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As I've been saying for years, every time GW introduces a new product -- be it as major as a new edition or as minor as a redesigned paint brush cup -- the reactions are eerily predictable:  33%

I predict that the new edition will fix a lot of the imbalances of the current, the first half dozen new codices will be nicely balanced, and although the Internet hive-mind will figure out a couple q

Yeah. I just hate it when people voluntarily agree to exchange their wealth for the goods or services voluntarily being offered by others. 🙄

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12 minutes ago, Mulgrok said:

no more 3+ invulnerable for storm shield?  4++ and +1 to normal save, it seems.  I like it.

Well, that’s gonna need a FAQ addressing how it works with Custodes... Unless they intended for my stormshield equipped Custodian Guard to have a 3++ Invulnerable Save and a 1+ Armor Save.

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12 minutes ago, Ish said:

Well, that’s gonna need a FAQ addressing how it works with Custodes... Unless they intended for my stormshield equipped Custodian Guard to have a 3++ Invulnerable Save and a 1+ Armor Save.

I guess the other way to read it is that it improves ALL saves by 1.  I really should stop trying to make conclusions based on incomplete data.

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An unmodified 1 always fails, so a 1+ armor save would still require a roll of a 2. But if there was AP-1 on the weapon, it would still require a roll of a 2.

Things that stood out on first read:

  • Can't fall-back and Psychic
  • Reinforcements can come in on the last turn even and not be destroyed
  • You can charge over units, if you can fly, but you have to deal with terrain as usual
  • Objective Markers are 40mm, and you measure to the closest part of the marker, not the center
  • Command Reroll: only hit, wound, save, advance, charge, psychic, deny the witch, number of attacks
  • Insane Bravery is once per BATTLE
  • You have to declare your "additional warlord trait", psychic powers, etc on your list, you can't tool-box a different relic or psychic power (unfortunate)
     
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41 minutes ago, ZeroStride said:

 

  • You have to declare your "additional warlord trait", psychic powers, etc on your list, you can't tool-box a different relic or psychic power (unfortunate)
     

where do you see this bit? i see where it says selecting warlord traits is part of "mustering your army" when starting a mission, but it still seems entirely up to TOs whether they want to allow toolboxing or not. 

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I've got to say, I'm not a huge fan of their approach to the Eternal War missions. Mission 6, in particular, is going to be an absolute pain in the ass just to set up. Diagonal deployments have always been tricky because laying a tape measure in an uninterrupted 7'2.5" diagonal line and measuring 12" back for the DZ edges is tricky. So memorizing the distances from the table corners and drawing at least a shorter, but still challenging line has been the common workaround.

Well now they dictate that distance from the corners so we don't have to memorize it anymore, which is great! Except we still have to try to measure that centerline to set the objectives. Oh, and we also have to measure the other diagonal center line to setup 2 more objectives...

Otherwise, I liked the mix-and-match mission-and-map style we've enjoyed for the past few editions. I understand that it's not really doable given the complexity of the missions, but I also suspect this was strongly pushed by the competitive voices within the design team. One of the unspoken realities of ITC play is having random deployments with preset missions. Some arrangements absolutely favor one player and skew tournament results. Eliminating this variable seems like something they'd want.

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And since rules are just "how you do the job" here's the jobs to be done...

All primary objectives on the missions are hold 1/2/more, scored in your next command phase

You choose 3 secondaries, you cannot choose more than one from each category, and each mission has a bespoke secondary that you can choose as one of those three...

Quote

[Purge the Enemy]
- 3 VP per character killed
- 2 VP per MONSTER/VEHICLE with 10 or less wounds, 3 VP for 11+ wounds
- 10 VP if one TITANIC is destroyed, 15 VP if 2+ destroyed
- 6 VP if you kill the warlord

[No Mercy, No Respite]
- X/10 VP, where X is the sum number of the models you kill in the game; add 10 instead of 1 if model has 10+W
- 4 VP per round if more enemy models are destroyed than friendly models (destroyed, not kill, so yes perils)
- 0/5/10/15 VP, your 3 highest point cost models survive, 5 for each
- 5/8 VP, kill a unit in the first battle round, add 3 VP if you killed more in the first battle round

[Battlefield Supremacy]
- 2/3 VP at the end of your turn, 3 units wholely within 3 quarters, wholey within 4 and over 6" from the center
- 4 VP at the end of your turn if 2 or more of your units are within enemy DZ (no aircraft)
- 3 VP at the end of your turn if you control more than half the objective markers

[Shadow Operations]
- 3 VP each time an INFANTRY unit completes ACTION, at end of movement phase do ACTION if within 6" of the center, and no enemies within 6" of the center (no aircraft), ends at end of your turn
- 5 VP each time INFANTRY does ACTION, in your next command phase, if wholely within enemy DZ
- 1 VP command phase, 1 VP end of battle for each objective with a banner on it. INFANTRY does ACTION on objective marker, no enemies nearby (excl aircraft)

[Warpcraft]
- 3 VP for each Mental Interogation, Psychic ACTION warp charge 4 18" target character
- 15 VP if you Psyhich ACTION 3x in the battle, Warp charge 3, within (?)" of the center
- 5 VP per PSYKER CHARACTER killed, 3 VP for any other PSYKER, you are not allowed to have Psykers

And the bespoke secondaries

Quote

Combat Patrol
- 5VP if you control the objective marker in your opponent's deployment zone, at end of your turn
- 5VP if you score the 2 objectives not in anyones deployment zone, in command phase (no turn 1)
- 3VP if you have non-aircraft wholely within 6" of your board edge, and opponent board edge. Instead, 5VP if also in their deploy zone.

