Horus Heresy and OFCC

[AbusePuppy]

So I know there's at least a few people who are interested in Heresy-era stuff around the area; would there be enough folks wanting to do a 30K event for OFCC that it might be worth putting the idea up to the HoG? If so, what would the preference be for the general type of event- we could run just a general tournament-styled round robin in the general mold of OFCC itself, or pick some missions out of the HH books themselves to re-enact, or do a more "personal" narrative campaign specifically tailored to the attendees, or something altogether different?

 

Thoughts on the subject?

[fluger]

I know that Koyote would be potentially interested.  He's a great advocate for 30k and gaming in general.

[intrizic]

I've heard a nasty rumor that 30k is more balanced than 40k, any truth to that?

[fluger]

It's easier to balance a game when almost every unit is similar.

[AbusePuppy]

I've heard a nasty rumor that 30k is more balanced than 40k, any truth to that?

 

Let me put is this way: there is a unit in 30K that is able to Deep Strike and has a way to, once per game, kill every single model in a unit that is within 12" of it, regardless of armor or invulns or anything else. (Though it won't work on vehicles tougher than AV13.) He costs about 130pts.

 

Also, the Legions themselves are wildly imbalanced. Death Guard can reroll failed Pinning checks; Alpha Legion can give every model in their army Infiltrate or Tank Hunters. Not exactly fair.

 

 

It's easier to balance a game when almost every unit is similar.

 

Yes, but FW is terrible at balancing anything more complicated than a pencil.

[Guest]

Could you just normal 40k Vs 30k? How well do they scale against eachother?

[VonVilkee]

Could you just normal 40k Vs 30k? How well do they scale against eachother?

Horribly, completely different points balancing... Altho none of those Marines have and they shall know no fear... From my understanding.

[Guest]

Horribly, completely different points balancing... Altho none of those Marines have and they shall know no fear... From my understanding.

Really wish 40k and 30k were compatible.

 

Hmm...how hard would it be to merge the two? Massive re-write, or could you do it with a few changes?

[AbusePuppy]

Could you just normal 40k Vs 30k? How well do they scale against eachother?

 

You could play them against each other, at least in theory. 30K tends to be designed for larger point games and 40K for smaller, so you'd need to find some kind of happy medium (maybe around 2000pts, or 1850 if you wanna go low?) where they could both play reasonably well. That said, however, 40K is generally going to be a lot more powerful than 30K because 30K armies lack the same kinds of tools and flexibility that are available to 40K, most especially because of the limited army selection and lack of ATSKNF (or other Leadership-mitigating abilities) on their units.

 

30K vs. 40K could potentially work fine for casual gaming, but definitely not for a more competitive event.

[Guest]

You could play them against each other, at least in theory. 30K tends to be designed for larger point games and 40K for smaller, so you'd need to find some kind of happy medium (maybe around 2000pts, or 1850 if you wanna go low?) where they could both play reasonably well. That said, however, 40K is generally going to be a lot more powerful than 30K because 30K armies lack the same kinds of tools and flexibility that are available to 40K, most especially because of the limited army selection and lack of ATSKNF (or other Leadership-mitigating abilities) on their units.

 

30K vs. 40K could potentially work fine for casual gaming, but definitely not for a more competitive event.

Interesting. So, let's say you add ATSKNF and do a 2k game. Obviously casual play, but are the rules close enough where this can be done without making a new rule book?

 

I really like the idea of a bunch more armies for casual play....

[AbusePuppy]

It'd certainly be workable. Adding ATSKNF is a pretty big step, though if you're doing it just for casual stuff obviously it doesn't matter.

 

The lack of morale immunity is actually one of the more interesting aspects of 30K- stuff like combat results and morale checks actually matter a lot.

[Aventine]

Let me put is this way: there is a unit in 30K that is able to Deep Strike and has a way to, once per game, kill every single model in a unit that is within 12" of it, regardless of armor or invulns or anything else. (Though it won't work on vehicles tougher than AV13.) He costs about 130pts.

 

I guess you missed the new Moritat FAQ. They made it so if you Chainfire with an Overheat weapon, you overheat on a 1 or 2, either of which ends the Chainfire... (though it is pretty sweet on Volkites)

 

here it is: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/H/Horus_Heresy_7th_Ed_FAQ_Dec_2014.pdf

[AbusePuppy]

I guess you missed the new Moritat FAQ. They made it so if you Chainfire with an Overheat weapon, you overheat on a 1 or 2, either of which ends the Chainfire... (though it is pretty sweet on Volkites)

 

No, I'm fully aware of that. However, you seem to have missed the new Relics that are available in 30K, one of which gives a single model a one-use "every roll it makes this turn is a 6" effect- which, when put on the Moritat gives them the ability to automatically delete any one unit within 12" of them.

[Aventine]

They are fixing that soon enough, they did not write what they meant. From the designer's mouth it is supposed to be 'one roll is automatically a six'. So good for Paragon Blades and the like.

 

If someone really wanted to use that combo I'd have them roll out the whole Chainfire, then I would go do something else while they rolled dice until the end of time.

 

*shouts from other room* "How many hits have you gotten? Oh... you still don't know? Alright, let me know"

 

So what it really gives them is the ability to break the game in an infinite loop since you can never get to the wound rolling stage.

[AbusePuppy]

So you're agreeing that it's completely broken and does exactly what I said it did, then? Because I wasn't arguing "this is an intended effect of the gear" or "this is a fun way to play the game" or anything else. Someone asked if 30K had broken stuff in it like 40K does, and I told them that yes it does and here is an example. Don't go shifting the goalposts just because you don't like what I pointed out.

 

Also infinite loops don't exist in Warhammer, so that's a moot point.

[Aventine]

I am saying it does not erase units, it just makes the game stop, so it is not a particularly good combo. I wasn't trying to ""move goalposts"", just disagreeing that the combo you pointed out has any actual, practical application. Now, the Moritat pre-FAQ aided by Alpharius' army-wide Prefered Enemy... that was an issue...

 

How would you resolve it currently? Because just removing the target certainly isn't the RAW.

[AbusePuppy]

I'm not sure why you're assuming that it forces you to keep rolling dice forever. The Moritat's ability says he MAY make an additional shot after hitting, not that he MUST do so. (That is in addition to the option to use or not use the Chain Fire ability itself.)

[Mr.MoreTanks]

Let's get that 30k going!