Guest Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 At any rate, getting 3 results needing 6's and to hit and 5+ to glance/pen with 6 shots is highly unlikely. And to do it with 1 shot you have to roll 3 straight 6's or 2 6's and a 5, and then the other guy has to roll a 1-2. Saying that this is a normal result for you is ridiculous since if you roll like that all the time you'd never lose a game. lol I said they were consistently amazing, not that I have them sit all day and pot shots at SW flyers. I also mentioned that the DA in the rest of the army do not preform nearly as well. If you average the two, the DA remain about average. That whole codex is a few amazing units and a bunch of really under-par units. This is why they tend to be a common ally, but aren't often the main force. DA would be completely broken in an Unbound army.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 I don't trust any of the MathHammer calculators out there, I've seen most of them turn up blatantly wrong results at some point or another. I agree, I just use it for approximates. I knew it was low odds, on paper, so the 10% presented was reasonable enough for me. I did reference the site, rather than claiming it was my math, after all... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 . DA would be completely broken in an Unbound army.... Do tell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 Do tell. Well, those RW knights, in example, can be taken for 40pts per model via a 3-man RW command squad. 120pts. A very toolbox unit. Without much thought, I think I could smash most armies with 10-units of those. That would be 30 bikes with 60 TL plasma shots. Units aren't horrible in assault, either, as they have S5 paired rending melee weapons and 2 base swings per model. Models have stubborn, scout, and skilled rider. That's 1,200pts. 650pts free to make it into a normal size list. Probably want to add some cover denial, a psyker, a barrage/indirect unit, and some dedicated AT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 Meh. I thought there was something big you were aiming for. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 6, 2015 Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 Meh. I thought there was something big you were aiming for. Yeah, I could probably work something out a bit more grand. That entire DA codex is so heavy with unit taxes and FOC limitations which make even decent units less useful. Even those DA flyers wouldn't be half bad if we had unlimited Fast slots and didn't require HQ+troops. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 It occurred to me, if I'm running 3 Knights, I may consider running the Lance, instead. If I did this, would I still be able to choose one of the Knights as my Warlord, making it a Seneschal? So I'd be running an Adamantine Lance with the Archangels Sanguine Formation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 It occurred to me, if I'm running 3 Knights, I may consider running the Lance, instead. If I did this, would I still be able to choose one of the Knights as my Warlord, making it a Seneschal? So I'd be running an Adamantine Lance with the Archangels Sanguine Formation. Yes to the warlord, not sure regarding the seneschal (I suspect no). How does this relate to this thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Really? This is my thread, and you are asking how you guys derailing my topic relates to the thread? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 I was thinking about doing this as Loyalists, not my Nightlords that I was mentioning previously. The list is pretty straight forward, the Archangels Sanguine Formation and a 3 Knight Primary detachment. 30 Marines, 3 Knights, 1 Stormraven. Not very many models. Lots of room for unique modeling in so few models without feeling overwhelmed. My question is, how would you suggest progressing it in a League environment? I can't do the formation until 1000 points, so I'd be running it as an unbound list if I'm not adding anything else? I mean, if all the Sternguard have Combis, I can't run it as 2 x 5 man tact squads. Not without using magnets. Although, with 30 Marines being the max, that's not too much in the way of magnet work. Thoughts? Do I need to concern myself with Psychics in 7th? Original Post Quoted for Relation lol, Pax, I changed the name of the Thread after the conversation was derailed for several pages as a joke. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 lol, Pax, I changed the name of the Thread after the conversation was derailed for several pages as a joke. Right, forgot. Was just thinking it was an off the wall question about knights. I was hoping it had to do with the invisible deathstars, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 The Invisible Death Stars does make me contemplate looking into an IK/SW Great Company list with as many Psykers, Tech Priests, TW and Knights as I could get into it. Some sort of weird coven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 The Invisible Death Stars does make me contemplate looking into an IK/SW Great Company list with as many Psykers, Tech Priests, TW and Knights as I could get into it. Some sort of weird coven. Knights aren't exactly weak to the invisible stars. I mean, even if you require 6s to hit, D melee isn't to be laughed at. Stomp still works against invisible units, too. You also don't face the same issues regarding charging the unit you shoot, as you can target another unit with the primary