targeting question

[Guest]

In 7th, can a unit target the transport, destroy it, then resolve an additional shooting attack against the transported unit (like via machine spirit, super heavy, or GC ability to target multiple units per turn)?

 

I think it's still no, but I don't recall. It was certainly a no in prior editions.

[indytims]

I am curious about this too...

 

Especially when you have a squad with mixed weapons, the rules say you 'choose a weapon', shoot all the models that have that weapon, completely resolve all attacks with that weapon (roll to wound, armor saves, etc).

 

Then, you select the next weapon in the squad and repeat.

 

So... you could theoretically have a heavy weapon guy go first, shoot a transport, resolve all damage it causes, wreck it, then choose the guys with bolters to begin another round of shooting at the guys that were inside....

 

Or am I misreading that?

[Guest Mr. Bigglesworth]

No same unit can not split fire on the shell and meat. Not even gc or super heavies that can fire multiple guns. I can't recall where it states, but as a knight player I was said to find the answer.

[VonVilkee]

The process you have there is correct but missing an important bit at the beginning.

 

First you pick a target, then follow your process. The bolters would be resolved after but you would attempt to resolve their shots against the dead rhino. Repeating the process of firing and damaging does not include picking a target, you pick the target then follow the outlined process circling back to repeat the steps just after target selection.

[Guest]

No same unit can not split fire on the shell and meat. Not even gc or super heavies that can fire multiple guns. I can't recall where it states, but as a knight player I was said to find the answer.

Sounds right. Anyone remember where this is? (That's the question)

[Guest]

So, Split Fire (pg172) says it can't target units forced to disembark a transport as a result of the unit's "initial attack."

[Guest]

Not seeing anything in the transport, GC, or super heavy section to suggest they can't target disembarked units. Might have missed something in that long transport section, though.

[Guest]

Nothing in Machine Spirit either.

 

The only thing I can think of, is that normal shooting requires declaring target prior to resolving any weapons. If you can target multiple things, perhaps you have to declare your targets prior to all shooting....? If so, I've been playing super heavies wrong...

 

Split fire seems to be the exception, as it seems to allow a target to be shot after the rest of the unit shoots at the initial target.

[VonVilkee]

It comes down to the order of operands as I outlined. The unit picks a target ( super heavies may select multiple) you the resolve shooting. As selecting a target is prior to the repeated process of firing weapons all the targets must be selected and valid before any shots are actually resolved. Show me where it says to select a target for each model/equipment category.

 

Unit selects target, then you resolve each equipment category one at a time in an order of the owning player's choice.

[VonVilkee]

@Pax yes split fire is that awesome, and better than being a super heavy. Unit basically counts as two separate ones with the transport caveat spelled out.

[Guest]

It comes down to the order of operands as I outlined. The unit picks a target ( super heavies may select multiple) you the resolve shooting. As selecting a target is prior to the repeated process of firing weapons all the targets must be selected and valid before any shots are actually resolved. Show me where it says to select a target for each model/equipment category.

 

Unit selects target, then you resolve each equipment category one at a time in an order of the owning player's choice.

Your probably right. Though split fire seems to be worded a bit differently. As written, unit declares a target, split fire model fires at a different target, then unit fires at it's initial target.

[indytims]

The process you have there is correct but missing an important bit at the beginning.

 

First you pick a target, then follow your process. The bolters would be resolved after but you would attempt to resolve their shots against the dead rhino. Repeating the process of firing and damaging does not include picking a target, you pick the target then follow the outlined process circling back to repeat the steps just after target selection.

 

Awesome! Thanks! :)

 

What had me confused is that I thought a dedicated transport was part of the 'unit' since it's bought for the unit, and when it wrecks and spits out its contents, you'd still be shooting at the 'same unit'. But your clarification makes sense.

 

Thanks Von!

[Guest]

There's an exception to the targeting rules for charging the contents of a transport you destroyed in the shooting phase.

[Guest Mr. Bigglesworth]

That is not an exception. It is a matter of order of operations. You declare your charge target in next phase. I get you cant charge a unit you didn't shoot that is the exception but the minute point you initially brought up this would not be the exception to that.

[Guest]

That is not an exception. It is a matter of order of operations. You declare your charge target in next phase. I get you cant charge a unit you didn't shoot that is the exception but the minute point you initially brought up this would not be the exception to that.

Huh? Sorry, not clear, was suggesting that perhaps this was where indytims was getting confused:

 

What had me confused is that I thought a dedicated transport was part of the 'unit' since it's bought for the unit, and when it wrecks and spits out its contents, you'd still be shooting at the 'same unit'.

[VonVilkee]

Awesome! Thanks! :)

 

What had me confused is that I thought a dedicated transport was part of the 'unit' since it's bought for the unit, and when it wrecks and spits out its contents, you'd still be shooting at the 'same unit'. But your clarification makes sense.

 

Thanks Von!

Under dedicated transports in the main book it states they are separate units during the game. Another tricky separate unit thing will be combat squads with Marines. The combat squads have to be made clear after mission before warlord traits and function as separate units for all game purposes with one special caveat that allows the two halves of the same purchased squad to occupy the same transport.

 

Hope that helps the next little how did two units spawn from that one vehicle if it ever does :)

[InfestedKerrigan]

whoops wrong thing.  my bad