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Avengers: Endgame Spoilers

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I have mixed emotions about the "closure" storylines...  It's nice to have gotten things wrapped up but losing Tony, Steve and Natasha just feels wrong.  The only one of those that felt "right" was the closure for Steve and Peggy.  (Anyone else get the feeling that Bucky was in on that the whole time from those final scenes?)

Anyone know if Hemsworth is still under contract?  It's pretty clear that Johansson, Evans and Downey Jr. are done with the roles outside of flashbacks at this point but I don't know who else to expect back (aside from the Spiderman movie that we know is coming).

We've got most of the Guardians (and Gamora is back in the timeline so that is possible).  We have Sam stepping into the Captain America role.  Wanda is back but she's alone now.  Clint has his family back so we assume that Ronin is done and maybe Hawkeye is back (maybe his daughter in the role)?

Do we know anything about the other A-listers?  Do we expect another Captain Marvel or Black Panther film?  Anyone know?  Cumberbatch is signed to do another Doctor Strange according to IMDB but I have not heard anything about it...  There's also a Falcon & The Winter Soldier TV show coming (so Sam as Falcon, not Cap) but I don't have much info about it either...

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10 minutes ago, Duckman said:

Anyone know id Hemsworth is still under contract?  It's pretty clear that Johansson, Evans and Downey Jr. are done with the roles outside of flashbacks at this point but I don't know who else to expect back (aside from the Spiderman movie that we know is coming).

Hemsworth is on record saying he would continue to play Thor as long as they keep writing parts for him. He loves it. Johansson is going to be back when Black Widow gets her solo movie, which is going to part of Phase 4. I think the only ones that are actually done are Evans and RDJ.

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1 hour ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

Evens signed on for Fantastic Four.

Funny, a buddy of mine and I were joking about this very same thing...Evans stops his monster work out regime to keep his Captain America body, thins down, and reprises his role as Human Torch.

How cool would that be? 🙂

 

As for Endgame...complaints first.

First, I do not like Time Travel in movies.  It drives me crazy and often to me is used as lazy / poor writing to just fix a scenario.  Endgame is definitely a culprit.  I knew going into it, they would be using time travel to fix the snap, as they had hinted at it already.  But I think the overall story for their solution was just wonky.

Second, I hate Iron Man's armor.  It has basically become pure magic that is capable of almost anything.  Wait, no, it is capable of anything.  His tech surpasses what we see other advanced races that are star faring have.  His armor is just a macguffin at this point that will do whatever it needs to do to fill a story plot.

For the above two reasons, Endgame for me is far less of a movie than Infinity War.

Now, that being said...Endgame was still a good ending to the series.  Not great IMO.  But good.  Still way better than many of the other messy Marvel movies (Oh Age of Ultron you are so bad),  as Endgame did have many great things that help make up for the above...

Avengers Assemble!  Holy crap, that scene was so epic...more epic than most things.  To me the only more epic scene would be Return of the King when the Riders come over the ridge for the big battle.

"That is America's Ass".  Yeah, the Cap vs Cap fight was awesome.

The dialogue throughout the movie was so great...so many great lines interwoven.

The Captain America getting in the Elevator scene, priceless.

Lebowski Thor hilarious.

Rocket really shined for me in this movie...his character really grew I felt in this movie, which is great setup for the future (we hope) "Asgardians of the Galaxy" movie franchise 🙂

The sheer epic feeling of the final scenes, and blatant fan service somehow worked so well.  When they should not have...

Sad to see these end.  It will be interesting to see where they go from here...

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13 minutes ago, andozane said:

Second, I hate Iron Man's armor.  It has basically become pure magic that is capable of almost anything.  Wait, no, it is capable of anything.  His tech surpasses what we see other advanced races that are star faring have.  His armor is just a macguffin at this point that will do whatever it needs to do to fill a story plot.

