Flirting with Death

[Guest]

17 hours ago, Ish said:

Don't get me wrong, it shows excellent sportsmanship on your part that you're so concerned about it... I'm just saying, don't sweat it too much.

Many, many, many moons ago (before blogs were a thing even even) I read a great essay called Putting an End to Cheesiness. It was an eye-opening moment for me: "I might not beat you, but I hope I’ll give you a run for your money."

Disagree with that article. Sounds like he's (or She's) unable to establish when their own army is Cheesy, which makes the concept more subjective than it is. I can certainly tell when my own army is cheesy. I do agree that cheese is subjective (and I think it is contextual). 

In our game, I don't think Arkhan the Black was anything but cheese. His rules, within the context of our 3 armies, were not fair. Perhaps if the Treeman were more agressive, but it wasn't (within context, remember, so a potent character that does nothing is regarded as an impotent character). Even without summoning, I think that with unlimited turns, I could have wiped both armies with just Arkhan. He was faster than the other units, stronger in melee, more spells, longer range, and probably the most durable unit on the table. Yeah, scenario objectives and the turn limit would probably make me lose with just Arkhan, but that doesn't mean he wasn't cheesy. 

Regarding cheese, one I have noted is that the cheesy army doesn't always win. Cheese isn't usually fun to play against, and often not fun to play as, but being the cheesy player doesn't mean you win. Sometimes the non-cheesy player is just better at playing the game (or it's a matter die rolls). 

Though regarding cheese, if you want to see a game that embraces cheese yet still mananges to created a balanced game, you should look into Malifaux. They have some pretty creative, rather cheesy models, which are actually balanced within the game. For example, they have a character in there called "Leveticus" which can't really die (he can die, but it's unrealistic in most games). So it's like playing chess, but the opponent's king can't be checkmated...cheesy, for sure. That said, the way this game is designed, have unkillable characters doesn't ruin the balance. The flip side here, is that the game doesn't really function as a straight tabletop battle game - so malifaux has strengths and weaknesses over the AoS system. 

Back to Arkhan, I don't think he's always going to be cheese. He was cheese in context to our game, but probably for a 1k and definitely for a 2k, he's probably par for the course. Like bringing a Warhound Titan to low point games of 40k - it's not that it can't lose, but that's it's just not balanced for that level of play (8th may have fixed this). 

[Guest]

Lol. No a fan of either version of the Spirit Host models. Just occured to me that I could probably make (or acquire) a Ghostly (the pokemon) model. Kinda cute, and would certainly look the part. EDIT: Ghastly, not Ghostly, is the name of the Pokemon.

[WestRider]

On 6/27/2017 at 5:43 PM, Ish said:

Don't get me wrong, it shows excellent sportsmanship on your part that you're so concerned about it... I'm just saying, don't sweat it too much.

Many, many, many moons ago (before blogs were a thing even even) I read a great essay called Putting an End to Cheesiness. It was an eye-opening moment for me: "I might not beat you, but I hope I’ll give you a run for your money."

Oh, wow. That was a blast from the past. I think I actually read that myself, back when all the details were actually current. I know I remember visiting the Fighting Tigers of Veda page.

It's also kind of amusing to look back at what was considered cheesy back around the turn of the century. I'm reading this thinking "A Chapter Master on foot with Lightning Claws? WraithLORDS? Really? Oh, yeah, back then that actually was scary."

[Ish]

Bear in mind, that the linked article was published in May, 2000... WH40k Third Edition was still basically brand new, having only come out in late 1998.

In May of 2000, only the Vanilla Marines, Blood Angels, Dark Angels, and Space Wolves had codices (and three of those would get "revised" by the end of 2001). The Dark Eldar and Necrons were still the new hotness. Heck, Tau wouldn't even debut until 2001. 

This was a time when "Rhino Rush" was still a breakout strategy.

