AscentStudios

My fav thing about so many of these posts are the, "I don't play Nids, but I think the dex is good." Even the posted links. Perhaps give the folks with some skin the game a bit more credence at least.

Though I'm a casual player, I still like to compete (for sh*t-talking purposes - that's how my group rolls), so the "power level" may be some of it. But honestly, I started bugs in 5th ed, when everyone else was dumping them in nerdrage over the loss of the 4th ed codex, and it never bothered me. They've been my go-to army in 75% of my games since the dex came out, and that's over IG... In the end, I think the play style is just not a play style - it's management of your weaknesses. It's less like play and more like work. Your strategy is not, "let's try this cool thing to outfox my opponent," but rather "let's try to hold the army together long enough I can do some damage." Even in the previous edition, losing Synapse was obnoxious, but that web was (and should be) part of the overall thinking. Fortunately, there were things that made the trouble worthwhile. However, the new edition and the new dex combined have really left this army in the dust - Bugs don't get access to 2 of the edition's biggest advancements (new psychic powers, allies) nor do they get anything to give them an edge in, or even mitigate the changes to, assaults from 5th to 6th ed (such as assaulting out of reserves, moving into assault faster, avoiding overwatch, etc.). In the end, this book *could* have existed in 5th edition and played just fine...which means it completely missed the boat on what a new edition's book should be. TL; DR - my point is, when I play, i want to play. I want to spend the game thinking about maneuvers and odds and looking ahead, not fretting about how to keep my army's single advantage (widespread Fearless via Synapse) in play and/or whether my troops will stop functioning and/or *literally start killing each other* when it's gone. Spending your whole game having to react rather than getting into a proactive position is just not fun.

Gee-whilikers, really? Methinks you were responding to my first paragraph, which was stated as a *test* of the codex, and not the contents of what I actually had to say about the Tyranid army's performance...so let me clarify. OF COURSE I expected my army list to change, because duh - new codex. However, my list changed more than most as it lost the Spores and thus much of its ability to do what it did. I ran a test of that old list in order to see just how badly that concept was compromised. Let's just grit our teeth, say I got burned, and call that water under the bridge. The real point here is that no matter how much I change this list or make another, nothing will change the my observations about the play ecosystem of Synapse and Instinctive Behavior, nor the robotic effect it has both on the army AND how you play that army. I will say this for the design team - it's apparent to me they were miffed that IB: Feed went from being a disadvantage in 5th to an occasional advantage in 6th (thanks to the Rage USR losing the "must charge closest" caveat), and so they went to a lot of trouble to make absolutely sure you never want to ignore Synapse. Mission accomplished fellas!

FWIW, I played with the closest approximation of my old list (Dropship Buggers), vs. my normal Necron opponent, using the normal level of terrain we play with, and have just gotten ROFLstomped. Lack of Catalyst plus the Terv nerfs (esp Synaptic Backlash and the inability to pass off Biomorphs) really, really hurts - he Telsa-Destructored the crap out of them and bang, there go most of my obligatory Gaunt squads. This is Turn 2, btw. I had to completely change my counter-assualt to make sure my Feeders (Ravs, Horms) weren't out of Synapse lest they stop fighting the bad guys and eat each other instead What's driving me nuts most of all is that I can't get past the feeling that IB is a massive Achilles' Heel which most armies can exploit almost at will, both in play and with the player. The way you protect delicate units in all other armies is cover and reserve - but with most Synapse being large it makes getting LOS all too easy, and IB actively screws you if you DON"T have your babysitters. I can't think of any other army whose armywide rules are an active disadvantage AND a way to nullify that disadvantage. The bigger issue for me was tracking IB - as I started to lose Synapse (because it's going to happen), I found myself staring at the board trying to figure out what my critters were likely to do in its absence, then double checking, moving synapse back in, remeasuring at the start of each turn and having to randomize what everything does. Feels a lot more like a geometry class than a game, and adds approximately ZERO to the gameplay experience of running Nids. It's just another housekeeping thing to do for the "benefit" of playing the army. That's pretty crappy.

