Xavier319 Posted December 27, 2015 Report Share Posted December 27, 2015 Alright, Raptor's Chapter Tactic says... "Strike from the shadows (As per the raven guard chapter tactic in codex: space marines): Models in this detachment have the Scout special rule. In addition, on the first game turn, models in the detachment have the Stealth special rule. Note that units which contain models with any variant of the bulky special do not benefit from either rule." Now, I have always assumed that what is written out in the PDF takes priority. My question is, does the new version of 'strike from the shadows' in the SM codex take priority? I personally do not think so for two reasons. One, the new book is "Codex Adeptus Astartes: Space Marines" not "Codex: Space Marines", so the reference is invalid on that face. Also, the FW PDF specifically writes out the chapter tactic, the fact that it refers to another (now defunct) rule, doesn't matter. Now, I'm not trying to power game or be silly, I'm legitimately trying to interpret RAW here. What do you think the RAW is? Is there an accepted norm I'm not aware of? In some articles on Frontline gaming (recent ones), the article implies that the old chapter tactic is kept. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IW Raptors Posted December 27, 2015 Report Share Posted December 27, 2015 In a rush, but here is the link I found on it: http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/282371-raptors-chapter-tactics/?p=4092603 So not 100% official, but I reckon they use the updated strike from the shadows rule as per the current codex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier319 Posted December 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 27, 2015 Hmmm Oh well, I liked the old one better. but it's not official at all. so would i have to ask at EVERY tournament to see which one they are using? that's a damn hassle. this is one email from a FW guy. well... is there anything that states what the community as a whole uses? I'll go with the new one, that's fine. I just wish they'd actually definitively faq things. But if i wanted that, i'd play another game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IW Raptors Posted December 28, 2015 Report Share Posted December 28, 2015 Not sure, seems the community is split. I know Frontline use the old ruling in their twitch games, but I doubt anyone has questioned them on it. I imagine allot of people just assume they have the old scout and Stealth 1st turn rule. I'd prefer it to shrouding and +1 to night fight myself! Tbh it's one of those, you could probably run the old version and no one would ever question it. But, I think on balance, the email from a forgeworld rep pushes it for me, that the new ruling is the strike from the shadows rule as per the current SM codex. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier319 Posted December 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 I hate to say this, but i've gotten rulings from FW and from GW< from two separate people, saying two separate things. so until an official faq comes out, i know that email was that one person's thoughts on it. IF the guys ate frontline are taking raptors to tournaments and using the printed rules, then i'm fine with that. Honestly, we cant start interpreting RAI, we have to go with RAW until a generally accepted interpretation is handed down. At least that's my two cents. Urk. I was all excited to make this army, now I cant even get a ruling that most agree on to let me know what my CT even does. beh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 Yeah, GW e-mails are worse than useless. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier319 Posted December 29, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 Yeah. as for RAI, I don't think we can do that. it was obviously FWs intent to have the fire angel's assault squads be like troops, and made them 'scoring'. now, that would mean ob sec, but it doesn't say that, so the rule does nothing. and no one makes that argument, since that is what was written down.. so.. go with what's written until it's changed The Raptor's chapter tactic states its like the raven guard, but that has since been changed. so it is no longer like the raven guard, it is what i written in the PDF. intent or not. if it gets FAQed, i'll adjust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IW Raptors Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 I actually emailed Forgeworld myself, and the customer rep said that they planned to update them with an FAQ, but in the meantime to "discuss it with your gaming group". So you'd be right, in that responses by email certainly aren't official. RAW, I think it's a toss up honestly, unless you're really nitpicky and say Codex: Space Marines no longer exists. Best to fly it by your gaming group and tournaments. I don't think any large tournament group that I know of have officially FAQ it. I've played it with the new ruling myself, but tbh never looked into it too much. My group does tend to play by RAW though, so maybe I should pass it by them. It makes a big difference, I'd certainly rather scout+stealth! :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nurglecron Posted December 29, 2015 Report Share Posted December 29, 2015 I actually emailed Forgeworld myself, and the customer rep said that they planned to update them with an FAQ, but in the meantime to "discuss it with your gaming group". So you'd be right, in that responses by email certainly aren't official. That's just the boilerplate answer. I keep asking about updates to IA12 for Necrons, and they refuse to give a straight answer despite that they probably won't come out with a Version 2 anytime soon. Bleh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier319 Posted December 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 Yeah. I am getting so many different answers from so many different people it's infuriating. RAW it's scout+stealth. As I said before, Fire Hawks dont get ob sec, even though that was clearly the intention, and mantis warriors getting divination does nothing, so you go with what's written, regardless of how much sense it makes. Anyone disagree? I honestly want to know, since it'll completely change how things are played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted December 30, 2015 Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 I typically go with what the rules say, as opposed to what the designers might have meant them to say. Only one of those things is directly knowable, and trying to understand what Forge World wants rules to do is like delving into the thoughts of a psychotic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier319 Posted December 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 30, 2015 I typically go with what the rules say, as opposed to what the designers might have meant them to say. Only one of those things is directly knowable, and trying to understand what Forge World wants rules to do is like delving into the thoughts of a psychotic. Amen Brotha. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IW Raptors Posted January 14, 2016 Report Share Posted January 14, 2016 You might be interested to know, I emailed frontline gaming the rules query and the ITC is running the old rule interpretation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xavier319 Posted January 15, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2016 Alright, good to know! I didnt see it in their FAQ. I built the list to be able to run with either rules interpretation. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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