Brother Glacius

Redress is not normally a free movement. It has a cost. Half your move. So the "free" from drilled easily refers to that cost. "immediate" just means you have to do it at before you do any other movement for that unit. The thing is, Charge says you can't do a redress. Drilled does not counter that with its wording. Doesn't matter if its free or immediately, charge rules say no. Drilled rules do not say yes. Drilled still gives a benefit of a no-cost redress with non-charge moves. And it is still has limitations as it happens at the start of the movement. You can't wheel and then get a free redress with drilled. I can totally see where it could, but the wording just isn't strong enough. RAW, I say no. RAI, I say yes.

And to be clear, I think drilled should allow you to redress before charging. I just don't think the current wording is strong enough to guarantee it.

Hmmmmmm...'the first thing you MUST do...' seems pretty clear to me. You have declared your charge as the first thing in the movement phase. That negates a unit from doing a redress in ranks. As you pointed out, Drilled allows you to redress ranks before you move...which is when, after declaring charges. You move chargers after you declare all charges. So Drilled free move happen AFTER declaring. Nothing in Drilled states that it allows it to happen even if they are charging. So yeah, pretty clear that Drilled does not create an exception to the normal charge move restrictions.

Because it doesn't explicitly say it can be used even if you declare a charge. Charging specifically stops redressing of ranks and states only things that specifically ignore that rule are allowed to change it. No wording, not explicit...seems straight forward to me. Intention I think is there, but without proper wording...it becomes a roll off each game. And of course in your private games, feel free to agree beforehand.

I know, but trying to trade for models instead of buying.

Buddy of mine wants me to get some of these so we can play. Figured I'd check with ordo before I go to ebay.

By the words written, you can't do other move actions before a charge unless stated otherwise, and unfortunately, I haven't see anything mention breaking that rule. So while I think it could...it isn't written that way. So hopefully a FAQ because then it becomes a good ability to have. It goes from useful, to very useful.

only other unit without impetuous are the squig hoppers...I think that is probably going to be FAQ'd at some point and fixed. I can't see any reason why only two units don't have the rule when every other goblin unit does.

Was anyone else surprised with the night goblin unit restrictions? I thought it was a really odd tax to have. On the one hand, I think NGs with fanatics are going to be fairly effective. And so its probably a good way to limit them in a primarily orc army who is just looking for that extra punch. That being said, trying to make a themed all NG army forces you to take lots of characters. Probably not a big deal in bigger games, but in smaller games, I can see where it will really limit you. Also, I finally just realized that Animosity is gone. It has been replaced by Impetuous which isn't nearly as debilitating. That being said, I think it adds a whole new layer to playing NG and facing them. I can see a little dance happening, especially with skirmishers and fast cav, trying to draw a charge by just being in range of an O&G unit, hoping that a failed Impetuous roll will see them out of position, or even possibly running into their own fanatics. And then this led me to thinking about the Drilled special rule and whether or not you can perform that before a charge. The charge rules say that you normally can't do it unless otherwise specified, and the Drilled rules say it is free, but doesn't specifically state you can do it before a charge....but I think it is ambiguous enough that it should have clarification.

wondering if anyone has the plastic tomb guard for trade. Long shot, but I can still take it. 🙂

Dude, there are no vowels between the W and the T...so you can't have a whoa sound at all...I mean come on man.....if you aren't going to take this seriously.... 😉

what I immediately found odd was that the TK chariot sprue has a copyright of 2002....but the skeleton sprue, which is pre-TK, has a copyright of 2005. I wonder if they had to redo the copyright when they added the extra TK sprue...but that just seems weird to me. Also, even if they did, wouldn't it have had a 2002 copyright? So odd.

I got my stuff! I got my stuff! Who got their stuff? I got my stuff! Stuff stuff stuff.....I got my stuff.

My TK are almost here, so I'll be building the core force from scratch. I have some old SSCs that will be joining the army and some big constructs too. I have some undead chariots from an STL, but not sure if they are TK themed or not. Oh, and I have a character or two left over as well. Can't wait to start building and seeing how many points I can squeeze out.

my order comes in tomorrow

Not that I would take it to the same degree as that guy did, but I already pointed out that wider units were going to be a thing because of fighting rank rules. Between the reduction of rank bonus and casualty removal, units that have a decent shot of doing damage would benefit of going wider before getting charged. Going to make Drilled decently important for some units too.

