Guest Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 The Stalker is pretty decent- it gets a bunch of shots that can at least hurt most anything and it's reasonably tough. With Wave Serpents so common it actually will tend to see some other use as well. Worst case scenario you drive 12" and fire snap shots at two different targets. The Hunter, sadly, is not as versatile and ranks a decent bit lower in my book. While it's incredibly dangerous to airplanes, that's basically all it can do, and it really only takes one good Jink save for it to be sad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 The Stalker is pretty decent- it gets a bunch of shots that can at least hurt most anything and it's reasonably tough. With Wave Serpents so common it actually will tend to see some other use as well. Worst case scenario you drive 12" and fire snap shots at two different targets. This actually reminds me of something that came up in a game a while ago: How does the Stalker's Searchlight work if it's targeting two different Units? We let it illuminate both, but couldn't find anything that really nailed it down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 This actually reminds me of something that came up in a game a while ago: How does the Stalker's Searchlight work if it's targeting two different Units? We let it illuminate both, but couldn't find anything that really nailed it down. Dunno, suppose it functions as the land raider does with PotMS. -Pax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 Yeah, we thought about that, but couldn't find anything about how that one functions either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 Yeah, we thought about that, but couldn't find anything about how that one functions either. That's sort of what I meant, they don't really have any clear answers. -Pax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Lord Chris Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 Lack of Interceptor, and the fact that you're chewing a whole HS slot just for a single dedicated-AA vehicle, make them kinda underwhelming. AV12 isn't terribly good, and lack of Interceptor means your opponent will have a whole shooting phase after his Flyers enter to prevent your AA tonk from shooting if he wants. They're cheap enough they won't hamstring you (much), but I can't see any scenario where I would rather have a Hunter/Stalker over putting those points towards a Thunderfire/Stormtalon/Fortification instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 Well, a Thunderfire doesn't shoot down airplanes, for one. Running 1-2 Thunderfires and 1-2 Stalkers (especially if you're allying into yourself) is a fairly solid plan. Lack of Interceptor certainly hurts, but AV12 and 4+ or 5+ cover should keep them reasonably safe. Stormtalons have the disadvantage of being very fragile and reliant on reserve rolls themselves- if your 'Talons come in before the other guy's stuff does, they are pretty much guaranteed to die; ditto if they have AA defenses of their own, like many armies will. And I don't see the Stalker as competing with a fortification but rather complementing it- the enemy can be reasonably expected to kill one AA platform before the second turn, but two or three is a lot less likely. It's exactly the same reason that a single Quad Gun alone isn't enough to realistically stop someone's airplanes- you need backups for everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaos Lord Chris Posted January 1, 2014 Report Share Posted January 1, 2014 AP, the Thunderfire doesn't need to shoot down planes, planes don't score objectives. Troops do, and guess what Thunderfires mulch? The issue is they're both in the HS slot, which is pretty busy for any Marine list that isn't Podspam or Bikes. There is just too much going on in the HS slot to justify taking sub-par AA platforms. Flyers aren't a huge issue for good SM lists, and good SM lists don't run Hunter/Stalkers, its just as simple as that. They don't do their job efficiently enough, and they're borderline incapable of doing anything outside their singular niche. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 Vendettas, Stormravens, and Night Scythes all carry troops that score objectives. :P How do good SM lists deal with Heldrakes, Night Scythes, and Vendettas, then? Not to mention FMCs. All of those are very real threats, and while you can ally in a little bit of stuff from Tau, you can damn well bet those are going to be #1 on the target list, and speaking from experience it's not that hard to kill a single unit of Broadsides. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroZero Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I'd argue that marines above all.armies desperately need extra AA. The Talon is a poor AA platform due to cost/survival The Raven is great but 1/10th of an army or more. Marines have zero issue putting down infantry. Every single slot has that in spades. Only one slot has viable AA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted January 2, 2014 Report Share Posted January 2, 2014 I like forcing grounding checks on flying monstrous creatures. The stalker will not kill things well but it keeps them honest. 75 points and mobility is cheaper than an aegis line and the tank can fire itself so doesn't require a baby sitter... Course I use a pod spam army :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 3, 2014 Report Share Posted January 3, 2014 I'd argue that marines above all.armies desperately need extra AA. The Talon is a poor AA platform due to cost/survival The Raven is great but 1/10th of an army or more. Marines have zero issue putting down infantry. Every single slot has that in spades. Only one slot has viable AA. I'm running DA, so it's worse for me. No raven. Two flyers that have the armor of the talon, but the hp of the raven and cost 160-180pts. Neither are very impressive at AA. I'd have to ally some SM to my army to take the stalker/hunter. As is, been running DA scouts with flakk missile launchers, allied vendettas(2), and sometimes a firestorm redoubt. We do have divination, so might be able to hit the flyers with devastator squads. -Pax Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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