VonVilkee Posted August 20, 2019 Report Share Posted August 20, 2019 Hey there ordo! Kinda surprised there hasn't been a thread opened up on this yet... Then again OFCC did just happen! Either way what ya all think? Lots of little buffs I'm finding. Dread strategem for half damage, points reductions, drop pod being actually useful, centurions getting additional attack and wound, tech Marine Gunner and thunder fire getting better stats, double shoot thunder fire strategem, warlord traits getting better, more relics, Chaplin litanies and baller relic. Redid my OFCC list and wow did it get better! 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 20, 2019 Report Share Posted August 20, 2019 Did the space Marines really need a boost? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted August 20, 2019 Report Share Posted August 20, 2019 41 minutes ago, paxmiles said: Did the space Marines really need a boost? To some extent, yeah. There are def still Armies that are worse off than they were before this, but they were, at best, middle of the pack, and probably toward the lower end of the middle. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 20, 2019 Report Share Posted August 20, 2019 Oooo. SM update for other chapters: https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/warhammer_40000_space_marines_summer_update_en.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 20, 2019 Report Share Posted August 20, 2019 Oh, and errata for the existing codexes, including improvements to CSM vindicators and their marines: https://www.warhammer-community.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/warhammer_40000_space_marines_errata_en.pdf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted August 20, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2019 1 hour ago, WestRider said: To some extent, yeah. There are def still Armies that are worse off than they were before this, but they were, at best, middle of the pack, and probably toward the lower end of the middle. This the jack of all trades master of none shtick that Marines have leave them competing but not really able to capitalize on anything. I feel like with the little things that I'll be able to leverage the just keep rolling dice in every phase that works for the Marines. Those doctrines! So looking forward playing around with when to aim for what weapons getting a -1 ap. Heavy bolters at -2 is gonna be entertaining. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 23, 2019 Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 Hmmm....looking at the errata. At present, none of the FW drop pods get access to the updated drop pod rule. It could certainly be argued that the errata for the codex was meant to apply to the Imperial Armour units for that army, but that's not what it says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted August 23, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2019 3 hours ago, paxmiles said: Hmmm....looking at the errata. At present, none of the FW drop pods get access to the updated drop pod rule. It could certainly be argued that the errata for the codex was meant to apply to the Imperial Armour units for that army, but that's not what it says. It is named the same but at the cost of them I'm not worried, never gonna take them. Just deploy the dreads as you can afford a whole extra dread per pod and almost get there in the same time. Yeah going second you lack that off the board protection but more dreads is better in my book. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 24, 2019 Report Share Posted August 24, 2019 3 hours ago, VonVilkee said: It is named the same but at the cost of them I'm not worried, never gonna take them. Just deploy the dreads as you can afford a whole extra dread per pod and almost get there in the same time. Yeah going second you lack that off the board protection but more dreads is better in my book. I'm not overly concerned. I do own a FW dreadpod and it "stares" at me, lonely and unfinished, from time to time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inquisitor66 Posted August 24, 2019 Report Share Posted August 24, 2019 I am unclear on how some of these rules interact with Deathwatch and Greyknights. They have changed the warpcharge values for several psychic powers that deathwatch have access too, but there is no mention of this in the errata. Likewise Chaplains have undergone substantial changes in their aura, but no mention of whether to use these new rules for Deathwatch or Greyknights. I will probly just go with whatever battlescribe says. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Hanaur Posted August 24, 2019 Report Share Posted August 24, 2019 4 hours ago, Inquisitor66 said: I am unclear on how some of these rules interact with Deathwatch and Greyknights. They have changed the warpcharge values for several psychic powers that deathwatch have access too, but there is no mention of this in the errata. Likewise Chaplains have undergone substantial changes in their aura, but no mention of whether to use these new rules for Deathwatch or Greyknights. I will probly just go with whatever battlescribe says. My advice always is not to make hopeful leap with rules. Always ends in tears. The new book,which i borrowed briefly looked like it creates some questions in regardto astral claws. There is ambiguity here as to how to apply all this to them,according to Jason, whose quite good w them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted August 24, 2019 Report Share Posted August 24, 2019 12 hours ago, Lord Hanaur said: The new book,which i borrowed briefly looked like it creates some questions in regardto astral claws. There is ambiguity here as to how to apply all this to them,according to Jason, whose quite good w them. What do you mean? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted August 24, 2019 Report Share Posted August 24, 2019 I don't see any ambiguity with Astral Claws, when grouped with Lamenters, Executioners, Red Scorpions, Minotaurs, Mantis Warriors, Fire Hawks, et al. What I see is Forge World being over worked, doubly so with Alan's passing, and unable to provide updates for everything, while also being tasked with Specialist Games rules and models. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Hanaur Posted August 25, 2019 Report Share Posted August 25, 2019 15 hours ago, InfestedKerrigan said: What do you mean? Honestly I didn't understand it. He explained it to me, sort of but honestly, I found the explanation more confusing as he went on. It has to do with essentially trying to get the benefits of both Whits Scars AND some other faction. But damned if I can coherently explain what it was all about. I left the conversation more confused than when i started. I like to think I'm pretty good at reading the rules, but I couldnt really understand the issue here. But it has to do with some stupid wording that one "could" misread in the area where it talks about Chapter Tactics. Sounds like gaming the system to me but I can't explain it any better right now. I don't have the book and was just borrowing it at the time we had the talk.