[WestRider]

Like I said, it's a little odd remembering back to what this game was like at the turn of the century. And I do love that I live in a time when I can use that phrase regularly and meaningfully :D

[Guest]

5 hours ago, WestRider said:

also kind of amusing to look back at what was considered cheesy back around the turn of the century. I'm reading this thinking "A Chapter Master on foot with Lightning Claws? WraithLORDS? Really? Oh, yeah, back then that actually was scary."

Wraithlords were so tough to kill back when melta bombs didn't work against on MCs and power weapons were all strength as user (so S4 for marines, which doesn't harm T8). Power Fists were the only solution, and those required waiting for a chance to swing...Good old "hidden" power fists.

[Guest]

Minor updates. Found that Paizo, the company that produces Pathfinder, actually sells bases for their miniatures. Ordered a varied set. I think I'll be putting my models on those bases, since it will allow me to use my Undead, very seamlessly, for Pathfinder. And, to be fair, I'll probably use my Undead in pathfinder more than in AoS...

[WestRider]

1 hour ago, paxmiles said:

Wraithlords were so tough to kill back when melta bombs didn't work against on MCs and power weapons were all strength as user (so S4 for marines, which doesn't harm T8). Power Fists were the only solution, and those required waiting for a chance to swing...Good old "hidden" power fists.

Oh, yes. I remember. I recall desperately hoping to fail Morale Tests when a Unit that didn't have a Fist got a WraithLord in it. Even worse with my Dark Angels. It's just been a long time.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, WestRider said:

Oh, yes. I remember. I recall desperately hoping to fail Morale Tests when a Unit that didn't have a Fist got a WraithLord in it. Even worse with my Dark Angels. It's just been a long time.

That's the game I miss, when I think about 40k. 

[WestRider]

13 hours ago, paxmiles said:

That's the game I miss, when I think about 40k. 

I'm honestly getting a lot of that same feel with 8th. It's not the same, but the hard reset is giving that same feeling of exploring a new game space that 3rd did.

[Guest]

Okay, signed up for the OFCC AoS event. Now I have a deadline to complete a semi-functional army. So aside from painting and assembly, which are both huge issues, I also have to meet the requirements for list creation. Grand Alliance Death is very challenging to field a mono-faction army, without just spaming the same unit over and over. So, without a focused sub-faction, I'm left with a very limited selection of Death Battlelines (3 minimum). 

Choices are Zombies, Skeleton Warriors, and Ghouls. I don't have enough skeletons for 3 full units (30 models). Archer Skeletons are only a Battleline for TK alliegence, and only then if High Queen Kalidra is general. Ghouls are expensive in points, and really aren't better than skeletons, plus I don't have any. Zombies are cheap, but I didn't have any - just bought 40 mantic Zombies. 

So, lots of painting to do. I should have a Mounted Necromancer almost finished, so I'll get pictures of him ASAP.

[Guest]

Ugh, forgot my pathfinder game yesterday, as I was too engrossed with painting and assembly. So much to do. And I always forget how big those Dreadhold pieces are until I get them out. Working on the Malefic Gate for use with this army in the upcoming OFCC. Huge model. I have only a small section fully painted, but it looks amazing and has me giddy for the rest being completed.

Hmmm....TK have Skeleton Horsemen as a Battleline, while the Black Knights are not a battle line unless the entire army is Deathrattle (kinda impossible for Death faction to really be mono allegiance, especially at 2k). I suppose I could convert the unfinshed Black Knights/hexwraiths I have, into skeleton horsemen. I've got the Zombies, but the issue there is that Zombies are much more impressive in a large unit, rather than in multiple small units. Additionally, that Malific Gate benefits from having lots of models behind it.

So, for mandatory Battleline units (I need 3), my idea for the OFCC is: 

Skeleton Warriors (10, Spears and Shields) 80pts

Skeleton Horsemen (5) 100pts

Zombies (30) 180pts

Regarding Heroes, I have been finding pieces of my TK that I stated at the end of last edition, but ditched when AoS arrived. I think I'm running a Casket of Souls, a Mounted Necromancer, and Arkhan. On the fence with Arkhan, since he's really expensive and tall - I'm thinking this army is going use that Malefic Gate to deny LoS, so I want to be sure that my models can actually hide behind it. Also think Arkhan's steed is a really goofy looking model (I think I need a conversion that I don't have time for). If I do ditch Arkhan, I would need to replace him with 2, or so, wizards. Casket of Souls is a must, since it counts as a priest and that matters for the Malefic Gate. 

