5 reasons why list rating does not work, #4 will shock you!

[happycamper]

3 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

Congratulations on your quest to "free"OFCC generals to be completely uninhibited in their list as long as they can shame their captain into allowing it.  Congrats man.  Your unicorn is just dead sexy.  Lol

Why are you even here? You bring nothing positive to conversation... 

[InfestedKerrigan]

6 minutes ago, happycamper said:

Why are you even here? You bring nothing positive to conversation... 

Hey meow, as much as I avidly disagree with LH on restricting things, he brings a mindset that is active in the greater community. Sadly.

[InfestedKerrigan]

Thankfully, we are seeing players get over their fear of the bomb.

[happycamper]

Just now, InfestedKerrigan said:

Hey meow, as much as I avidly disagree with LH on restricting things, he brings a mindset that is active in the greater community. Sadly.

He’s fine to have his opinions.  It’s the activity undermining a Ordo Event I have issue.

[happycamper]

Just now, happycamper said:

He’s fine to have his opinions.  It’s the activity undermining a Ordo Event I have issue.

Telling people not to go unless they are master painted is just utterly ridiculous.  It’s false take, considering the event isn’t based on “winning”.  

[Raindog]

 

In the grand world of the game, there are many ways to play and many places to play. Some people prefer the garage with their good friends. Some like to push the limit of the rules to face stomp their opponents. At Ordo, we like sportsmanship and hobbists. We don't mind losing, but we want it to be a fun game at the hands of an opponent we would gladly play again. We want community builders, not hobby killers. If our style is not yours, go create your own community. We've spent almost 18 years making this one.  When you have run over a decade of 40 man tournaments, let us know what works for you. 

[Lord Hanaur]

1 hour ago, happycamper said:

This times a million.  Activity telling people not to go hurts the club, the event, etc... can’t help but take it a bit personal when someone is undermining the event to get people not to go simply because of a warped view on of all things “painting score”?! Caring how something is scored while at the same time wanting a non competitive event is just backwards thinking.  

Sorry to come out aggressive in this but it really pisses me off.  Don’t enjoy it, fine don’t go nothing wrong with that at all, it’s not for everyone.  But actively sabotaging it by discouraging people from going is just hurtful to the club and the community 

(not aimed at you munkie lol)

You're intentionally misrepresenting my point about painting, or you're just not understanding.  Can't tell and now I don't care.  

I support the OFCC mission.  We're talking implementation.  We disagree on it.  Evil_Bryan fixed what I'm talking about (as regards paint) BECAUSE it was wrong.  So clearly he agreed about the implementation.  Clearly.  So unless you think him wrong for fixing it, then you find me equally right about disliking what happened before he did.

He also deleted composition which was absolutely core to OFCC forever.  That I valued it is not remotely strange.  What IS strange is the 180 on it.  So he went out of his way to post a discussion starter about it; and here we are.  Talking about it.

 

[SPaceORK]

Why is there even any discussion about lists? 

Isn't OFCC about rolling dice, drinking, hanging out with friends and looking at cool models?

With no actual winner, who cares who brings what?

I have a difficult time turning off the competitivness so OFCC probably isn't for me. But if I did go I would make sure my models looked good and my list was good enough to put up a fight.

And I think that's what everyone does at this event, no?

[Lord Hanaur]

1 hour ago, happycamper said:

Why are you even here? You bring nothing positive to conversation... 

...Says the guy attacking me for LIKING OFCC 's tradition?  Why are you?

[happycamper]

3 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

You're intentionally misrepresenting my point about painting, or you're just not understanding.  Can't tell and now I don't care.  

I support the OFCC mission.  We're talking implementation.  We disagree on it.  Evil_Bryan fixed what I'm talking about (as regards paint) BECAUSE it was wrong.  So clearly he agreed about the implementation.  Clearly.  So unless you think him wrong for fixing it, then you find me equally right about disliking what happened before he did.

He also deleted composition which was absolutely core to OFCC forever.  That I valued it is not remotely strange.  What IS strange is the 180 on it.  So he went out of his way to post a discussion starter about it; and here we are.  Talking about it.

 

I’m not saying you can’t have a discussion about it or your wrong in having your opinions.

the problem I have you is literally stated you tell people not to go to our event.  That is called undermining the club and it’s goal.  It does harm to the clubs abilty to host OFCC again next year.

[SPaceORK]

3 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

...Says the guy attacking me for LIKING OFCC 's tradition?  Why are you?

So I don't know you, have had almost zero interaction with you, but you never seem positive about things? Maybe that's what he's getting at? 

It's always "knights don't belong in 40k" and "fw is evil". And you just stated you tell people only come to the OFCC if they can paint well. Now I'm embellishing things a bit here, but that's what I've seen. And that doesn't help the group as a whole at all.

[Munkie]

1 hour ago, happycamper said:

This times a million.  Activity telling people not to go hurts the club, the event, etc...

(not aimed at you munkie lol)

Wait, if posts that quote me and begin with "this times a million" are not inherently a show of support, then I've been internetting wrong. Of course it wasn't aimed at me! 