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted August 25, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2019 You get to pick two tactics... But it is clearly defined which ones you can pick. The main chapters each get one that is unique to them and another that shows up on the list of build your own. You have the option in the build your own to get all the main chapter things but that takes both your options. Depending on what things he was taking from the build your own the chapter Astral Claws as a successor (undefined) could take half what white scars had (have) and another tactic that would be seen as what they previously had... Any clearer? The ambiguity comes with naming for special characters as <astral claws> were never truly defined. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted August 25, 2019 Report Share Posted August 25, 2019 Like Cory said, the only real holdup I see is running Red Scorpions, taking Sevrin Loth, and using White Scars Successor Chapter traits. That is to say, FW Special Character interactions. Everyone I've chatted with has been on the same page, which says this is totally legit, until FW gives us a list stating "Lamenters are a Blood Angels Successor Chapter and use the following Blood Angels Successor Chapter Tactics: XXXXXXX" and similar down the board. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted August 25, 2019 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2019 Also BTW there are no special characters in the Marine Dex anymore. I don't have any of the supplements so I don't know the interactions there. The main Dex got a few more generic relics and has very little to no chapter specific things. Kinda nice really! 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Hanaur Posted August 27, 2019 Report Share Posted August 27, 2019 On 8/25/2019 at 8:02 AM, VonVilkee said: You get to pick two tactics... But it is clearly defined which ones you can pick. The main chapters each get one that is unique to them and another that shows up on the list of build your own. You have the option in the build your own to get all the main chapter things but that takes both your options. Depending on what things he was taking from the build your own the chapter Astral Claws as a successor (undefined) could take half what white scars had (have) and another tactic that would be seen as what they previously had... Any clearer? The ambiguity comes with naming for special characters as <astral claws> were never truly defined. ... I... Wait... So there are two lists right? the one for the main chapters, and then a list you can take two from for "invented" chapters. And you can only do one or the other right? What I read you as saying is that an Ultramarine player has two DEFINED Chapter Tactics? He can't just pick one. He has to take the ones UltraMarines have, yes? And then if I want to SAY I'm a Successor Chapter of UltraMarines, what happens? I get a "main" UltraMarine one, plus one I choose? I'm really sorry. Between the convo I had with him and my admittedly VERY brief time wit hthe books, I have to admit IM struggling with this. But I need to know it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted August 27, 2019 Report Share Posted August 27, 2019 LEGACY OF THE PRIMARCHS CHAPTER TACTICS If your chapter does not have an associated chapter tactic, you must instead create a Successor Chapter Tactic for them, as described (below). SUCCESSOR CHAPTER TACTICS Unless Otherwise stated, your chapter has two Successor Traits from the following list 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted August 27, 2019 Report Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Lord Hanaur said: ... I... Wait... So there are two lists right? the one for the main chapters, and then a list you can take two from for "invented" chapters. And you can only do one or the other right? One of the Successor Traits is "Inheritors of the Primarch" and it lets you choose one of the main Codex Chapters and use their Chapter Tactics instead of build-a-bear workshop. Quote What I read you as saying is that an Ultramarine player has two DEFINED Chapter Tactics? He can't just pick one. He has to take the ones UltraMarines have, yes? Ultramarines gain +1 LD, and Fallback and Shoot w/-1 on their hit rolls. Black Templar gain Re-roll charge dice(any/all), and 5++ vs Mortal Wounds. An Ultramarine player, or a Successor Chapter player who picked Inheritors and SMurf, have to use the +1ld and Fallback buff. Quote And then if I want to SAY I'm a Successor Chapter of UltraMarines, what happens? I get a "main" UltraMarine one, plus one I choose? Your Parent Chapter, in the core marine book, doesn't have any effect. The Supplements add that flavor from the fluff. It's like P2P DLC. Quote I'm really sorry. Between the convo I had with him and my admittedly VERY brief time wit hthe books, I have to admit IM struggling with this. But I need to know it. What it means for Forge World characters, is it goes like this: I pick Red Scorpions cuz I have Loth and I like healing all over the place. Red Scorpions don't have rules of their own yet, so I follow the rules for a Successor Chapter, and pick two traits (that form their Tactics) from a list in the book. I pick Stalwart (ignores wound dice of 1 and 2), and Knowledge is Power (Reroll 1s on Pyschic/Deny tests). Then I pick from a series of generic Warlord traits for my warlord. Now, here's where the Supplements come in. There is a list of Warlord traits for the G8, but by the codex, you only get access to those by actually playing that Chapter. The supplements allow you to bypass that. They expand upon the Successor Chapter rules, stating that you have to choose a parent Chapter, and if you choose the Chapter associated with the Supplement, you gain access to a new list of Warlord traits (including the one from the main marine book), additional Combat Doctrine abilities, and additional wargear. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted August 27, 2019 Report Share Posted August 27, 2019 If you want to see the actual pages digitally, DM me, LH. I was conceptually confused until I read the text, and it is quite explicit on how it is used to avoid shenanigans. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Hanaur Posted August 28, 2019 Report Share Posted August 28, 2019 5 hours ago, InfestedKerrigan said: If you want to see the actual pages digitally, DM me, LH. I was conceptually confused until I read the text, and it is quite explicit on how it is used to avoid shenanigans. Im an audial learner mostly but yeah i need to absorb this. Gotta study 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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