DA terminators, making the most of their special rules?

[Guest]

Okay, so our DA terms have a bucket of special rules, not to mention, a stiff increase in points for basic terminators. I've been trying to make use of the special rules, but it's tough. Suggestions?

 

For specifics, we're got the TL while deep striking, the auto-arrive turn 1 or 2, split fire, fearless, prefered enemy CSM, not to mention a wide array of weapon options and even three types of dedicated transport.

 

Commonly, I've seen other DA players go with SS/TH terms with a cyclone, which does make for an impressive unit, but also costs an impressive 270pts. This build also can't make use of the split fire USR, as it only has a single shooting attack.

 

I will note that the split fire USR is better in this edition and permits attached ICs to make use of it instead of the squad.

 

Lately, I've been experimenting with using the split fire USR. This does lend me to including less of the SS/TH, which does lower survivability against low AP weapons. I don't think I have the hang of it yet, but there is certainly some potential here, I think.

 

I've also been experimenting with not fielding either of the special characters to enable our terminators as troops. It's interesting what an extra 190-215pts to spend can do for the army...

[WestRider]

I think the best thing you can do with Split Fire is use it to fire the Cyclone at one Unit while Charging another.

[Guest]

I think the best thing you can do with Split Fire is use it to fire the Cyclone at one Unit while Charging another.

You mean to allow a unit with 5 TH/SS models and a cyclone? It doesn't work like this. I require at least two models with ranged weapons in order to do this. Otherwise, split fire doesn't do anything, unless I'm misreading it.

[WestRider]

So keep one dude with a Storm Bolter and ChainFist. ChainFist is handy to have, one non-SS Termi doesn't hurt the Unit's survivability much, and then you can throw your Missiles at something across the board and a single Storm Bolter (which is unlikely to mess up your Charge Range by much) at what you want to Charge.

[Guest]

So keep one dude with a Storm Bolter and ChainFist. ChainFist is handy to have, one non-SS Termi doesn't hurt the Unit's survivability much, and then you can throw your Missiles at something across the board and a single Storm Bolter (which is unlikely to mess up your Charge Range by much) at what you want to Charge.

Okay, so any other builds come to mind?

 

I did have moderate results with a 10-man DW squad attached with azrael. It's use is specifically for holding objectives, as Azrael can pick the trait to make the unit FNP if within 3" of an objective, plus makes the non-SS/TH terms have a 4++.

 

Unit it otherwise really expensive and suffers if objectives aren't in use.

[WestRider]

If you're spending ~700 Points to hold a single Objective, I think I would just let you have that one and go for others or try to win on Secondaries.

 

The other thing I do sometimes, because I do have a lot of "tactical" DW Termies left over from 3rd/4th Ed is take Squads of 6-8 with 2 SS/TH. They're not great, and tend to suffer from good Opponents hitting them with massed high AP fire whenever a SS is closest, and then switch to the low AP stuff when the Shields are out of the way, but they look cool, and still have enough firepower to be some kind of threat when they drop in.

[BrainFireBob]

You mean to allow a unit with 5 TH/SS models and a cyclone? It doesn't work like this. I require at least two models with ranged weapons in order to do this. Otherwise, split fire doesn't do anything, unless I'm misreading it.

Why? You declare that the squad is shooting target a, then split fire the cyclone. No requirement they have guns.

[BrainFireBob]

 

Been thinking about this too. Wondering if Belial +10 termies would work for maelstrom. Assault cannons?

[Guest]

Why? You declare that the squad is shooting target a, then split fire the cyclone. No requirement they have guns.

An interesting understanding.

 

Page 30, Under the "nominate a unit to shoot" heading:

 

 

During the shooting phase, a unit containing models armed with ranged weapons can be nominated to make shooting attacks.

They are required to have at least one ranged weapon.

 

The TH/SS unit with the cyclone is a unit armed with a ranged weapon, so they are eligible for a shooting attack. You are correct that split fire doesn't require the unit to have a second weapon....hmmm...Assault phase only requires having targeted the unit in question.

 

Certainly doesn't seem RAI, but I'm not seeing any RAW against your understanding. Interesting.

 

Still, looking at 270pts for 5 wounds of terminators. Those super expensive special characters really don't help on this front.

[Last_Bullet]

What about Azreal with a 9 man tactical marine squad in a Drop Pod?  Azreal will be in the thick of it with his Termies.  3+/4+ and FnP while within 3” of an Objective (from Azreal choosing his warlord trait) is so very tanky.  I feel Azreal to be very worth the points.

 

But I find that its all or nothing with Terminators.  1 squad doesn’t seem to have enough threat or wounds.  I run four 5 man squads and that’s barely enough….

[Guest]

What about Azreal with a 9 man tactical marine squad in a Drop Pod?  Azreal will be in the thick of it with his Termies.  3+/4+ and FnP while within 3” of an Objective (from Azreal choosing his warlord trait) is so very tanky.  I feel Azreal to be very worth the points.

 

But I find that its all or nothing with Terminators.  1 squad doesn’t seem to have enough threat or wounds.  I run four 5 man squads and that’s barely enough….

Tactical squads would a waste with Azrael. Basically, adding a 215pt character to the unit dramtically increases enemy target priority while not really adding much. 4++ isn't really that impressive given that our army has a 30pt character upgrade for a 4++ to all within 3". The FNP is certainly nice, but I'm not too sure that it helps enough when you've got it on a 400pt unit standing next to an objective.

 

The terminators at 10-man do have quite a bit of threat, especially if you don't give them cyclones. Cyclones may be the best choice, but I've certainly found I generate more threat with the plasma cannon.

 

I will note, that if trying to maximize the Deathwing, those DW Knights are amazing. It is super important to note that every DW terminator has the inner circle rule, so having two DW knights in base contact with a DW terminator makes the "regular" terminator T5.

 

On a further note, Sammael has the inner circle rule while on his jetbike, so he can technically be made T6...as can other biker-mounted ICs with the inner circle USR. This is quite possibly related to why the DA have almost no eternal warrior access.

 

For a last note, the Command Squad champion for DW with that two-handed melee weapon is amazing. That weapon is awesome, being an ap2 weapon that strikes in initiative order at S6. Too bad taking it means no storm shield...

 

EDIT: Could try Azrael with Scouts. He makes them fearless and adds that 4++. If that unit goes with camo cloaks, and then you add a dark shroud, they can become "cover terminators" while behind a defense line.