Militarum Tempestus + Cadians

[Lord Hanaur]

2 hours ago, paxmiles said:

I don't have your army, but I've got armies that would traditionally deep strike (like my DA terminators, or just drop pods). The turn 2+ limitation isn't too bad, as previous editions were also turn 2+. The main thing is that 8e doesn't allow null deployment, so you have to include a ground force with your deep strikers, which is thematically annoying. 

Buildings might be a good route for pure Militarum Tempestus deep strikers. Put a few bastions with embarked scion squads on the table, then deep strike the rest. Those buildings are difficult to remove, that bastion being T9 with 3+ armor and 20 wounds for under 200pts. The building fire output is hamstringed by the static BS5+ of buildings in this edition, so don't bother with weapon upgrades (since they pay for weapons as if they had better BS), but embarked units can fire out normally so they aren't without shooting. Bastions are also amazing Line of Sight blockers (great for indirect firing tanks, or to conceal light transports turn 1).

 

I had not considered a bastion.  Ill have to ponder that.  Certain enemies like gsc can overrun you pretty damn swiftly. If you can fire on them while they chomp at your bastion, that could be useful.

[Guest]

23 minutes ago, Lord Hanaur said:

I had not considered a bastion.  Ill have to ponder that.  Certain enemis like gsc can overrun you pretty damn swiftly. If you can fire on them while they chomp at your bastion, that could be useful.

The other drawback to the building rules is that they hold a max of 1 unit (plus any number of characters), totally a max of 20 models. Unlike like the vehicle transport rules, which allow multiple units. So only 1x unit of scions per bastion. 

Still, could work. Bastion, or one of the other big building options. That plasma obliterator is basically the same as a bastion in terms of cost (bastions are screwed by the cost of their heavy bolters). 

[Lord Hanaur]

4 minutes ago, paxmiles said:

The other drawback to the building rules is that they hold a max of 1 unit (plus any number of characters), totally a max of 20 models. Unlike like the vehicle transport rules, which allow multiple units. So only 1x unit of scions per bastion. 

Still, could work. Bastion, or one of the other big building options. That plasma obliterator is basically the same as a bastion in terms of cost (bastions are screwed by the cost of their heavy bolters). 

That's too bad.  But it's still a consideration for a Volleygun unit.  They put out some decent pain.  The auras and orders don't work in there which is equally uinfortunate

[Lord Hanaur]

hmm, after looking into this I am not sure a Bastion is going to add more than it takes away.   I jujst can't really make the leap of faith to adding the bastion. Its enough points that it reduces the firepower enough whether they would have really firedat the one unit I build to put in there anyways in any given round.  Them ignoring the Bastion until last is sort of the equivalent of them saving that firepower for the units that ARE exposed.  Conversely, I'm unable to buff them making them less effective ad if they dont HAVE any better tragets turn one then I might just be making things easier on the enemy, giving them a good target to shoot instead of a bad one or hidden one.  Theres no hiding the bastion. Im not sure what fire it would divert to be honest and the enemy can avoid that Bastion once it goes down.  Another consideration.

I did give it a serious knoodle though.  Never ask for ideas if you're not wiling to knoodle them, so I did.

 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Lord Hanaur said:

hmm, after looking into this I am not sure it's going to add more than it takes away.   I jujst can't really make the leap of faith to adding the bastion. Its enough points that it reduces the firepower enough whether they would have really firedat the one unit I build to put in there anyways in any given round.  Them ignoring the Bastion until last is sort of the equivalent of them saving that firepower for the units that ARE exposed.  Conversely, I'm unable to buff them making them less effective ad if they dont HAVE any better tragets turn one then I might just be making things easier on the enemy, giving them a good target to shoot instead of a bad one or hidden one.  Theres no hiding the bastion. Im not sure what fire it would divert to be honest and the enemy can avoid that Bastion once it goes down.  Another consideration.

I did give it a serious knoodle though.  Never ask for ideas if you're not wiling to knoodle them, so I did.

 

You were talking about DS scion forces. My suggestion was the multiple fortifications and deep striking other units for turn 2+. Could even deploy a unit behind the building, and then embark turn 1, so as to have more units deployed on the table.

Anyway, I was suggesting buildings in general, rather than bastions specifically. I like the bastion, but for your small scion units, that Imperial bunker is probably a better choice. Costs half as much, plus it doesn't have to buy any weapons. Less toughness and less wounds, but much cheaper and easier to hide.

The Plasma Obliterator costs about as much as a bastion and has the same profile, just has alternate weaponry (2d6 shot 72" always overcharging plasma weapon instead of heavy bolters and optional turret). 

 

Anyway, I don't think the building rules are great in this edition. But if looking for a durable transport to hold out in while waiting to DS troops to do their thing, buildings are that.

 

Not that it matters for your scions, but another function of buildings is if you are trying to spam high toughness, things like the Vengeance Batteries and the Bunkers are T8 for about 100pts, which is cheap for T8.