AbusePuppy Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Jesus. You're wailing and bemoaning a book that hasn't even been released, that we don't know all the rules for, and that no one has played a single game with. People are psyched for a new book and a new way of playing and to "have fun" and all you can do is rain on the parade. Maybe you could allow people a single day to be excited before implying they are fools for feeling that way. Yeah, that's right. Any kind of opinion about a book that is anything less than "I HAD A LITERAL ORGASM JUST FROM THINKING ABOUT THE CONCEPT OF THIS ARMY" is nothing but negative-nancy worrywarting, and GW's long history of screwing up rules and making mediocre releases should just be totally ignored because omg u can run CSM and demons together !!111aa1!!1112 also they put the word blood into a rule!1111111 You're allowed to have your pollyanna positive opinions just like I'm allowed to have my more cynical one about the likelihood of an all-foot army that relies wholly on melee and has no protective special rules doing well in games. But hey, 50/50 chance either of us is right, right? Right. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generalripphook Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 You mention the problem of deepstriking, doesnt the charnal court kinda metagate that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Glacius Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Jesus. You're wailing and bemoaning a book that hasn't even been released, that we don't know all the rules for, and that no one has played a single game with. People are psyched for a new book and a new way of playing and to "have fun" and all you can do is rain on the parade. Maybe you could allow people a single day to be excited before implying they are fools for feeling that way. I don't think you know what the internet is for... 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 You mention the problem of deepstriking, doesnt the charnal court kinda metagate that? Potentially, yes, but it still doesn't really help you get into combat because you've got to keep stuff on the table and alive (so you don't get tabled), succeed your reserve rolls (likely necessitating a Comms Relay) and have the HQ themselves end up where you want them to- and then you're still looking at a bunch of units on foot trying to assault the enemy (albeit ones that start a lot closer than they otherwise might.) You're better off than you would be with a CAD, but you're giving up the opportunity to take other formations and it locks you into a particular subset of choices from an already-limited book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil_bryan Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 There is only one way to improve this thread. :) 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andozane Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Haven't you heard Bryan, there is nothing good to come from that book or cards...you should just return it now and save yourself :) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrainFireBob Posted March 27, 2015 Report Share Posted March 27, 2015 Picked mine up, too. I'm thinking that AP is underrating the blood tithe table a bit. Army wide FNP? The base formation isn't too bad if kept cheap, and rhinos count. It isn't meta changing, but is more tools for Chaos. Looking forward to looking for synergies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne_Cobbb Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 There is only one way to improve this thread. :) Khorne dog! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Picked mine up, too. I'm thinking that AP is underrating the blood tithe table a bit. Army wide FNP? The base formation isn't too bad if kept cheap, and rhinos count. Don't get me wrong- Blood Tithe, as an ability, is quite strong. The Ld check on the top two results is a bit annoying and probably didn't need to be there, but the mid-tier ones that not a lot of people are talking about are actually quite strong. Rage/FC, FNP, summoning solid units, etc, are all potentially very strong abilities and the formations give some very significant bonuses (1 free Tithe per turn and get a second lesser Tithe for free are both amazing.) The problem is that in order to use any of that great stuff, you have to either be getting into melee combat or losing significant numbers of models of your opponent's choice. Generating Blood Tithe is the problem, not what you do with it once you have it, because the only ways you can generate it in a controlled fashion are by getting into combat, which the codex is not actually very good at. There are two things that could potentially serve as redeeming factors- if you do, indeed, get Blood Tithe for any character regardless of how they are killed, that helps a ton (since it essentially means you're getting two Tithe per unit, not just one.) However, due to the wording of the rules and a number of other factors I doubt that was intended to be the case and the rule certainly isn't clear either way, so it will require a FAQ. Secondly, if Khornekin gets access to all of the IA13 and other Forge World stuff for Chaos, that makes them significantly strong, since it gives them access to a LOT more tools that they are otherwise lacking. However, once again I find this to be unlikely (though not impossible), so I'm of the feeling that the codex is going to be rather flat overall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted March 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Entertaining: character with BT axe. Use Daemon prince tithe on him to get a DP and a BT? When DP dies, get another BT since the prince keeps the axe? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted March 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 In fact, couldn't you keep using the DP tithe to keep making free BT? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 That's a lot of 8 pts to keep having to earn for the BTs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AgentP Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 From eyeballing the points, it looks like it would be pretty easy to run two Blood Host detachments (in events where multiple of the same detachment are allowed). That would give you +2 Blood Tithe per turn. The tax of 2 min units of possessed would have to be paid, however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Yeah, you could easily fit two of most any of those detachments; the "get a free Tithe" one also has some shenanigans since if you were to, say, get a Daemon Prince you could also get two units of Bloodcrushers or the like, as each formation's ability is separate. However, you're paying a pretty hefty tax in either case- for the Blood Host, for example, you need to take not only a unit of Possessed (who are pretty weak) but also two units of CSM/Berzerkers/Bloodletters, all of whom are quite mediocre. So you're sinking 350+pts into a bunch of units you don't really want twice, and then you get to start considering the things that are actually useful to your plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrainFireBob Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 At least their possessed don't waste a transport Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skkipper Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 How does this work since I never have used deepstrike on a fly monstrous creature. You deep strike which says you are swooping. So can you go to gliding in your movement and charge next turn. Or do you deepstrike and pick goobers Go to gliding next turn And be able to charge the next turn. So if you deepstrike bloodthirster on turn 2 can you charge turn three or do you have to wait until turn 4? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 You have to wait until Turn 4. - Turn 2: Deep Strike. You are Swooping for this Turn. - Turn 3: You change Flight Mode to Gliding. Because you changed Flight Mode, you can't Charge this Turn. - Turn 4: Because you're Gliding and did not change Flight Mode, you can now Charge. Note that it's based on Player Turns, not Game Turns, so if you get Grounded in your Opponent's Turn, you can then Charge in your own following Turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted March 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 Yeah, I think that either making sure you get the BTs with shooting or get tons of ground units will be a better idea. Also, make sure you DPs don't have wings. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skkipper Posted March 29, 2015 Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 So basically 8 blood points blood thirster is a waste Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted March 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2015 So basically 8 blood points blood thirster is a wasteIt's very dependent on situation. Ground dp or the other lesser rewards are better. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted April 3, 2015 Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 It just occurred to me, this is GWs response to "Why can't Khorne summon more Khorne?" Not the best response, but a pretty nifty one. Ya dig? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skkipper Posted April 3, 2015 Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 And by rules cashing in blood points and summoning happens before movement phase. So Summon bloodthirster Switch to not flying during movement phase Charge next turn if you survive getting shot in the face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 3, 2015 Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 Wondering. You think daemonology summoning power (possession) will allow these guys, or if they are somehow exempt from that power? It is true that daemonology specifically only summons the daemons from codex: daemons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted April 3, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 3, 2015 Demonology doesn't summon the new bts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generalripphook Posted April 4, 2015 Report Share Posted April 4, 2015 None of those models in khornekin are psykers are they? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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