And if it was, then I'd come at you like...well... like a spider munkie! 

1 hour ago, Lord Hanaur said:

Congratulations on your quest to "free"OFCC generals to be completely uninhibited in their list as long as they can shame their captain into allowing it.  Congrats man.  Your unicorn is just dead sexy.  Lol

I....wait... what? Let me get this straight. You read this: 

3 hours ago, VonVilkee said:

I definitely had to campaign a bit to build my team this year but I stuck to it emphasized event not tournament and that you have to experience it before you can truly compete overall. 

I feel super successful as the whole team is already talking about next year and now they get it, not to mention the Marshall Johnson. The ofcc celebrates many aspects all at once in a team/ club format. We will be doing more spirit wise now that the typical tournament focus has been truly lifted. Some on the team wanted to believe this unicorn I was selling existed but were sceptical, they have been made believers thank you for the assist ordo!

... which doesn't mention lists at all, and took that to mean VonVilkee (the team captain) convinced his team (which I was a part of, and can assure you your theory is wildly off) to take whatever lists they wanted and then shame him into allowing it???

Does the sentence "I give you permission to shame me into giving you permission" make sense to you?

Because I'm confused. And a little annoyed, if I'm honest. That's my quarterback!

 

[Lord Hanaur]

3 minutes ago, happycamper said:

I’m not saying you can’t have a discussion about it or your wrong in having your opinions.

the problem I have you is literally stated you tell people not to go to our event.  That is called undermining the club and it’s goal.  It does harm to the clubs abilty to host OFCC again next year.

I dont think you ARE okay with me having an opinion unless it's the same one.  You don't sound like it at all.

People go or dont go no matter what I say.  That's the reality.  If you want them to love this event, it will be loved on its merits.  

You can have a cloistered yes-man society or you can have a real one.  If it's tough to fill the event, it will be because of the event.  If it's easy to fill, it will be because...of the event.  

My opinion is very positive towards composition at OFCC. It has been a defining characteristic.  I am sorry that it is such a chore for the people who did it.  All I can say is:  thank you all for doing it thanklessly, and please advocate to keep the sanity in list design.  You can diminish me or attack me for wanting the best possible event.  But that is the source of my commentary.  You dont agree, but my commentary is to encourage not just a reunion atmosphere but a reunion atmosphere that makes the newest player feel like hes not just going to "another ITC level thing".  

 

[pretre]

15 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

He also deleted composition which was absolutely core to OFCC forever. 

 

I think you might be incorrect about some of your word usage here. 🙂

[Lord Hanaur]

3 minutes ago, Munkie said:

Wait, if posts that quote me and begin with "this times a million" are not inherently a show of support, then I've been internetting wrong. Of course it wasn't aimed at me! 

And if it was, then I'd come at you like...well... like a spider munkie! 

I....wait... what? Let me get this straight. You read this: 

... which doesn't mention lists at all, and took that to mean VonVilkee (the team captain) convinced his team (which I was a part of, and can assure you your theory is wildly off) to take whatever lists they wanted and then shame him into allowing it???

Does the sentence "I give you permission to shame me into giving you permission" make sense to you?

Because I'm confused. And a little annoyed, if I'm honest. That's my quarterback!

 

Again you misread me.  Assumedly on purpose

[pretre]

So, how many pages of LH ignoring the fact that people really have a problem with him telling people not to go and not any of the side issues are we going to have?

[Lord Hanaur]

4 minutes ago, pretre said:

So, how many pages of LH ignoring the fact that people really have a problem with him telling people not to go and not any of the side issues are we going to have?

My original post.

I agree completely with the difficulties that were laid out in the original post by evil_bryan.  Not one point of disagreement

I acknowledge that its difficult, but I think that you can go to any tournament and get the same spread of "okay that wasn't so bad" and the "Good lord, does that man have no SOUL" type lists that you get at OFCC when there is no rating.

I valued the hard work people did on ratings.  We mostly shot for lower rated armies anyways and always had themes that were necessarily restrictive but, well, themed.  We did Rolling thunder where all things had to be on servos or in a transport.  We did hordes with no less than 120 models.  We did all Tau with Stealthsuits and Everyone had to feature Stingwings. And so on.  We knew it was hard work to grade these, but we were appreciative that they did.

We didn't really consider going this year. or last year.  It wasn't a protest or anything dramatic like that.  It's just that the event sort of (by which I mean 100% exactly) turned into a painting contest the last year we went; and now list rating which was what made it special, is gone (and had in fact kind of been gone for all practical purposes before that because of the crazy stuff people wanted to allow).

I for one definitely miss the spirit of the event.  The people have almost always been fun.  But that would have happened without OFCC.  What OFCC brought was a different set of rules that made the games more fun intrinsically, instead of simply relying on a great guy to continue to be a great guy which he was probably going to be anyways.

