Harlequins with Eldar Cast of Players Question

[Prophecy]

I was reading over the Harlequin codex and it seems to me the simplest squad to actually use might be the best. The Cast of Players is actually a decent squad and I was wondering how I can use it properly in conjunction with codex Eldar. What squads actually benefit from the crusader rule properly?

[Guest]

Not eldar/harly player, but I've done Minotaurs/black templars which also have the crusader rule. The additional initiative on sweeps is too contextual to plan around, but the 2d6 (pick the highest) is amazing on units which can afford to forgo the shooting phase. In particular, I've found that models which already have move through cover to be very impressive with the Crusader rule as they really zip through terrain almost as fast as vehicle do.

 

In my case, that's scouts, but for eldar, howling banshees or striking scorpions come to mind, though I don't recall if they have move through cover.

 

One thing notable is that the bonus initiative on sweeps is used both when you win combat and when you lose it, it applies to both sweeping and getting swept. It does have some defensive value for non-fearless units which lose combat against a very high initiative opponents. For SM, that's eldar, but for eldar, I think that's only other eldar and some daemons.

[Prophecy]

I traded away my banshees as they don't work for me much but I do love some scorpions so that could be useful. I want to run infantry Eldar like I use to but it doesn't seem plausible.

[Guest]

I traded away my banshees as they don't work for me much but I do love some scorpions so that could be useful. I want to run infantry Eldar like I use to but it doesn't seem plausible.

Assuming you don't need the slots, the banshees are pretty awesome, I think. They cost very similar to assault scout marines and zip across the battlefield on foot and with power swords. I'd keep small units and keep them in cover when not assaulting. They aren't amazing, but they are worth the 75pts, or so, that they represent in pure foot slogging melee potency.

 

That said, they are not a strong unit and are very much suicidal. They need to be sacrificed to enable other units to function, not just wastefully dying to suicide.

 

Scorpions are cool too, but as a marine player, they really aren't as good as scout marines, so I have that bias. The scouts are stock S4 and have S6 krak grenades on every model. Scouts are cheaper and troops slot. In an eldar army, they do have value, but it is limited. Marine armies with troops assault marines think even less of striking scorpions.

[WestRider]

Well, for Eldar it's a different deal, because they've got Battle Focus, which means they don't waste their Shooting Phase if they Run, but on the other hand, most of them already have Fleet, so the help on their Run moves isn't as necessary. I would actually say it's more useful for short-ranged firepower Units like Fire Dragons, Guardians, or Dire Avengers, making them much more reliable at getting extra Range or enough distance to successfully shoot'n'scoot. Remember that the Re-roll from Fleet does stack with upgrades like Crusader that offer extra dice.

[VonVilkee]

And that fleet is reroll any specific die not the whole roll! So roll two fours keep one reroll the other, oh man the possibilities!

[Prophecy]

Exactly I know a good thing when I see one but I am trying to figure out how to use it properly.

[AbusePuppy]

Crusader is a pretty weak rule, overall; Eldar are already Fleet and have high Initiative, so neither of the bonuses are particularly impressive for them (nor do they really want to be getting into CC in the first place.)

 

However, the important thing about the Cast of Players is that it gets you both a Shadowseer and a Death jester at minimal additional investment. Those two are the two best things in the book, which makes the Cast an attractive "ally" option.

[Prophecy]

I disagree perhaps it could be useful on a large footslogging wraithblade unit.

[Guest]

Crusader is a pretty weak rule, overall; Eldar are already Fleet and have high Initiative, so neither of the bonuses are particularly impressive for them (nor do they really want to be getting into CC in the first place.)

 

However, the important thing about the Cast of Players is that it gets you both a Shadowseer and a Death jester at minimal additional investment. Those two are the two best things in the book, which makes the Cast an attractive "ally" option.

Crusader isn't a weak rule, but it is one that is rather contextual in nature. "strong" rules are often used to describe abilities which come up very often, while Crusader is one that doesn't always matter, but can be impressive when it does matter.

 

In example, the bonus to sweeps means that normal marines have an effective sweep roll of 6-13 (4+d6+d3). So, in example, 10 scout assault 20 guardians. Scouts kill 6 guardians and guardians kill 4 scouts. Guardians take their leadership 6 test (8-2 for losing by 2) and fail. Normally, guardians have the edge in sweeps, as their base initiative 5 means a sweep roll of 6-11, while the scouts normally can only roll 5-10. Assuming guardians and scouts roll the same number, guardians will escape. With crusader, scouts will catch the guardians as guardians must roll higher to escape which, in this example, results in 14 dead guardians.

 

Mind you, this above only works because the guardians lack ATSKNF and also lack fearless. With marine on marine action, it still matters for the purposes of escaping combat or catching those trying to escape. Additional value if in a situation where marines are opting to auto fail morale via our weapons are useless, as that one still allows the enemy to sweep.