I've printed one so far on my fdm and it took a little over three hours. I have 162 files of them. I think Scott has posted some options recently.

I didn't see anything in the FAQ that addressed that. It says for the lance formation that every model on the outside is considered in BtB. I don't think it is much of a stretch to say any opponent model across from a knight would then also be considered in BtB. Oh, and the lance formation at least in this edition only gets a rank bonus if they reach at least four across. So that means a lance needs 10 models before they get a +1 (although they do get a +1 just for being in lance). A normal heavy cav only needs 8 models to get a rank bonus. So if you kill just one knight, they lose any rank bonus. Not nearly as bad as I recall from previous editions. It really needs to get FAQs though (unless there are more rules in the Bret book). I haven't read that one yet because I don't really care about brets.

When you are in combat, whatever facing is touching the enemy is your fighting rank. All models in the fighting rank fight, regardless if they are in btb with an enemy model. They don't even have to have a model across from them. All fighting rank models fight. So this really takes away from the Bret lance now, and why wide units are going to be tricky to face at times. Yes, they wheel horribly, but when charged, they get lots of attacks back unless you can clear the whole front line.

Wow, it took me a long time to find command range in the rules. The freaking index doesn't have it listed and it wasn't mentioned in the rules where you would think (panic tests, the like). Finally found it under Characters in Advanced Rules. So that is settled finally (command range is equal to ld stat of character in inches. So Ld 7, command range is 7". If Ld is increased for any reason, command range is increased. Now, here's the mighty big question, does a Warband within command range of a character, use their Ld before adding rank bonus, or is it the character Ld, or their unit Ld + rank? Unit of Night Goblins is Ld 4 (ouch), but with warband, can get it up to the mighty 7? 2 rank max increased to 3 due to Horde. Now, lets say I have a NG warlord on giant squig nearby. His leadership is 6. If he is within 6" or 12" if general, does that unit have a 9 Ld for tests (his 6 + 3 for ranks) or do they use 7 since it is higher than his due to rank bonus? I would say they would end up using their 7 as while the NG on giant squig as a 6 Ld, they aren't in the unit and thus don't get the rank bonus to their leadership...even though they have warband.

I know I have a promise to my wife to not buy any more models this year. But I still look right? So in considering my wood elf army, I thought I'd look for a few pieces just to see. Technically I can still purchase models, but I have to sell some first, so it still is a possibility. That being said, people have lost their f'ing minds. The prices people want for a blister is redonkulous. At least $25 for a pair of metal bowmen or spearmen?? There is a 4th edition wood elf army box out there going for almost four grand. Suffice to say, I've already started looking at various STL option for anything else I might need and I've found some good ones thankfully. I know that for some stuff, there is a collector value. But now that wtow is out, people have gone bonkers.

Yeah, I remember one game I played with them vs a dwarf player. At the end, he had his one unit left with his main characters and I had it completely surrounded. Now the smart thing would have been to keep my units out of his charge arc and win the game easily on the rest of his army that I had wiped out, but as that wasn't much fun, I charged in with everything and lost enough stuff to make the game a tie. I stand by it though. But yeah, elves in melee just aren't great. I have been going through my models and I appear to have mostly archers and spearmen, with plenty of dryads, wardancers and some glade riders. I've also got enough old treemen to use as treekin (along with fenbeasts) and one newer treeman model. They do have rangers which have two handed weapons which could be a good punch unit, but they have no lasting ability at all. Yeah, it will be a nice puzzle to figure out if I go that route. I also apparently repainted and touched them up quite a bit so much so that I was actually shocked with how much I liked the paint job. It was an interesting day. I think I'm just going to have to go army by army and see what reaction I have to them in my hands.

new post. Also, got a malware notice from ordo. 😞

I'd like to put forth that Warhammer: The Old World, receives the acronym of WtOW and thus be pronounced as wah-tow (as in ow, not toe). I just think it pops off the tongue quite well. 🙂

So if I am reading this right, it seems that great weapons are going to be the new hotness. In most cases, a charging unit will have +3 to init. Strikes Last means your init becomes 1 before any other modifiers. So a great weapon charging unit will typically have an init of 4. That is going to equal or pass most base unit init values. Spearmen getting +1 init when taking a charge just got better as it might mean you at least get to strike simultaneously, or even before such a unit. With the armor saves now being less across the board, having -2 AP with armor bane (1) is going to be very effective.