weapon, heavy stubber the invisible unit, then charge the invisible unit. You could look into getting the knights an invulnerable save in melee. DA power field generators would probably be the easiest way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Oh, see, I was thinking about making the TWC Techpriests/stormpriests Invisible. But it's not my style, ultimately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Ad Lance is one of the best formations out there, you can't really go wrong with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Anyone else, as far as the Warlord in an Adamantine lance getting the Stat Boost or not? I believe it does, because in the IK Codex it says: KNIGHT WARLORDS If you are fielding an army where the primary detachment is made up of Imperial Knights, one Knight must be nominated as the Knight Warlord for the army. A Knight Warlord always has the rank of Seneschal. But I wasn't sure of AdLance has any rules saying otherwise. That's kinda what I was thinking, Fluger. a 3++ Front Save and 4++ Side save on all 3 Knights just screams, "But of course" to me. At least, that's how I understand it working. Like IG-2k, but with Shield Facing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Answer is yes to the warlord Seneschal in the adamantium lance formation. Took me a bit, see the updated GW FAQ regarding the knight codex. It's pretty specific that it doesn't matter what detachments you have, provided you have enough knights. 2 is the required number to have a Seneschal Warlord. The warlord can be a knight with only one knight in the army, but won't gain the Seneschal rule. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Notable weak point is that they must stay within 3" to benefit from formation. Means that if we kill 2, the other loses the benefits of the formation. That's kinda what I was thinking, Fluger. a 3++ Front Save and 4++ Side save on all 3 Knights just screams, "But of course" to me. At least, that's how I understand it working. Like IG-2k, but with Shield Facing. Not fully clear how this works. Just because they are a formation, doesn't make them a squadron. Each is still it's own unit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 As I understand the formation, as long as they are within 3" of another member of the formation, the Knight gains the Ion Shield facing of other members of the Formation. X Y Z You have X go with Port Shields, Y takes Forward Shields, and Z takes Starboard. As long as X and Z are 3" from Y, all 3 gain Starboard, Port, and forward Ion Shields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 As I understand the formation, as long as they are within 3" of another member of the formation, the Knight gains the Ion Shield facing of other members of the Formation. X Y Z You have X go with Port Shields, Y takes Forward Shields, and Z takes Starboard. As long as X and Z are 3" from Y, all 3 gain Starboard, Port, and forward Ion Shields. Are we looking at a different formation? The one I'm looking at is in Santus reach: The Red Waaagh! Only listed rule is this: "Lance, Shield and Sword: As long they are within 3" of another Knight from this formation, Knights from this formation can re-roll failed saves for their ion shields. Furthermore, as long they begin the Assault phase within 3" of another Knight from this formation, Knights from this formation can re-roll their charge distances, and inflict D3 Hammer of Wrath hits when they charge instead of 1." Nothing about sharing shields. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Admittedly, I have not read Red War, and have not read the Formations actually entry, which is why I had the questions about it. My impression about shared shielding could very well come from misunderstanding tactical use of the shield re-roll. Controlling Fire Lanes and such to protect as many arcs as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 20, 2015 Report Share Posted January 20, 2015 Admittedly, I have not read Red War, and have not read the Formations actually entry, which is why I had the questions about it. My impression about shared shielding could very well come from misunderstanding tactical use of the shield re-roll. Controlling Fire Lanes and such to protect as many arcs as possible. I think there is a FW/apoc formation that works like you were suggesting. You can still get a cover save from the other knights in the formation, as they are vehicles in different units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 http://bloodofkittens.com/formation-compendium/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted January 21, 2015 Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 As I understand the formation, as long as they are within 3" of another member of the formation, the Knight gains the Ion Shield facing of other members of the Formation. This is incorrect. Each Knight still has its own Ion Shield that works just as normal, but so long as you are within 3" of another model in the formation you can reroll failed saves with your Ion Shield. (It also does the reroll charges and extra impact hits stuff, but that's irrelevant to the discussion at hand.) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InfestedKerrigan Posted January 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted January 21, 2015 Yeah, I went back and re-read what it was I had read previously and saw where I went wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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