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TheBeninator

Kingdoms of Equality-tane

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I dunno. It’s pretty typical of English that we add a “-y“ suffix to nouns and adjectives to form adjectives meaning “having the quality of.” Mess becomes messy, hair becomes hairy, mouse becomes mousy. So you’ve got chevron and chevrony... Totally logical.

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Just to add a bit more detail, here's a good chart of the most common Ordinaries used in heraldry. An ordinary is a simple geometrical figure, made up of straight lines that run from side to side or top to bottom of the shield. Although these can resemble the divisions of the field (that I posted on the last page) these are actually considered to be charges on the field. 

ord.gif

Again, for war gaming purposes shields made with just Ordinaries are pretty easy to paint on small shields and they look great. Sure, we all like things like lions, dragons, fleur-de-lys, and other charges. But those are really tricky to paint and water-slide decals get really pricey if you are trying to do a whole army. If you just replicate the designs above, replace the white bits with any color or metal or your choice and replace the blue bit with the opposite type. 

If you look at most of the national flags of western Europe (the rules for flag design, known as vexillology, are basically a direct decedent of the rules for heraldry) you'll see that most of them are made as just simple divisions of the field or they're made up of just simple ordinaries. England's is argent a cross gules (white field, red cross); Scotland's is azure a saltire argent (blue field, white saltire); France is tierced per pale gules argent and azure (divided into three vertical stripes red, white, and blue);  Germany is tierced per fess sable gules and or (divided into three horizontal stripes black, red, and gold). 
 

 

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Update!

So, hobby stuff stopped for a while there. Finally got back on and added a few more deets to the peasant horde. Weapons are now mostly done, have moved on to heads. All of this (in pic) was accomplished in perhaps an hour or so. Last touch is leather for the heads, leather for the boots, and leather for some weapon handle wraps. After that comes the shields, which will bog me down quite a bit due to masking.

Hoping to have the unit done by Dec as an arbitrary goal!

34-AB4285-35-FD-464-C-98-B5-00-A4-B6-FAB

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What do you get when you combine a 3 day weekend and some serious procrastination on Adulting?

U33Myos.jpg

A finished unit! Way ahead of the December schedule!

Heres a shot of the shields before I put them on.

bS6Q8Hm.jpg

I had planned on masking / airbrushing all the shields, but that turned out to be a pain in the butt and I was still getting crummy results. I just decided to go freehand with it. Afterwards I made an executive decision to use a black marker of sorts to outline (as per @Ish's suggestion) as to not displease the Heraldry gods. I did make up some unconventional symbols, and some of the stuff certainly came out a bit crooked, but hey! They are peasants, and I still have another 70 infantry on sprue, so I shouldn't get hung up on little details like that. 

Overall I am pretty happy with the unit. Not a whole lot I would change doing it again. Certainly some steps I could cut out of the assembly line.

Also, I did about a 50/50 dilution of the Strong tone with water, worked like a charm! Thanks @Andrewgeddon for the tip! Though now it occurs to me that you had used a thinning medium, not water, whoops! 😅

Next up is some light cavalry!

Dch81Vz.jpg

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1 hour ago, TheBeninator said:

 

bS6Q8Hm.jpg

What do you get when you combine a ten-hour graveyard shift and nothing much else to do during it?

  • First Row (L-R)
    •  Per pale argent and azure
    • Barry of twelve azure and vert fimbriated sable 
    • Argent a cross gules
    • Argent a pale vert
    • Argent a cross tenné 
    • Per pale vert and tenné
    • Vert a cross gules fimbriated sable 
    • Tenné a pale gules fimbriated sable 
    • Quarterly azure and tenné
    • Azure two palet gules fimbriated sable 
  • Second Row (L-R)
    • Azure a bend argent
    • Vert a cross azure fimbriated sable 
    • Quarterly gules and argent
    • Quarterly argent and vert
    • Argent a bend tenné
    • Quarterly vert and tenné fimbriated sable 
    • Vert two bend sinister gules fimbriated sable 
    • Tenné a chevron gules fimbriated sable 
    • Tenné a chevron azure fimbriated sable 
    • Azure a chevron gules fimbriated sable 
  • Third Row (L-R)
    • Argent a pale azure fimbriated sable
    • Per pale vert and azure
    • Gules two chevrons inverted argent fimbriated sable
    • Argent a bend vert
    • Tenné a pale argent
    • Vert two chevrons inverted tenné fimbriated sable
    • Gules two chevrons vert fimbriated sable
    • Barry of seven gules and tenné fimbriated sable 
    • Tenné a triangle voided azure fimbriated sable 
    • Gules a pale azure fimbriated sable 
  • Fourth Row (L-R)
    • Argent a cross azure
    • Per bend azure and vert 
    • Gules three bars argent fimbriated sable
    • Vert a chevron argent fimbriated sable
    • Tenné a cross argent fimbriated sable
    • Tenné a cross argent fimbriated sable
    • Tenné a cross vert fimbriated sable
    • Per fess gules and vert
    • Gules a saltire tenné fimbriated sable
    • Azure a pale tenné fimbriated sable
    • Gules three bars azure fimbriated sable