The fix to this codex is easy IMO, but not as singular as Fluger puts it. For the most part, a few changes to the general rules of the army to make their army-wide rule (IB and Synapse) not as punitive/"tax-y;" fixing some of the general laziness of the design (by fixing the units that were already crap to make them at least less crap - 'cept for Sky Slashers...I've got no ideas there); and looking at them in the context of available army lists (Daemons, I'm looking at you) would bring them up to par pretty damn quickly. Note I have not changed a lot of other things people are bitching about. Lash whips, for example, work much better IMO as +3I in the new assault system, as it doesn't completely undermine fast characters nor rely on counting BTB models or make assault even slower to resolve. I can also live with Hive Mind Powers and without Biomancy...as long as we have other options to replace them. My list: General Rules: * Tyranids gain access to Telepathy and Telekinesis BRB powers (Fluger's right that Biomancy is largely redundant, and these Disciplines represent a much more dangerous psychic presence hinted in older fluff) * Instinctive Behavior goes from a 1-3/4-5/6 to 1/2-5/6 split (making it risky to leave synapse, but greatly mitigating the negative effects of IB: Feed on the units that have it - which happen to also be the units that are most likely to outrun synapse...Raveners and Hormaguants being prime examples. IB: Feed is the single worst rulechange in the entire book). IB is still a thing this way, and still messes up your control of the unit (Feeders must assault, Lurkers must hide, Hunters must shoot) but is not outright damaging and cumbersome in list-building and play. * Synapse grants 6+ FNP (this one's iffy, but a small gimme would be great for encouraging people to take Synapse, and for keeping your Synapse Critters in the game) * New Rule - Mycetic Assault: Any unit containing 1 Monstrous Creature; up to 5 Very Bulky models; up to 10 Bulky models; or up to 20 infantry models can choose to Deep Strike for 50 points. These models begin play in Reserve and deploy per the Drop Pods rule (Boom, no models needed and still costs a premium over more Deep-Strikey armies). * New Rule - Ambush Assault: Unit can assault on the first turn of the game, and on the turn it arrives from Reserve or Deep Strikes Weapons Changes: * Scything Talons rule returns to reroll 1s in assault if you have any (no benefit for two pairs - that's replaced by the second set of CCWs rule in current dex. They can keep or lose AP 6 for all I care). Wow, they're no longer totally worthless on most critters that have them! * Crushing Claws give +2 STR and Armorbane * Spore weapons get cleaned up - they're a goddamn mess right now. HQ: * Hive Tyrant gains a new rule: Hive Mind Scion: Gains +/-1 to all Reserves roll. Can gain 2+ save for 35 points, exclusive of Wings. * Tervigon becomes Monstrous Creature (Character); Brood Progenitor tests are made against the Tervigon's Ld; Synaptic Backlash has a distance of 2d6" rather than 12". * Tyranid Prime cost reduced back to 100 pts. * Deathleaper gains Ambush Assault rule Troops: * Tyranid Warriors can gain Bonded Exoskeleton for +5 points/model. * Genestealers reduced to 12 points each and gain Ambush Assault. Scything talons reduced in points to 2 pts/model. Can take Flesh Hooks at 2 pts/model. Upgrade to Ymgarl stealers (gain Ymgarl Factor rule, per the bio artifact) for +4 points each * Hormagaunt Toxin Sacs reduced to 2 pts each Elites: * Doom of Malantai: Returned, but costs 150 pts and cannot trade out its power. * Hive Guard BS returned to 4, and WS lowered to 3 * Venomthropes gain Fleet * Lictors gain Ambush Assault rule * Pyrovores gain Torrent (Probably have to increase their cost by +10 pts); can take Toxin at 3 pts and Adrenal at 5 pts (as Hive Guard) Fast: * Harpy and Crones may reroll failed Grounding Tests Yeah, I think that's it. For Supplements, I would add Genestealer Cult as a supplement codex. Allying with yourself is some silly sh!t.