Generally I agree with your comments, ando, but I am trying to remember...  The armor didn't feel particularly egregious in this one which is one of the reasons I was not so critical of it...  We had the pym-suits with helmets that appear out of nowehere (arguably not even Stark-tech) and Spidey's suit which *is* Stark-tech...  But aside from being ready to accept the stones I didn't have a problem with it.  Am I forgetting something specific that bugged you?

 

I get why they went to "The Thor abides" but I personally didn't like that particular storyline.  He felt... Weak and Whiny?

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45 minutes ago, Duckman said:

Generally I agree with your comments, ando, but I am trying to remember...  The armor didn't feel particularly egregious in this one which is one of the reasons I was not so critical of it...  We had the pym-suits with helmets that appear out of nowehere (arguably not even Stark-tech) and Spidey's suit which *is* Stark-tech...  But aside from being ready to accept the stones I didn't have a problem with it.  Am I forgetting something specific that bugged you?

I assumed the Pym Suits were actual Stark tech with the pym particles built in.  I guess it is all of Tony's tech that really bugged me.  Yes, the stones consumption was a huge issue to me...I mean, it is his tech...why not just say he would retrieve the gauntlet...it is his armor right?

The opening in his back to consume lightning from Thor.

How the suit creates melee weapons (I think I'm blurring this from Infinity War).

Probably a few things I'm forgetting already.  When I finally watch it again I'm sure I will pick out more 🙂

Also, he didn't seem to feel the effects of taking on the stones so fast...just my opinion.  

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3 hours ago, andozane said:

Funny, a buddy of mine and I were joking about this very same thing...Evans stops his monster work out regime to keep his Captain America body, thins down, and reprises his role as Human Torch.

How cool would that be? 🙂

 

Can't be any worse than the other ones lol 

Reprise Human Torch, and have him run into Sam Wilson 😄

 

3 hours ago, andozane said:

First, I do not like Time Travel in movies.  It drives me crazy and often to me is used as lazy / poor writing to just fix a scenario.  Endgame is definitely a culprit.  I knew going into it, they would be using time travel to fix the snap, as they had hinted at it already.  But I think the overall story for their solution was just wonky.

 

I haven't gone and seen it for this reason.  I read the plot overview on wiki, and decided I didn't want to deal with the crowds and prices of tickets for it.  I know it is going to be a visually stunning movie with solid acting, but it my reading left me feeling underwhelmed and unexcited.

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Just got back so still processing.  I'm a big fan of the movies so I thought it was a great culmination.

I am REALLY glad that they didn't use Carol Danvers as a Deus Ex Machina like I feared they would.  She was in it just enough to be legit.

Great ending to Caps story arch.  Beautifully done.

I knew Stark would die but I was surprised by Black Widow.  Makes sense and it was well done but I did not see that coming.  Of course, I am surprised that more main characters didn't die.

Question: During the funeral when they were panning through the various groups of mourners, who was the teenaged boy (maybe early 20's?) standing near the back by himself scowling?

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3 hours ago, Yarbicus said:

Question: During the funeral when they were panning through the various groups of mourners, who was the teenaged boy (maybe early 20's?) standing near the back by himself scowling?

Remember the kid who helps him with tech against the Mandarin?

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Yeah, felt that kid being there was sort of odd....since he was so unrecognizable.  Literally everyone had to google who he was...makes you wonder if they are going to use him as a future Iron Man stand in....

(though I'm still holding out hope they meld Shuri with Ironheart as that would be bad ass)

Image result for kid from iron man 3

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I was wondering that too, same as my wife...I tried to erase that horrible movie from my mind, so maybe that is why I couldn't think of it. I'm right there about Tony Stark being a freaking god. Blech. His armor was just super silly...but that is what marvel went with. Saving the world like that should have come from Reed Richards..but he was stuck with Sony. Love Cap's fight with Thanos. Best scene in whole flick. My big question mark is when does the next Spider-Man take place? It can't be post End Game...no way him and all his friends went "poof" and didn't age.

 

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It's set days after Endgame.

In theory they are addressing the time issue in the first 5 minutes of the movie.  Not sure if they will do it well or not.  Go watch the trailer again and note what Happy says.  Means more now.