For my General, I'm looking at either Morghast Harbingers or Morghast Archai (it would be a unit of 2, with the general being 1 of the 2). I'm leaning towards Harbingers, possibly just because they have a cool name. Unit isn't really cheaper than running a hero, but there aren't really any comparable heroes in the Death faction. Unit can fly, which is a big thing for the Malefic Gate. They have good speed and strong melee (strong for Death faction, most of our units aren't exactly elite...). As for the differences, the Harbingers are faster and have more attacks, but the Archai have more armor and stronger attacks.

For artillery, I'm thinking having 2 Screaming Skull Catapults is too spammy, so I'll just take the one. Still haven't used one in a game, but the goal is mainly to deny the opponent the option of taking me out exclusively at long range. 

I found that I actually have 6 Tomb Swarms. Unit has interesting rules, since it operates like a summoned unit, but it doesn't require any summoning, and can charge when it arrives (as far as I can tell). I'm thinking either 1 unit of 4 or 2 units of 2, for a total of 160pts. Should help me deal with backfield units, or with enemies that try to blitz my summoners. 

That leaves a big chunk of the army as Reinforcement points. I have several units, like more Zombies, Skeleton Archers and a Zombie Dragon, which I'm thinking would better serve as summoned units, since they can be summoned, but I'm not sure what I will need. Total is 1500pts, leaving 500pts as reinforcements. Tempted to add a couple of Corpse Carts, but doing so means building and painting those models....

[Guest]

Malefic Gate is, maybe, 50% painted. Even with a simple paint scheme, this is a huge project. At the rate I'm going, I expect to have it finished in a few long days. Though once I get it done, I'll just need to focus on the rest of the army more.

Rest of the army is going slower. Haven't started the zombies. Horsemen are getting there. Warriors need highlighting. Bowmen need a musician. Necromancer is basically finished. Casket of Souls needs work, as I can't find all the bits. Tomb swarms are primed. Arkhan is pretty close. Finally figured out how to assemble the Morghasts (lost the instructions...), but they still aren't fully assembled. Catapult is waiting on white (I can't find my white, right now...). Zombie Dragon is almost done, but I'm not sure I like how he's turning out, so I may start over. 

I'm going to need to glue-gun some transportation foam for this army. I've got the cases and old foam, but this army, especially that Malefic Gate, needs something custom.

And, if I get time, I acquired some rocks to paint and use as status tokens. I also need to get a full printing of the army list and the maybe some nice photo references of the Warscrolls with my painted version pictured, so they're super easy to know what is what. Ugh, if I have time. I'm kinda curious how long I can maintain this pace.

I'd really like to get some practice games in, with this army....

[Guest]

An update with pictures. Army, as presently presentable:

 

[Guest]

Pax's Death Army list (as poorly pictured above):

Hero - Casket of Souls

Hero - Necromancer on Nightmare (Sword of Unholy Power)

Hero - Arkhan

Unit & General - Morghast Archai (2, one is General with Ruler of the Night Command Trait)

Unit & Battleline - Skeleton Warriors (10, Spears and Shields, Full Command)

Unit & Battleine - Skeleton Horsemen (5, Full Command)

Unit & Battleline - Zombies (30, Standard Bearer & Muscian)

Unit - Tomb Swarm (4)

Artillery - Screaming Skull Catapult (1 Catapult, 3 crew)

Malefic Gate

Total 1500pts. 500pts of Reinforcement Points.

Summon-only Members of this Army:

Unit - Skeleton Archers (10, full command, pictured above) 100pts

Behemoth - Zombie Dragon (1, not pictured) 320pts

Unit - Tomb Swarms (2, not pictured) 80pts