Pax, FWIW, Escalation is so widely lambasted (from what I'm hearing from players and the interwebz) that I don't know it's really worth considering as an extension of any codex. I may be butthurt about the new bug codex, but far more folks are butthurt about superheavy anything in regular games of 40k :)

I don't take Sean's performance as a median measure of a unit's ability on the tabletop :) There were plenty of outlier events going on in that prince's demise (Seth's incredibly accurate Overwatch fire being one big one). The Prince still lived for most of the game despite his crappy rolling - if Fed had been using him I would have seen that guy last a lot longer. Regardless, doing the taste test of a Prince vs. a Harpy/Crone - not a whole lot of comparison.

This has been my point all week. Daemons have effectively taken the slot the Nids once filled in the 40k army ecosystem. They're the great psykers now; strong, effective melee throughout; appropriately costed fast, Rending troops (Daemonettes); generally terrifying MCs (Greater Daemons, Princes); badass FMCs (princes, 'Thirster), and plenty of world-effecting stuff that adversely affects the enemy (Storm of Chaos). The only thing Bugs have really got is Nidzilla now.

To the OP's question - I think Nidzilla is the Tyranids' last "special thing." Having lost any sort of real psychic threat, cheap expendable troops (thanks to IB's new bite or the Synapse "tax" to avoid it), or particularly strong melee options (no scytals really hurts), T6 and the ability to put MCs in nearly every Force Org slot is their thing now. With the discount on Tyrants and Carnifexen, models for Crones and Harpies, and addition of the Haruspex and Exocrine, you can put a lot out there. From my experience, Shrikes bite @$$. The 5+ save makes them extremely expensive bolter-bait. Of course, my solution back in the day was to use Warriors in a pod instead (using the Pod to block LOS, and they were rocking a 4+ save which makes a HUGE difference in survivablity vs. small arms...). I have had a great deal of success with Raveners - they're beasts (meaning 12" movement, not slowed by difficult terrain), Fleet, rocking 4A each (3 + double weapons), can get Rending cheap, and can Deep Strike which has long been a part of my 6th ed Bug strategy. Considering the price to durablity/damage output, I find them point for point better than Genestealers. Many other folks swear by Gargoyles as well, and I imagine that will continue as we see more Flyrants out there.

The changes to Instinctive Behavior make me think Synapse has gone from being a thing you want, to a thing you must have (a *tax*). In the past, most of my lists used 3-4 Synapse units, but now it appears we'll start to give up Troops slots for minimum Warriors or Elite slots for Zoanthropes in order to keep our weenie units from eating each other. My first stop was to start upgrading Trygons to Primes (as they're at the core of my lists), and making sure I'm using at least 2 other HQ units with Synapse. What I'm not crazy about is using point-efficient warriors (e.g. cheap as possible) as I think the Nids best play is to do as much damage as possible rather than trying to hold on for the late game.

The melee army with good pysker powers is now Daemons. Nids have OK psykers, but if you really want to run heavy Psychic powers look to Daemons. That's probably the biggest single disappointment to me - that Nids appear to have been cornered as "Nidzilla or GTFO" as their niche, rather than having the hive mind be anything more than a detriment.

If you have a decent size collection, prolly not. Exocrine's range IMO is too short. Crones are the better flyer, but at $80 I wouldn't bother if you're not competitive. Flyrants are an even better buy, so getting some Wings may be a good idea. Overall, the new models add very little to the list. If you have Nidzilla stuff, you've got everything you need.

Instinctive Behavior is the biggest gift a Nid list can give its opponent. Shoot the synapse, then the big ones. The little ones will self-destruct once they lose those support elements. Don't fret about psychic defense - what little offense Nids have in terms of powers is weak at best. Stay in cover. Assault grenades are either too rare or too expensive to worry about.