It should be noted that tenné (sometimes "tawny" or "tenny," spelling wasn't standardized until fairly recently) is a pretty unusual tincture. It comes from the Medieval Latin word tannare, meaning "to tan leather" and is supposed to be a light brownish color of a tanned hide... It wasn't used much as a field color, mostly just for wood and skin on charges, but it makes sense for peasantry that are pretenders to armigerous station. 

Now they just need a standard bearer, even peasants can't march to war without a flag! No flag, no country!

 

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Damn @Ish

That's some serious dedication to tincture.

When I do the heavy infantry ill come up with something that you don't have a name for!

Fun OCD fact. Every peasant (after the first 8 ) is composed of 2 main colors. Every shield is composed of those 2 same colors. The primary color of every peasant matches one of the colors of the shield that they are carrying, but never do both colors on the shield match the peasant colors.

 A little bit of order among the chaos!

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On 11/12/2019 at 1:22 AM, Ish said:

What do you get when you combine a ten-hour graveyard shift and nothing much else to do during it?

  • First Row (L-R)
    •  Per pale argent and azure
    • Barry of twelve azure and vert fimbriated sable 
    • Argent a cross gules
    • Argent a pale vert
    • Argent a cross tenné 
    • Per pale vert and tenné
    • Vert a cross gules fimbriated sable 
    • Tenné a pale gules fimbriated sable 
    • Quarterly azure and tenné
    • Azure two palet gules fimbriated sable 

Question....

Why do shields 5 and 7 have different descriptions? They are the same style, different colors.

Were you just making stuff up this whole time?

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They have the nearly same description: Field color, the type of shape (in this case the ordinary known as a cross), the color of that shape. 

  • Argent a cross tenné rendered in colloquial English is "White field with a brown cross." 
  • Vert a cross gules rendered in colloquial English is "Green field with a red cross." 

The difference is in that last part: fimbriated sable, which means in plain language "outlined in black." This is due to the rule of tincture that I mentioned before, you cannot place a color on a color or a metal on a metal. The first shield doesn't break this rule, since it has a metal field (white and silver are interchangeable in heraldry), but the second shield does break the rule by placing a red ordinary on a green field. So it would need to be fimbriated. 

This is why the individual flags of Scotland (blue field, white saltire), Ireland (white field, red cross) and England (white field, red cross) don't have fimbriation, but the Union Flag representing union between England and Scotland after James I / James VI took over does have fimbriation around the red cross and the present day design has fimbriation and counter-charging because they added the second red cross.

Red cross with white border over a white saltire and dark blue background.

1606 Original Gangsta Union Jack 

The Union Flag: a red cross over combined red and white saltires, all with white borders, over a dark blue background.

1801 "Okay, We'll Let the Irish Count Too" Union Jack

If the shield wasn't 10 mm tall, we'd need to make sure the black outlines around the cross were a lot thicker on the green/red shield, enough so that someone looking at it from a distance would notice it. We wouldn't include any lines at all (or they'd be minimal just to outline the shape). See below.

 

shield.png

shield (1).png

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@Ish Ah! Makes sense, this old English (or whatever it is) is heavy stuff.

Hobby Update!

For this unit of fast cav I wanted to try and keep a log of time that I spend on each process. This should help me identify places where I spend too much time. Many times will be longer than they aught to be primarily due to watching the Office at the same time. No pictures for today, but I went through and did some initial cleaning up of the bits for the light cav. Most everything looked pretty good. Mold lines were primarily on the horses and on the hats of the riders. Some chaff bits were stuck to the spear tips, and the connections from the sprue to the horse heads were in an awful spot (right in the middle of the horse face) so I cut those early as to not fix them later. 

In all I spent about 30 minutes cleaning these up, inspecting the bits to figure out roughly what I would be putting together, and washing the whole lot with soap and water as to better take on primer. Next step tonight will be primer white through the 'ol airbrush. Color scheme is still up in the air, but I was thinking of some slight alterations to the tone, going with something a little darker. There will only be 12 of these, so I was thinking of going with 4 total colors such that there are 3 riders who share a primary color, and who each have a different secondary color. Current ideas are:

Prussian Blue (which is darker than the peasant blue)

Dark Green (I have several options here)

"English Uniform" (basically a darker version of beige)

Dark Red (which oddly, is just my "red")

 

Horses will probably be a brown, a mahogany (reddish brown), a grey, and white (with a tinge of blue). Might drop mahogany for something else as it will start to blend in with the saddles too much.

