It's raining ladies! Drop pod Sisters

[Guest]

If looking for cheap short range, semi-iffy, AT, I'd go with a 5-man with combi-melta sarge and maybe a melta bomb. For basic weapons, bolters are ideal, given that they still retain their bolt pistols. Always remember to throw krak grenades, too. That said, if you have salamander chapter tactics, I'd switch over to the plasma pistol for the sarge, as a re-usable mastercrafted plasma pistol is definitely better than a combi-weapon, but only due to the re-roll to hit negating the major weakness of get's hot on carapace. In melee, unit has 4-5 krak grenades and 0-1 melta bomb. A cheap, semi-effective unit. I'd out flank them and jungle in cover until you find a vehicle you can damage/destroy.

 

Now, if looking for range, snipers or bolters are your weapon. Bolters are for moving fire and snipers are for stationary units. Cloaks should only be used if either trying to make a cover tank, or if intending to place in a limited cover situation. As a 5-man, only cloaks if you think the army will lack access to 4+ cover. 3+ cover while going to ground is plenty for scouts in a non-cover tank role.

 

If you want to try cover tanking, get a 10-man with cloaks. Cover tanking is very iffy, as most opponents will have realistic solutions to 2+ cover saves. That said, some opponents really lack this and it can be a game decider, despite the low BS scouts rarely doing much reliable damage (BS3 is fine, but scouts are very expensive for BS3). Divination Librarians can be helpful here, as can units which boost existing cover, like RW Shrouds and Techmarine terrain bolstering.

 

Bolt pistols and CCWs are for melee applications. Offensively, scouts are about as good as assault marines without jump packs. They hurt defensively due to low WS and armor saves.

 

On the one hand, this means that scouts favor tactics which either result in a quick victory, or don't require victory to remain useful to your army. Unit is small, but they can still tarpit units with only a few attacks, like most dreadnoughts.

 

On the other hand, against opponents with terrible or amazing WS, and which already deny armor saves, the scout marines are just as good as assault marines. Just cheaper.

 

For example, an imperial knight is a decent target for scout marines instead of assault marines. Deal is that the knight will kill either unit sent at it, so it isn't a matter of survival, just one of dealing a few blows before death. To this end, a single melta bomb, or a few power fist swings are all that you really have with either unit, rest of the squad members just being sacrificial. You probably won't destroy the enemy knight, but it can't overwatch and it only has a few swings, I think 4 swings, so your 60pt 5-man squad with only a melta bomb, has a chance to hit it and damage it, providing you just rush the darn thing, lose 4 members to D weapons at Initiative 4, then lose 1 the last guy to stomp as he simotaneously hits with melta bomb or fist swings.

 

I will note that scouts have lots of roles they can preform, as they are the best tool box unit of the SM. Pick a primary role, then use them any number of ways in game. The primary role is mostly for upgrade and weapon selection. Otherwise they get too expensive, I know this one from experience.

 

You can even use combat squads to create a mixed role unit. For example, a 10-man with 5 snipers and 5 CCW+BP pairs. In this case, you will have some games where it's just one big squad squad of bolt pistols and krak grenades, while other games will see the primary role of a sniper unit and a melee unit.

[Guest]

As for heavy weapons, really depends on the role you need filled.

 

The big issue is that due to being heavy weapons, they impair the tool-box nature of the scouts by forcing them into a singlular role. This can be fine for sniper scouts, but iffy for the others.

 

Hellfire heavy bolters go well with snipers. Regular heavy bolters should be left with armies which specifically benefit from bolt weapons, like imperial fists. Heavy bolters look as if it would be a good idea to snap fire them while on the move, but the reality is that scouts are almost always better off running if they are not close enough to shoot while stationary, and the heavy bolter snaps will prevent charges.

 

For missile launchers, they can be useful, but they are also an easy way to jump the cost of the unit. Issue is that scouts are BS3, so anything you do with their missiles needs to be something that you can't do with BS4 tactical marines - especially now that tactical marines can take a heavy weapon at the 5-man level.

 

Best use I've found for scouts with missiles isn't the actual shooting of the missiles, but to imply fire lanes. A 5-man scout missile team infiltrating onto a flank can stall tank formations, especially ones like Imperial Guard (AS) due to their weak side and tendency for tank formations. IG opponents will ignore backfield units in favor of sending their DS or outflanking units to deal with the weeny scout unit.

 

Flakk missiles are the same as the regular missiles. They drive up the cost of the unit, so make sure you use them in a manner which your other troops with higher BS can't. This is typically achieved by getting a bird's eye view of the battlefield, or creating flanks for projected flyer movement (like planning to take out the weak rear armor on a helldrake or valk via hiding behind a mid-field pilliar and waiting for them to fly past).

 

I will note that scouts are very underestimated by marine players, and other players alike, and they often do just fine. I've even experimented with a 10man melee scout unit in a land raider crusader with an attached chaplain. Unit defeated a 5-man TH/SS terminator unit, though at high cost to the scout unit.

 

Scouts need to be played gutsy.

[fluger]

I've run almost everything [with scouts]. What do you need them to do? Scouts work best with a dedicated primary role. Also, which chapter tactics do you intend to use?

 

If he's using Blood Angels, he doesn't get a choice of CTs.  My recommendation (and from Vassal) is that BA scouts should go BP/CCW to maximize the value of their furious charge.  

[pretre]

If he's using Blood Angels, he doesn't get a choice of CTs. My recommendation (and from Vassal) is that BA scouts should go BP/CCW to maximize the value of their furious charge.

Yeah, this.

 

I appreciate the treatise, pax, but I'm running 5 bare which is why I asked.

[pretre]

Bp ccw is handy because I have plenty of wolf scouts that fit the bill.

[Guest]

Do the BA scouts still have locator beacon access, as they did in the last codex? That would be something worthy of thought with regards to a drop pod force.

 

EDIT: Also, the power maul starts looking appealing if you've got furious charge.

[fluger]

Power Mauls are great!  

[pretre]

Scouts can get teleport homers. Drop pods can get locators.

[WestRider]

Scout Bikers can also get Locator Beacons, but not the regular, on-foot ones.

[Guest]

Scout Bikers can also get Locator Beacons, but not the regular, on-foot ones.

The old BA codex, their scouts could take locator beacons. Suppose the new ones can't.

[PumpkinHead]

PourSpelor, I have some BA you can use.  They are just gathering dust on my shelves right now.

[pretre]

PourSpelor, I have some BA you can use.  They are just gathering dust on my shelves right now.

Bam!