Fortunately, Formations are only allowed in Apoc.

What the f*cking F*CK. Seriously. Seriously.

Site is incorrect. Exocrine is a heavy (I do have a codex).

And 3 guard helps this how? 2 units of 2 generates 33% more shots...

So I did the Pepsi Challenge with my last 5th edition list (deep-strike heavy bug list, "Dropship Buggers") with the new codex to see how things worked out points wise. Everything in the list with an * is Deep Striking; ** means it Deep Strikes and doesn't count against the Reserves limit. Here's the result: 2000/2000 “Dropship Buggers” List V3 - 5th Edition [190] Tervigon (160) + Scything Talons (5) + Catalyst (15) + Toxin Sacs (10) [190] Tervigon (160) + Scything Talons (5) + Catalyst (15) + Toxin Sacs (10) [100] 2 Hive Guard (100) [100] 2 Hive Guard (100) [130] Doom of Mal’antai (90) + Spore (40)** [200] 20 Hormagaunts (120) + Toxin Sacs (40) + Mycetic Spore (40)** [240] 4 Warriors [120] + Lashwhip/bonesword [60] + Toxin Sacs [20] + Mycetic Spore (40)** [175] 5 Raveners (150) + Rending Claws (25)* [250] Trygon Prime (200) + Prime (40) + Toxin Sacs (10)* [210] Trygon (200) + Toxin Sacs (10)* [135] 3 Biovores [70] Aegis Defense Line (50) + Comms Array (20) 2000/2000 Dropship Buggers Update for 6th Ed codex [210] Tervigon (195) + Adrenal Glands (15) [130] Deathleaper [110] 2 Hive Guard [110] 2 Hive Guard [150] 30 Hormagaunts [210] Tervigon (195) + Adrenal Glands (15) [120] 30 Termagants [210] 6 Raveners (180) + Rending Claws (30)* [120] 20 Gargoyles* [240] Trygon Prime (230) + Toxin Sacs (10)* [240] Trygon Prime (230) + Toxin Sacs (10)* [80] 2 Biovores [70] Aegis Defense Line (50) + Comms Array (20) This list is an approximation of the previous codex using the new rules of the 6th ed codex. Markedly weaker in terms of psychic power, though I only ever used Catalyst in the list. Obviously, I had to drop the Doom and both pods, and I chose to drop the warriors cause they'd now need to slog down the field in order to do anything (e.g. they'd do nothing unless they came out of a tunnel). In the final estimation I lost: * Doom of Malantai * 2 Pods * 4 Warriors * 1 Biovore * Poison on Hormagaunts And I gained: * Deathleaper * 30 Termagants * Scoring Tervigon * 20 Gargoyles * 10 Hormagaunts Overall assessment: Pretty much a wash. Flyers give me fits, as they always have (Flyrants never fixed my antiair problems). Losing reliable Catalyst sucks donkey's balls, as it was critical for keeping either the Tervigons or the Trygons alive into the late game, where they start wrecking havoc in the enemy lines - here's hoping for 1's on the Psychic table! The drop in Horm points makes a larger brood nearly statistically identical to a smaller, poisoned brood of the same size in terms of damage vs MEQ, with the added bonus of the new Bounding Leap and more bodies to suck up wounds coming in. Deathleaper is a nice addition for this list thanks to the vastly improved Deep Strike Accuracy for Trygons, Gargoyles and Raveners, and combined with DSing Shadow in the Warp should help nail down annoying psychic dominance. Changes and Updates: Things I would probably change in this list is to make it even faster. Dropping 1 Tervigon, Deathleaper, Horms and Gargoyles would let me add 2 dakka flyrants + 2 Crones, giving me greater speed and anti-air capacity, plus the forward synapse I need for a list like this plus it provides a great deal more opportunities to use Deep Strike and Reserves freely. Now that Tervs spawn their broods at the end of movement, Outflanking with them via Hive Commander and spawning scoring units becomes a thing again. This list's downsides are significantly greater reliance on the Terv to keep me in the objective scoring game, and less-reliable Reserves rolls due to the loss of the Aegis + Comms Array (no one is back there to run it anymore). So I expect it will need some tweaking but IF I'm willing to put more money into my bugs this would be where I'd be leading: 2000/2000 Dropship Buggers – New for 6th Ed codex [250] Tyrant (165) + Wings (35) + 2 x Devourers with Brainleech (30) + Hive Commander (20)* [230] Tyrant (165) + Wings (35) + 2 x Devourers with Brainleech (30)* [110] 2 Hive Guard [110] 2 Hive Guard [210] Tervigon (195) + Adrenal Glands (15) + Electroshock Grubs (10)* [120] 30 Termagants [210] 6 Raveners (180) + Rending Claws (30)* [155] Hive Crone* [155] Hive Crone* [240] Trygon Prime (230) + Toxin Sacs (10)* [200] Trygon (190) + Toxin Sacs (10)*

