JamesBeadle Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 The empire has Karl Franz and a few other characters availible on mounts. I've heard that they are a risk to take because they die easily to cannon fire and such. I was wondering what the feelings were regarding that, do empire players avoid these as risky point sinks that die to warmachines? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murphy'sLawyer Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 All Characters are at risk of getting a cannon to the face. And if mounted on a Monster then their mount is doubley so becuase Ward Save from magic items don't cover them. Doesn't matter if their human Empire generals or an Ogre cheiftain. Cannon is an anti-character weapon but also are not as common as you may think. Best way to deal with them is target saturation and not to dump all your points in one model and send in your chaff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 As a former Empire player (5+ years), I would suggest saving the points you'd spend on the montser mounts for either a Steam Tank or a cannon, helblaster, and engineer. Your state troops need that LD near them. However Karl Franz was always the exception for me. He kills things, and he kills them fast. The problem is that Deathclaw has no save. If you want to run a character on a griffon, I would strongly suggest testing out how to manouver him around the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splinx Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Hi James I am just starting on my empire army and trial ran a few regiments the other evening. I totally agree with the other comments that I found putting a character into regiments for the look out sir worked a lot better than putting a character onto a big old mount! If i had Theodore Bruckner and reaper in a regiment of Demigryphs would he also get a look out sir or would that be negated by them being monstrous cavalry? Good luck with your empire! They are a proper mission to paint and model but a lot of fun! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBeadle Posted March 6, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Thanks for the feedback. I asked because I recently had the chance to trade for one, but I wasn't really sure I wanted him in the army. I have a ton of stuff for the Empire, so I will pass. I'm going to be playing Ogres anyhow, but the same applies to Ogres. Sounds like I want the leaders safely ensconced in larger units. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murphy'sLawyer Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Well some charaters are great on mounts though with the right ward save. Capalus is a great example for Empire. A hero Captain on a pegasus with a ward save and magical weapon. Good for hunting warmachines, chaff and lone charaters. Along with being able to flank easily and being hard to chatch he is a great buy. I also run a hero and lord on a pegasus in my DE army all the time but they do ave the Cloak of Twilight. So it all depends on what your army offers and what you mount for the points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroZero Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Heros on monsters are far better than people understand or get for some dumb reason. I will gladly explain when I get time, but the short answer is Speed+power= concentration of force Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murphy'sLawyer Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Heros on monsters are far better than people understand or get for some dumb reason. I will gladly explain when I get time, but the short answer is Speed+power= concentration of force Hero, yes. Lord General not so much. Again I state it is about target saturation. Give them too many priorities to focus on just one point sink. Although at high enough points bringing a Dragon can be fun if not risky. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroZero Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 You're correct any monster mount requires target saturation which is not hard for any army. Even a "griffon lord" kills far higher than its weight when applied correctly. The bag full of win are character+mount that always can generate 5 CR every round. It's about application of force. Smacking hammers into anvils is pointless. Pick on units you can kill every time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Heros on monsters are far better than people understand or get for some dumb reason. I will gladly explain when I get time, but the short answer is Speed+power= concentration of force I agree that they are great. However, I will say it takes a certain amount of time to learn how to properly use them in your games. If you are just learning how to use those awesome monster mounts and you deploy and move "willy-nilly" against an experienced player with shooting or war machines and you will learn the mistakes fast and my be quick to think it's not a solid option. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Well some charaters are great on mounts though with the right ward save. Capalus is a great example for Empire. A hero Captain on a pegasus with a ward save and magical weapon. Good for hunting warmachines, chaff and lone charaters. Along with being able to flank easily and being hard to chatch he is a great buy. I also run a hero and lord on a pegasus in my DE army all the time but they do ave the Cloak of Twilight. So it all depends on what your army offers and what you mount for the points. Captisus loses most character exchanges if he doesn't do it on the charge. I'd save him for chaff and war machine hunting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudra34 Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 Hunting characters is the last thing a peg captain should have in mind. My favorite build is a 1+ rerollable save with the dragonhelm and a lance. He wont hold up anything with ranks, but charge him into any chaff unit, chariot, or even monstrou cav (hopefully they have the flaming banner, if not hit them in the flank!), and he will do amazing things. I used to run three at 2400+, they never disappoint. The griffin is a little bit harder to justify. He is a solid, fun choice, but in an army with so many superior lord choices he is simply lackluster. Also, Empire characters are not known for their incredible fighting ability. If you want to run one, go right ahead. hook him up with the white cloak and some other gear, as the cloak adds some survivability to the griffin as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeroZero Posted March 6, 2014 Report Share Posted March 6, 2014 I agree. Using monsters is a lot harder than it seems at first. You can't just throw him into combats or deploy them badly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murphy'sLawyer Posted March 7, 2014 Report Share Posted March 7, 2014 Captisus loses most character exchanges if he doesn't do it on the charge. I'd save him for chaff and war machine hunting.I was thinking of those wizards and such alone out of a unit. Rare thing but even you and I run a Sorcerous on a Pegasus and I would think twice on running her through the backlines unless I can throw a Doombolt into the Captisus first. (Never read his name properly, just heard it.) But then again you are the more experienced player and I will have to say you would know better in this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 7, 2014 Report Share Posted March 7, 2014 A doombolt on a 1+ armour save unit isn't really worth it. Yes, I run a sorceress on a Dark Pegasus. However, I do play the measurement and charge arc game. All you have to do is move your Pegasus out of charge arc or out of charge range. The only other armies I see with solo wizards are beastmen, but they are usuall tucked behind some blocks. Oh, another good use for Captisus is for redirecting charges. With 1+ AS, you can hold certin units in place (not big blocks) and can flee and set up counter charges with your other units. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBeadle Posted March 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Thanks for the conversation. I'm sure I will be facing Empire with my Ogres and will learn all about how those work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 8, 2014 Report Share Posted March 8, 2014 Thanks for the conversation. I'm sure I will be facing Empire with my Ogres and will learn all about how those work. Just turn your cannon and fire or turn your leadbeltchers and fire at him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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