's still only BS 1. Maybe higher if you get lucky with the right wargear/markerlights/etc. ITC really nerfed Coordinated Firepower from the Detachment, but it's perfectly OK to be able to get free transports for all your MEQ units. LOL I still think Tau are a solid, competitive army, but people have learned how to deal with them.