Incursion
- 4VP Control both A-objectives, 2VP if you control both B-objectives, at the end of your turn
- 3VP Control the 2 objectives not in anyones deployment zone, 5 VP if enemy is within 9" of the center
- (action) 3VP if you control one A, 5 VP if you control both A, take an action, score @ end of turn, no aircraft
- 8/4/2/1 VP depending on objective, socre @ end of turn
- 2/3/5 VP if you control 1/2/3 in your opponent's
- 3/5 VP in their DZ, some board edge requirements, whatever rewards movement

Strike Force
- 15/10/5 VP at the end of the battle if at least 75%, 50%, 25% of your army force is remaining (calculating it is long)
- 3VP at end of your command phases if you control the point in opponent's DZ, and +2 VP for each point you control outside any DZ, max of 7 per turn
- 1/3/6/10 VP in command phase per Action completed
- X VP, at the end of your turn, if you control the center objective, where X is the turn number
- 5/15 VP if 1/2 objective markers were raized
- X VP, where X is the number of points you control, complete action (no aircraft)
- 5VP command phase, more objectives in the centerand more units within 12" of the center

 

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26 minutes ago, Dusldorf said:

where do you see this bit? i see where it says selecting warlord traits is part of "mustering your army" when starting a mission, but it still seems entirely up to TOs whether they want to allow toolboxing or not. 

Looking at page 251 and number 4 on that list (and yes, it is still up to the TO for sure).

image.thumb.png.89cdecf1140406c645975a267f25dba6.png

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3 minutes ago, Ish said:

This is a rule that most tourneys have used since the dawn of time, but it’s nice to see it codified as an official rule.

not true lol, ITC has allowed game-by-game toolboxing for most things for all of 8th ed -- only exceptions have been stuff like upgrading of BA captains to death company.

dont get me wrong, i like the change that's suggested by this roster sheet, but it is certainly a big change if TOs start to disallow toolboxing of all kinds.

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16 minutes ago, Brandon said:

Ouch for non elite armies!

Horde Armies have the “2/3 VP at the end of your turn, 3 units wholely within 3 quarters, wholey within 4 and over 6" from the center“ objective as an almost guaranteed pile of points.

Gas up the Chimeras. 

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I noticed 2 things.  1. Engagement range is now .5 inch instead of 1 inch, this will dramatically reduce the number of models that can fight.

 

2. There is no mention of an increased engagement range for vehicles and monstrous creatures. Especially vertically, so I don't see a fix here for carnifexes unable to attack dudes hiding on high levels of ruins or within dense ones.

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1. Engagement range is now .5 inch instead of 1 inch, this will dramatically reduce the number of models that can fight.

As I recall, 1/2” is the default mêlée range in AoS, but there are mêlée weapons have a range stat, just like shooting weapons, so units with spears or other large weapons often fight at 2”. Perhaps they’re going to add something like this in WH40k for those few units that have really large mêlée weapons?

2. There is no mention of an increased engagement range for vehicles and monstrous creatures. Especially vertically, so I don't see a fix here for carnifexes unable to attack dudes hiding on high levels of ruins or within dense ones.

They did tease us with this notion during one of the earlier previews... Maybe we just haven’t seen this rule yet?

Cheers to this, says I. A full-throated and hearty Huzzah! 

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"As I recall, 1/2” is the default mêlée range in AoS, but there are mêlée weapons have a range stat, just like shooting weapons, so units with spears or other large weapons often fight at 2”. Perhaps they’re going to add something like this in WH40k for those few units that have really large mêlée weapons? "

 To clarify--The "1/2" range in AoS is the distance a unit must move its first model within an enemy model to complete a charge against that enemy unit.After that each model in the charging unit is free to move the full charge distance but is under no requirement to even move into contact with the charge target unit(sounds goofy but this "free move" of sorts can come in handy sometimes) As for melee weapon ranges,AoS has 1",2" and 3" ranges.Melee weapon ranges would be an interesting addition to 40k, though I think its better served to keep AoS the "Melee game" and 40k the "Shooting game".

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1 hour ago, Threejacks said:

As for melee weapon ranges,AoS has 1",2" and 3" ranges.Melee weapon ranges would be an interesting addition to 40k, though I think its better served to keep AoS the "Melee game" and 40k the "Shooting game".

Yeah, I wouldn’t want it for every unit in 40k, but it wouldn’t be too bad it it was just a special rule for a few things like Knights, Tyranid mega-bugs, and so forth.

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"Allocate attack: Player commanding target then selects one model in that unit. If a model in the unit already lost wounds or has already had attacks allocated to it this phase, they must select that model.

Whoa. This is huge. A tactic that I’d been using for several editions with my Deathwing and planned to use with my Custodes was to plop one guy with a storm shield into my units for every five men. Use the storm shield to “tank” the occasional high AP hit and then let one of the others take the small arms fire.

Imperial Guard Infantry Squad with a lascannon shoots the squad, shield tanks it with 3++ Save. The eight guys with lasguns shoot, take it all on the 2+ Save of a regular trooper.

Now, not only must all shots from the one attacking unit be taken on that first man, he must continue to try to tank shots for the rest of the Shooting phase!

 

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6 minutes ago, Ish said:

 

 

Whoa. This is huge. A tactic that I’d been using for several editions with my Deathwing and planned to use with my Custodes was to plop one guy with a storm shield into my units for every five men. Use the storm shield to “tank” the occasional high AP hit and then let one of the others take the small arms fire.

Imperial Guard Infantry Squad with a lascannon shoots the squad, shield tanks it with 3++ Save. The eight guys with lasguns shoot, take it all on the 2+ Save of a regular trooper.

Now, not only must all shots from the one attacking unit be taken on that first man, he must continue to try to tank shots for the rest of the Shooting phase!

 

Yeah that is huge for Deathwatch vet squads. Well any squad with storm shields really.

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