I tell people about OFCC all the time, but now I just tell them "don't go if you aren't a world class painter.  The cost is pretty high and it's pretty much the lists you always see at any lower priced event."  Saying that makes me super sad.

[Munkie]

2 minutes ago, pretre said:

So, how many pages of LH ignoring the fact that people really have a problem with him telling people not to go and not any of the side issues are we going to have?

If I were a gif locating man, I'd be locating an "At least one more, Miss Swann" Orlando Bloom gif.

That's what I would be doing. If i were a gif locating man.

[Lord Hanaur]

2 minutes ago, Munkie said:

If I were a gif locating man, I'd be locating an "At least one more, Miss Swann" Orlando Bloom gif.

That's what I would be doing. If i were a gif locating man.

Context>gif's

[SPaceORK]

2 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

My original post.

I agree completely with the difficulties that were laid out in the original post by evil_bryan.  Not one point of disagreement

I acknowledge that its difficult, but I think that you can go to any tournament and get the same spread of "okay that wasn't so bad" and the "Good lord, does that man have no SOUL" type lists that you get at OFCC when there is no rating.

I valued the hard work people did on ratings.  We mostly shot for lower rated armies anyways and always had themes that were necessarily restrictive but, well, themed.  We did Rolling thunder where all things had to be on servos or in a transport.  We did hordes with no less than 120 models.  We did all Tau with Stealthsuits and Everyone had to feature Stingwings. And so on.  We knew it was hard work to grade these, but we were appreciative that they did.

We didn't really consider going this year. or last year.  It wasn't a protest or anything dramatic like that.  It's just that the event sort of (by which I mean 100% exactly) turned into a painting contest the last year we went; and now list rating which was what made it special, is gone (and had in fact kind of been gone for all practical purposes before that because of the crazy stuff people wanted to allow).

I for one definitely miss the spirit of the event.  The people have almost always been fun.  But that would have happened without OFCC.  What OFCC brought was a different set of rules that made the games more fun intrinsically, instead of simply relying on a great guy to continue to be a great guy which he was probably going to be anyways.

I tell people about OFCC all the time, but now I just tell them "don't go if you aren't a world class painter.  The cost is pretty high and it's pretty much the lists you always see at any lower priced event."  Saying that makes me super sad.

Arnt you the guy who started his own super elite tournament that you have almost complete control over so you can play 40k the way you think it should be played? I think someone who does that isn't going to be happy with the way anything is done at a tournament if they don't agree with the changes.

If you don't like the OFCC (which was super successful from what I can see) why complain about it, especially if you don't attend.

[Lord Hanaur]

7 minutes ago, SPaceORK said:

Arnt you the guy who started his own super elite tournament that you have almost complete control over so you can play 40k the way you think it should be played? I think someone who does that isn't going to be happy with the way anything is done at a tournament if they don't agree with the changes.

If you don't like the OFCC (which was super successful from what I can see) why complain about it, especially if you don't attend.

That made no sense.  I run a tournament (calling it elite is your words, not mine).  As TO I...suppose...I control the ones I run?  Like all TO's?  Not sure theres any correlation but...  what's funny about this comment is that it exactly describes the genesis of OFCC and its quest to end "beardy lists" so long ago.  Ironic.  But it's appropriate to point that out during a discussion like this one.

You again dont understand.  I have gone to a LOT of OFCC's.  I said in this very post that I loved the mission of OFCC.  Are you just not listening?

[scottshoemaker]

LH, how many beardy lists were at OFCC?

[Munkie]

8 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

You again dont understand.  I have gone to a LOT of OFCC's.  I said in this very post that I loved the mission of OFCC.  Are you just not listening?

We understand that you love the mission of the OFCC. 

The problem, as has been stated, many times, is your belief that it has strayed from its mission based on erroneous information, and are telling people such without any context.

OR GIFS!

[SPaceORK]

3 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

That made no sense.  I run a tournament (calling it elite is your words, not mine).  As TO I...suppose...I control the ones I run?  Like all TO's?  Not sure theres any correlation but...  what's funny about this comment is that it exactly describes the genesis of OFCC and its quest to end "beardy lists" so long ago.  Ironic.  But it's appropriate to point that out during a discussion like this one.

You again dont understand.  I have gone to a LOT of OFCC's.  I said in this very post that I loved the mission of OFCC.  Are you just not listening?

I call it elite because only certain armies can be played and list building is further restricted within each codex.

And yes your the TO. Your the guy who writes the rules of the tournament. I believe there is more than one TO for the OFCC and it's guidelines are made with imput from the community as a whole? Is that true for your tournament? If enough people wanted knights in your tournament would you allow them?

And while your tournament is similar to the beginning of the OFCC it's evolved into other things while still remaining true to it's original intent, play games & have fun in a casual environment.

I am listening. You said haven't gone to the OFCC in the last 2+ years. So why are you trying to have imput on a tournament you no longer attend when it seems to be doing great?

[Lord Hanaur]

14 minutes ago, scottshoemaker said:

LH, how many beardy lists were at OFCC?

4 of 5 my last year.