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Thanks,

That's actually not a full sized unit, still room for another 12 (60 total).

The unit however is a bunch of peasants. weapon skill 2, low leadership, Resistance 3, strength 3, light armor and a shield. They are just there to hold a line, they really cant put out the hurt.

The only good thing they have going for them is numbers, and if I invest a bunch of extra points, I can give them a pretty insane static combat score (8). So although they will die in droves, you have to kill at least 8 every turn else you lose combat and potentially flee from the great peasant horde.

If you flank them however, poof, peasants are toast.

Truly, they are glorified clanrats.... Peasant crusaders on the other hand are glorified plague monks, except that they are a special choice >_<

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12 minutes ago, valourunbound said:

That's 48? Oh geez.

What's the recipe for 8 CR? 3 ranks, banner, bsb, 2 legions? That gets me to 7.

 

Oh it's not a BSB. The Castellan can just be an extra banner and you can take 2, each with a Legion enchantment.

Yerp, could throw the BSB with legion in there too, but that gets really expensive for 10 CR. But! A paladin BSB can take Piety which would give them all a +6 Aegis. Combine that with a reliquary and they become 4+/6++ parry with 69 effective models (reliquary is a 2x3).

Again, that is just a basket of eggs asking to be smashed.

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4 minutes ago, valourunbound said:

I'd bite. 11 points for a fast cav model? Wow. 

The real issue is that 5 fast cav does the same job as 15... for cheaper. 

I challenge you to find a good use for 15 Outriders!

Ya, I thought you could break a unit by getting in the rear and charging.

Then I read that you have 0 ranks with light troops >_<

15 might be able to take on a plague catapult....

might...

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45 minutes ago, TheBeninator said:

Thanks,

That's actually not a full sized unit, still room for another 12 (60 total).

The unit however is a bunch of peasants. weapon skill 2, low leadership, Resistance 3, strength 3, light armor and a shield. They are just there to hold a line, they really cant put out the hurt.

The only good thing they have going for them is numbers, and if I invest a bunch of extra points, I can give them a pretty insane static combat score (8). So although they will die in droves, you have to kill at least 8 every turn else you lose combat and potentially flee from the great peasant horde.

If you flank them however, poof, peasants are toast.

Truly, they are glorified clanrats.... Peasant crusaders on the other hand are glorified plague monks, except that they are a special choice >_<

Are you a Line Formation?

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My WHFB 8th Edition Empire army had a massive 100-man infantry block of spearmen, plus their supporting detachments of handgunners and halberdiers; Next to them was a 50-man block of greatswords, plus their supporting handgunners and halberdiers; then there was the big, long line of archers behind them... and the long, thin line of skirmishing archers in front of them.

Not one cavalry model in the entire army. 

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4 minutes ago, Ish said:

My WHFB 8th Edition Empire army had a massive 100-man infantry block of spearmen, plus their supporting detachments of handgunners and halberdiers; Next to them was a 50-man block of greatswords, plus their supporting handgunners and halberdiers; then there was the big, long line of archers behind them... and the long, thin line of skirmishing archers in front of them.

Not one cavalry model in the entire army. 

That's a beautiful thing.

Were there really no unit size caps in 8th edition?

1 hour ago, paxmiles said:

Are you a Line Formation?

That is 12 wide for display purposes only. Realistically the only way to run them is 5 wide, 12 ranks back to remain steadfast as long as possible. You can give them spears, even halberds, but that is a total trap. Parry+Shield is where it's at.

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18 hours ago, TheBeninator said:

Thanks,

That's actually not a full sized unit, still room for another 12 (60 total).

The unit however is a bunch of peasants. weapon skill 2, low leadership, Resistance 3, strength 3, light armor and a shield. They are just there to hold a line, they really cant put out the hurt.

The only good thing they have going for them is numbers, and if I invest a bunch of extra points, I can give them a pretty insane static combat score (8). So although they will die in droves, you have to kill at least 8 every turn else you lose combat and potentially flee from the great peasant horde.

If you flank them however, poof, peasants are toast.

Truly, they are glorified clanrats.... Peasant crusaders on the other hand are glorified plague monks, except that they are a special choice >_<

Daemon Core choices are all capped at 25 except Myrmidons which can take 30. Non-core can't be in units larger than 15 models (most are less).

As for CR, we're capped at +6 as far as I can tell. For starters, we lack access to magic standards. There's a non-stacking CR +1 manifestation. Then BSB, Standard, and 3 ranks. That's it.

So, yeah, yuck!

 

 

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