Dusldorf

4 hours ago, Skkipper said:

I saw there was an itc event on the first and was putting together a list

 

super heavy detachment

AnGgrath 700

greater brass scorpion 625

renegade knight with thermal cannon and chainsword 426

 

patrol detachment

kharn 173

13 cultists 65

 

stompy mashy goodness

 

 

You're going to have a hard time in objective missions unless you table your opponent since most are controlled by most models within 3

30 minutes ago, Threejacks said:

  Thats good to hear:)

  Im actually thinking that PL will be the mainstay in a few years if not sooner as this is what GW would like to see.Its much easier for new players to grasp and in the long run,with this new more streamlined and dare I say "simplified" version of the rules,,,its not likely to make alot of difference balance wise playing points vs PL.Sure,there are a few rare instances were an army can really take advantage of the PL system,Deathwatch for example.But  my son and I were puting together 1k lists last night to match up over the weekend..between Space Wolves,Death Guard and Blood Angels,,they are all within one PL point of each other.Ive also seen on fb were players have done spreadsheets for the various armies and came up with,what basically amounts to armies ranging from an average of 21.25 points to PL to 23 points per PL...certainly not scientific but still shows theres not a huge difference.

  Its also likely the main reason why when GW came out with the official AoS points, they didnt do individual wargear point values and I hope they never do.

The difference can be considerable. In a recent power level game of mine we computed the points and found a 175pt disparity. That's about a full marine squad or a flyer. To me that's way too big a difference. Also see my previous post in this thread on how power levels were computed: they started with points and binned average unit costs to create power levels. The only reasons to use power levels are laziness (or as you say, to save a little time) or because you like adding variance to your game. 

18 hours ago, Ish said:

I think you're looking at it backwards. It's more that Matched Play only works with the few specific missions designed for it.

Power Level and Narrative Themed armies are more open to missions that might not be balanced well (or indeed might be deliberately unbalanced), Matched Play armies intended to be used more for the narrowly designed, better balanced missions.

Actually the recent developers commentary was very clear that you can use power levels or points in whatever mission you want. 

Power levels are essentially noisy points (i.e., points with additional variance). The recent developers commentary made it clear that power levels represent a unit's average value across all possible wargear combinations. Units that have more wargear options (Inquisitorial acolytes are the extreme here) have higher variance. The more of such units you include, or the larger the army you play with, the greater disparity you get between points and power levels. 

Basically gw used a very common statistical technique called "binning" (see here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Data_binning). Each power level is thus a bin into which units with similar average values are assigned. That's why, despite the variance in average cost between units like 5 skitarii vanguard, 5 sisters, an eversor, or 4 acolytes, they are all power level four: because they fall within the point limits of the bin assigned to four power levels.

Tl:Dr - use points unless you're lazy or like adding variance to your game. 

7 minutes ago, generalripphook said:

So did flamers get screwed over? 

They used to have ignore cover and AP 5. 

Now with just a -1 save they can ignore cover but no other armor. 

But the trade off is cover is harder to get? Thus the -1 will be more applied to regular saves and not canceling saves?

Only heavy flamers have -1 AP. Regular flamers are 0 AP.

1 hour ago, JMGraham said:

In regards to the rule that only half of your units can be put into reserve....

The drop pod counts as a unit separate from the unit inside it, correct?

And a unit of 10 that is destined to be combat squad-ed still only counts as one unit?

Just trying to make certain that I understand things correctly.

You have to declare during deployment that the unit is combat-squadded, so two combat squads in a pod is three units. 

-the way reserves work now (having control over exactly where and when they come in) seems to make the game come to a head much quicker than before

-plasma pistols are an absolute steal for the amount of work they do in two phases 

-you want at least one psyker for defensive purposes even if you hate psykers or their powers, since for casting and denial purposes most psykers are on a level playing field 

-bjorn the fell-handed proves to be an amazing mobile anchor for a sw army and deletes anything he touches 

-theres not much argument for taking blood claws, since grey hunters cost 1 pt more and get chainswords for free 

1 hour ago, VonVilkee said:

 Not all of them... jokero and deamon hosts are stuck hoofing it. 

 

Which reduces possible acolyte shenanigans...

sure but we were also talking about psykers. all the inquisition psykers can ride in other factions' transports.

2 hours ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

Like I said above.... 

