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Guardian Cup Warhammer 40k 2 day ITC RTT/GT Feb 16-17, 2019


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Thanks for answering Peter! Guess I will be sitting this event out. Good luck to all!

ITC Rogue Trader Tournament / Grand Tournament (IOT qualify as GT must have 28+ Players) Frontline Gaming Independent Tournament Circuit Best Coast Pairings Guardian Cup 2 Day, 5 game 2

Well I am paid up 

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I believe there is an assumption which is incorrect. Sisters of Battle have rulesets, multiple ones, contained in both indexes and chapter approved.

I think you are getting fixated on the term Beta which I don't think has an application to the original query, as there is only two items that I am aware of currently in beta status.

The Bolter Discipline is a proposed standalone rule across multiple codexes and indexes and hasn't yet been added by GW to the official up-to-date errata for those living documents. Whatever my personal feelings are regarding the appropriateness of the proposed rule, the fact that the living documents have not been amended makes the decision to not include them appropriate.

In addition the ruleset for the Adeptus Custodes forgeworld models specifically states:

"The datasheets presented here are in a beta format. As with all our
beta rules, we would like to invite you, the players, to use them in
your games and provide us with your feedback. What worked well?
What could be improved? What points values should be changed
(and to what)? Please get in touch with us at 40kfaq@gwplc.com
and let us know (please make the subject of your e-mail ‘Beta
Adeptus Custodes feedback’). This feedback will then help to inform
the final rules for these units in a future publication.
Whilst these beta rules have been designed to be used in all types
of games, including matched play games, if you intend to use them
at organised events then it is ultimately up to the event organiser as
to whether these rules will be allowed or not (as is the case with all
our beta rules)."

The fact that the designers have not yet quantified a final balanced point value for these forgeworld models and have not amended the existing parent living documents makes, objectively, the decision to not include them appropriate.

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13 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

I believe there is an assumption which is incorrect. Sisters of Battle have rulesets, multiple ones, contained in both indexes and chapter approved.

I think you are getting fixated on the term Beta which I don't think has an application to the original query.

The Bolter Discipline is a proposed standalone rule across multiple codexes and indexes and hasn't yet been added by GW to the official up-to-date errata for those living documents. 

In addition the ruleset for the Adeptus Custodes forgeworld models specifically states:

"The datasheets presented here are in a beta format. As with all our
beta rules, we would like to invite you, the players, to use them in
your games and provide us with your feedback. What worked well?
What could be improved? What points values should be changed
(and to what)? Please get in touch with us at 40kfaq@gwplc.com
and let us know (please make the subject of your e-mail ‘Beta
Adeptus Custodes feedback’). This feedback will then help to inform
the final rules for these units in a future publication.
Whilst these beta rules have been designed to be used in all types
of games, including matched play games, if you intend to use them
at organised events then it is ultimately up to the event organiser as
to whether these rules will be allowed or not (as is the case with all
our beta rules)."

The fact that the designers have not yet quantified a final balanced point value for these forgeworld models and have not amended the existing parent living documents makes, objectively, the decision to not include them appropriate.

The email and status for the custodes and Bolter rule are the exact same for the sisters of battle. 

My hang up is that these are all beta rules including the errata and faq rules. I understand not being comfortable with not using them and I respect that but I am just curious on how that works with something like adepticon or lvo where they would allow those rules as long as they meet the deadline. 

 

As I said earlier, to me it doesn't matter except that it means I am not getting the full experience these things will provide. It also is limiting a player from playing

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8 minutes ago, Lyraeus said:

The email and status for the custodes and Bolter rule are the exact same for the sisters of battle. 

My hang up is that these are all beta rules including the errata and faq rules. I understand not being comfortable with not using them and I respect that but I am just curious on how that works with something like adepticon or lvo where they would allow those rules as long as they meet the deadline 

And even the weekly league night at guardian with brings in the most 40k players in portland each week has also been playing the rules since day 1. 

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You have adequately pointed out a failure on my part, to wit, specifically pointing out a cut off date for the event. The fact of the matter is, the world has changed and I appreciate the rather extreme levels of responsiveness currently observable from Games Workshop and would prefer to not limit players from bringing their experiences and pleasure in the game to an event that I wish to run.

But there has to be an acceptable standard and I am drawing that line at the GW FAQ/Errata webpage. Bear in mind, if the webpage gets updated prior to 10AM tomorrow and I can view the changes on the devices I am bringing tomorrow then I am fine with it. I just expended 80$ in printing to ensure that I have, on-site, every single document on that webpage. So if it's not in my binder by 1001 tomorrow morning it won't be in play.

Actually, don't quote me on that, because I printed out both the bolter discipline and the forgeworld custodes rulesets for my binder to have on hand.

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10 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

You have adequately pointed out a failure on my part, to wit, specifically pointing out a cut off date for the event. The fact of the matter is, the world has changed and I appreciate the rather extreme levels of responsiveness currently observable from Games Workshop and would prefer to not limit players from bringing their experiences and pleasure in the game to an event that I wish to run.

But there has to be an acceptable standard and I am drawing that line at the GW FAQ/Errata webpage. Bear in mind, if the webpage gets updated prior to 10AM tomorrow and I can view the changes on the devices I am bringing tomorrow then I am fine with it. I just expended 80$ in printing to ensure that I have, on-site, every single document on that webpage. So if it's not in my binder by 1001 tomorrow morning it won't be in play.

Actually, don't quote me on that, because I printed out both the bolter discipline and the forgeworld custodes rulesets for my binder to have on hand.

That's fair. I am just curious if they will be included in any future events since it is now accepted in all other ITC tournaments. 

Still sad that I don't get the experience as it hurts me more to have Bolter Drill (I play orks) and sad it means a player won't participate 

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Well, there is a right way of doing things like this, and the wrong way. What's going on here is the wrong way.

The right way of doing this is to have a player's meeting prior to the first round, when all the player's are available and have a say, have a consensus vote, make sure all player's are aware of the rule and inspect players that have lists affected by the rule to ensure they have the ruleset on-hand, either hard-copy or electronically.

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Alrighty.. I have completed all the pre-pay packets for the 10 people who pre-paid, your packet will be available at whatever table/space/pacing area I end up occupying when everyone comes in.

Currently working on the registration packets for the people who pre-registered.

If you haven't pre-paid by now, now would be a good time before I go to sleep.

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23 minutes ago, peter.cosgrove said:

Well, there is a right way of doing things like this, and the wrong way. What's going on here is the wrong way.

The right way of doing this is to have a player's meeting prior to the first round, when all the player's are available and have a say, have a consensus vote, make sure all player's are aware of the rule and inspect players that have lists affected by the rule to ensure they have the ruleset on-hand, either hard-copy or electronically.

Only issue with that are the people who built lists or play affected factions. They won't show and they won't know. 

If they do show they are either happy or walk away dejected. 

As the above e poster said, ymmv

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19 hours ago, Jvesal said:

The ITC adopts all beta rules immediately as a rule, I think they should be in effect here even though it doesnt effect me. Once a Beta rule is out, they are basically supposed to be in use. YMMV.

This isn't really true. Each ITC event can do whatever they want, just need to have a winner of some sort. TO's don't need to use itc missions and can construct it pretty how they want. Now, many will do what FLG does for BAO, SoCal, and LVO, but that isn't the case in every situation as Nova, Adepticon, Renegade, and many more do their own thing and still classified as an ITC event. There is a min point cap at 1000 and scoring, but that is about it.

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