I've got a draft Genestealer Cult codex/dataslate/supplement (dunno what they'd call it nowdays) that is pretty big - however I drafted it last summer and it needs to be updated for the new Tyranid normal. Perhaps I can jam on it with DisruptiveConduct...

I find it ironic that you, of all people, would refer to "only viable build" for any army ever, fluger :) I've run Nids successfully since the dreaded 5th ed codex came out and never focused on biomancy (namely cause I could roll a 2 and get Iron Arm to save my life). While yes, I used Tervigons and Trygons as the core of the build, I've never run an FMC in 6th and preferred instead the tanked-up 2+ regenerating double-dev Tyrant when I used one at all. Sad thing is my bug list was built around deep striking with spores, Ravs, Trygons, and backed up by a comms array - and now it sounds like nearly all of that has gone the way of the dodo :(

Agreed. I hope the bugs have a larger selection of powers if only they are the biggest single Psychic presence in the galaxy. The power I'm gonna really miss is Telepathy - though not having biomancy on Tyrants or Broodlord's kinda blows. The bigger issues I have with what I'm seeing is the laziness. There were so many opportunities to make very small tweaks (minor point reduction on Stealers, adding Torrent to Pyrovores, making Warriors a tiny bit better, tweaking stuff beyond points costs) and they seemed to miss everything beyond points reductions. Add to that the fact they're taking away more from the bugs without adding anything to compensate (still no Allies, only one power list, perhaps no fortifications) and it is a bit depressing - esp considering they didn't really need to be nerfed further.

I think, as with many fields, you'll find the vast majority of game designers do not hold "related" degrees\. Take myself for instance. Spycraft 2.0, which I designed, was widely lauded for having a very balanced, tightly integrated set of RPG rules spread across half a million words - and I have a degree in Russian, Writing, and Sociology. FWIW I also worked for years in web analytics and content management with those same degrees, and no one ever questioned my capacity based on my educational background. What matters is if you can understand and analyze a system of rules interactions, and innovate on the established base - e.g. "the work."

Someone got a hold of the very old "Wizard with a Machine Gun" fig NIB and put it on eBay... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Warhammer-40k-Games-Workshop-Citadel-Rouge-Trader-OOP-NIB-Wizard-/221349979506?&_trksid=p2056016.l4276 At least you get free shipping.

I use HKs in my IG the same way I use Havoc MLs in my Chaos: to upgun my transports. Transports are so often anti-infantry that most players don't factor them as a potential threat to armor. Giving a Chimera the ability to take an attack of opportunity at exposed rear armor, or finish off another damaged transport/light armor, has proven handy to me, generally more so than a pintel heavy stubber. FWIW, both the US (Bradley) and Soviet (BMP series) militaries did exactly the same thing.