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Since it sounded like others wanted to comment on my review, but couldn't without giving spoilers, he's my review from the other thread. 

Quote

Endgame.

3/5.

Decent, but nothing special. A few moments made me smile, but I feel like it's main selling point is that it was the endcap for a bunch of other movies. Tries too hard to be Return of King.

I will note that the whole "good vs evil" wasn't present in this film. Neither side was good. It was just a difference of opinions in what the future should look like, plus revenge (carried out by supposedly "good" guys). You could say it was a fight for survival, which makes it neutral, but it wasn't anything more. It was a bunch of former-good guys and former-villains just fighting for survival. Makes for a decent fight, but no moral victories to be found here.

 

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The MCU is generally not about clear-cut good vs. evil and has not been for a long time.  That's kinda the point in a lot of their movies...  With Tony Stark being a drunken womanizer, Wanda working with a criminal and fighting the Avengers, Natasha regretting her past, Shield/Hydra etc. etc.

That's what separates the MCU from DC...  DC *wants* to get past good vs. evil but they can't figure out what to do with Supes and Wonder Woman (while the MCU figured out that if everyone else is human with all those failings you can have Captain America be genuinely good and play them off one another).

 

A lot of heroes in the MCU try to be "good" but have to overcome basic failings (e.g. T'challa trying to make up for his own bad judgement and that of his father or Doctor Strange giving up his narcissism to become a protector) but then there are examples in the fringes as well...  All of the Guardians of the Galaxy, Bucky, Wanda, Ant-man.

 

If anything, these make a pretty strong statement that idealism backed by an end-justifies-the-means attitude is evil even if the idealistic goal might not seem to be and that's about as far as they try to go while still being escapist entertainment.

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I have seen some complaints about the "Girl Power" scene during the final battle and have thoughts.

1.   Calling it girl power says more about the writer than it does about the movie.

2.  I thought it was a great way to showcase some amazing characters who happen to be female.  Plus, they are in large part the future of the franchise so a team power photo op makes sense.

3.  I almost cried at "She's not alone." Not only was it a great call back to Infinity War, it reminded of the absence of the original strong woman Avenger.  I already miss her.

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I am sick of "girl power" being an issue.  I get women wanting to have more representation and I have no problem giving it to them.  I'm not sure why men even feel a need to notice or comment on it.  Are you really so insecure that you can't deal with a character who does not look like you?  If not then what other possible reason could you have for noticing or caring?  Personally, as someone who is surrounded by strong, capable women in my life (mostly by my own choice) I was happy to see that whole sequence and a nod to some great characters and some great actresses who have been key to the franchise.

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On 4/30/2019 at 12:45 PM, andozane said:

How the suit creates melee weapons (I think I'm blurring this from Infinity War).

Yeah, that was from Infinty War, where it was the T-1000 from terminator 2. Tony said something like "nanotech, cool huh?" And that was it. Now it's a do-anything that is exactly as powerful as it needs to be. Pretty lame.

My 2 least favorite MCU Ironman tech tropes are:

1) No matter where whatever element of the suit he orders mid-fight launches from (satellite, Stark manor, Avengers HQ), it always arrives just in time. Literal plot armor.

2) He spends at least as much time designing new methods of putting on and taking off the suit as he does on new versions of the suit itself. Most of them involve an individual robotic arm for each armor component, designed to add or remove mid-strut. All of these overly complicate methods are completely unnecessary considering the individual pieces can fly!

I'm surprised people mostly hate on Iron Man 3. 2 was way clumsier, IMO. With the cast change from Terrence Howard to Don Cheadle, having a script focused on Rhody seemed ill-advised. Worst of all, it's so forgettable. I've seen it like 4 times but I don't remember much of anything past the laser whip Nascar event. Iron Man 3 wasn't much better, granted.

 

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Movie was great, had the typical issues that seem to hit the MCU but I really enjoyed it.   

Rocket was by far the most successful at his job, made the rest of the cast look sloppy in comparison. 

Stark hugging Parker got me right in the feels.

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