No, at that point we were talking Inquisition. They can ride in other factions transports 

4 hours ago, WestRider said:

No one with access to the Astra Telepathica table can get in a Pod, as far as I can see. And "situational" isn't good enough to plan around and invest that many Points in for me. Plasma works on everything :D

Oops :(

48 minutes ago, pretre said:

Here's my tentative list:
6 Command Points at 1500

Spearhead 1

Canoness -45
5 Ret with 4 HB and SB - 89
5 Ret with 4 HB and SB - 89
5 Ret with 4 HB and SB - 89

Vanguard 

Lord Commissar with PW/BP - 55
42 Conscripts - 126
Ministorum Priest with Chainsword/BP- 35
Imagifer - 40
Imagifer - 40
Imagifer - 40

Outrider Detachment

St C&2G - 250
6 Seraphim with 2 HF, Chainsword - 90
6 Seraphim with 2 HF, Chainsword - 90
5 Doms with 4 Melta, Chainsword - 118
Repressor with HF, 2xSB - 92
5 Doms with 4 Melta, Chainsword - 118
Repressor with HF, 2xSB - 92

1498

 

No platoon commander?! REEEEEEE!

4 minutes ago, pretre said:

Time for a list change!

 

They are 71 points, HF is 17, SB is 2.

So for 18 points less, you get +2 Wounds, better CC, D6 less Heavy Flamer hits and 6 Fire Points compared to an immolator. That's an easy swap for me.

 

Gives me about 30 points to play with in my list. 

God damn, where did this come from 

6 hours ago, WestRider said:

They're not bad, but still not what I'd call "devastating". Dominate specifies Characters, not just any Model, and few of them have particularly scary shooting attacks to turn on their own dudes. Easy enough to keep more than 1" away from nearby Units to keep from having to hit them with a melee attack. Also, Terrify is only -1 Ld, not -2.

I'll take 115 Points for 5 Wolf Guard with 2 Combi-Plasmas and a Power Axe over 110 for two Psyker Inquisitors. If you actually take the Force Weapons for the Inquisitors, too, I can get another dude with a Combi-Plasma for about the same increase in cost.

Oops, I meant the first Astra Telepathica power Terrifying Visions, which is -2.

As for Dominate, I think it's a great situational power. Can really punish people for taking characters like Knight Commander Pask, Bjorn the Fell-handed, Sammael, etc.

2 hours ago, WestRider said:

I'm just spitballing here. Those are my first impressions of what I want to try in Pods, nothing more. Actual testing will sort that out.

What, specifically, are you thinking about here? Other than Jaws of the World Wolf, I really don't see any Psychic Powers available to Podded Units that I would call "devastating", and Jaws is just once per Turn. Smite Spam can be screened against. Everything else is either buff powers or kind of "meh".

The first and third Inquisition psychic powers seem good to me. One is a -2 ld debuff, the other lets you force an enemy model to attack its allies. 

52 minutes ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

Aren't we talking Adeptus in this thread? I ran Libby Conclave, I have 8 Librarians...

Thread is about drop pods bro, not faction-specific

4 minutes ago, InfestedKerrigan said:

As a rogue imperial psyker, I question the validity of that with such sheit powers so far this edition. 

The Inquisition has some amazing powers dude

30 minutes ago, WestRider said:

I feel like their best use is going to be with all-rounder Units that can dish out some serious firepower at 10"+ (so no Flamer Squads anymore) and do at least decently in Combat. Stuff like SternGuard or Wolf Guard with Combi-Plasmas and a few Power Weapons comes to mind.

I disagree about the types of units that will be best delivered via drop pod. To me the examples you list are way too expensive. I would favor cheap psykers that can jump out and use devastating powers on some key units. 

8 minutes ago, Sugarlessllama said:

and frankly, I'm over it.

Hmm, clearly 

5 minutes ago, Brother Glacius said:

I'm so glad you guys are trying to ruin the new 40K before its even out. That is just commitment there.

Just fyi, this has happened with literally every edition

8 minutes ago, pretre said:

Maybe, but it's hard to waste empty pods when they are that spendy.

Not a waste if it equates to extra wounds for a spendy or tactically important character! It's certainly a tactic that can go wrong, but it also has the potential to be infuriating for your opponent.  

I agree with Pretre but also think this edition marks the return of empty pods. They are quite resilient, and for their cost are one of the most efficient obstacles that you can use to screen characters as they make their way up the board. 

49 minutes ago, fluger said:

I'll just say that a good friend of mine who has played BA for years and has been a top player in South Africa for years (he's won or gotten second in their champions tournament for the last 5 years IIRC) has stated that BA are losers too.  He's gotten several games in and is kinda frustrated with them.  

I don't play marines enough to know what's what, but I trust his take.  

 

morticon? i would trust his opinion as well. shame. although it's still possible that people haven't yet found the right strat(s)/combo(s).

1 minute ago, Lord Hanaur said:

 i am curious if anyone is doing some things to mitigate time in the general sense.

 

 

 

besides becoming more comfortable w/ the new rules? nope.

Just now, VonVilkee said:

I have a six month old my imagination is a bit run down for 40k...

i was being cheeky but that really is their recommendation: they don't have any recommendations past 3k (up to 4 detachments per army).

3 minutes ago, VonVilkee said:

That is really cool! What is their suggestion at 5k ish? I wanna play apocalypse and just use wysiwyg and power level.