Nathanvoodoo Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 I've started down the path of collecting and painting a new Guard army- However, one thing playing 40k has taught me is that despite how shiny some models may be many are simply not worth owning. So, my question is, what are some highlight units in the guard? What are the most tried and tested tactics? Best lists? I'm intending to build out a bit of a hoard of infantry, a couple of primaries psyches to throw around buffs, possibly CREED, void shield and a few jumbo cannon type things in the back field. I'm not terribly interested in too many tanks, but if it's necessary to round out the list I'm also not opposed. Chimera, or Taurox? Is Yarrik really all that? Gimme the scoop. I want all the opinions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Yarrick is amazing. Easily the best HQ in the codex. Pask comes in at second place, but you can't beat Yarrick's utility, power, and price. Infantry blobs are the main feature of the book, kitted for CC (Power Axes, Meltabombs) and/or shooting (Lascannons.) Priests and Primaris Psykers tend to play support to them. Wyverns are your big option from the HS slot, although the non-Ordnance Russ variants also have some utility. Vendettas are still good for AA and strafing runs, typically with a Platoon Command hidden inside. If you have access to Forge World, the Vulture is an absolute beast of an airplane. Thudd Guns are less self-sufficient than Wyverns, but are much tougher and cheaper. Chimera, or Taurox? Neither one is particularly good. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 As someone who plays guard I agree with all of yhat. Also. Allies are great especially inquisition and marines. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted October 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 I have a couple of inquisitors but I have zero interest in space marines- I just don't want em ????. So other than flyers Guard don't really have mobility options? Is the Taurox Prime any good? I guess having a 100+ bodies on the ground does afford pretty good board control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Mobility is definitely the Guard's weak point. And it's a big one. All their fast stuff other than the Flyers (Hellhound, Taurox Prime, etc.) is badly overpriced for how fragile it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Yeah, I've thought about Tauroxes, but they don't suit me. As far as the ickiness of Space Marines, I totally get that, I did counts as Ad Mech before they had a codex. I ran scouts with 3rd party skittari models and a tech marine/priest as a Master of the Forge. Gets all the goods of Space Marines without their silly models! Scouts REALLY help with guard's lack of mobility as they can at least distract and get into backfields. Beyond that, using platoon command squads inside vendettas is a decent option as well. You get a nice place to stash those PCS in a platform that really helps your anti-air and you can grav chute them onto objectives sometimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Perhaps Ad Mech might give you the mobility you need with some of their faster offerings. Oh, and Knights work great. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted October 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Admech without allies are probably just as slow. The sicarians, which I'm quite fond of- do really haul- but they are T3 foot sloggers. I just can't bring myself to do the cheezeball Blood Angels ally group. My first army was BA and I think I might have PTSD from them. So... It sounds like I need MOAR grunts, Wyverns and Quad THUDD guns and to explore my ally selections. How about assassins? I'm guilty of fielding those overpriced point sinks a great deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 Assassins maybe? I haven't used 'em, but I could see a Cullexus helping out. Or even the repulsive Eversor. Frankly, I've gotten a lot of mileage out of conscripts with an IC to keep them honest (or if you have Yarrick in range you don't have to worry thanks to his Warlord Trait). They are cheap, ob-sec, and while slow, they WILL get places (or hunker down in your deployment zone going to ground) eventually and have to be (easily) dealt with. Yeah, the BA ally thing is certainly tempting, as a chaplain is handy to add to IG blobs geared towards melee and the scouts are useful as I mentioned. The drop pods give you great mobility and you can put things like vet squads or CCS inside. Or even Stormtroopers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted October 27, 2015 Report Share Posted October 27, 2015 A combination of Vendetta/Vultures and a melee blob can go a long ways towards covering the mobility game, but as Guard you're going to struggle in Maelstrom or anything else that wants you to be claiming lots of objectives mid-game. Inquisition allies are very useful for Guard, as they can bring cheap and effective psykers (either the Inquisitor or his Henchmen) as well as several utility relics. Marine allies are typically better for them, but Inq can fill the job in a pinch. Also remember that you have access to Scions, who can natively Deep Strike and go well with Inquisitorial Servo-Skulls. If you don't mind including Marines but don't want to do the Drop Pods thing, Scouts are also quite functional for Infiltrating onto an objective to score points. Branching into xenos, Eldar are obviously extremely mobile and Orks/Tau have a lot of options as well. Imperial Knights can be an excellent melee-focused solution if you're willing to invest a lot of points. They aren't always great at scoring, but few people want to get close enough to contest an objective with them nearby. The Vindicare Assassin is a good shooter but extremely fragile. The Culexus is a great specialist tool for enemy psychic deathstars and a bit tougher than the other Assassins; the Callidus is all but guaranteed to wipe a backfield unit and if you're going first will almost inevitably get a charge, although she will probably get killed soon after. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted October 28, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 28, 2015 In my experience the Vindicare is just a total waste of points. The Eversore is hilarious and incredible- or just a total waste. The Callidus is really difficult to play and usually just doesn't get anything done. And... The Culuxes just troll faces everyone. Runs around peeing on everyone's shoes and hanging everything up while they all desperately wish they could git him. I'm mostly thinking of them in coordination with a giant blob of guard and a fat pile of cannons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted October 28, 2015 Report Share Posted October 28, 2015 I haven't played guard in a while and I'm thinking I may do something crazy for GC in December. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 28, 2015 Report Share Posted October 28, 2015 Have you looked into FW? AM does have one of the wider selections of FW models. Some options are certainly less viable than others, but you really don't need allies if you are fielding AM. You might even be able to ally the variations of AM together (like D-99 and Catachans). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 28, 2015 Report Share Posted October 28, 2015 In my experience the Vindicare is just a total waste of points. The Eversore is hilarious and incredible- or just a total waste. The Callidus is really difficult to play and usually just doesn't get anything done. And... The Culuxes just troll faces everyone. Runs around peeing on everyone's shoes and hanging everything up while they all desperately wish they could git him. I'm mostly thinking of them in coordination with a giant blob of guard and a fat pile of cannons. While I agree the assassins are all very iffy, they can be useful in the right context. I will note that they have changed the assassins in minor ways over previous editions, which allow rather major changes in function over previous editions. In example: -The vindicare can now outflank and fire his pistol with the special rounds. -All of the assassins can now embark in vehicles/buildings -All of the assassins can man Gun Emplacements to confer their BS and special targeting rules (if any) to the gun emplacement's shooting profile. -The assassins are no longer special characters and may even be fielded in duplicates (even if each requires his own detachment) -You may have an assassin warlord. -The assassins are now scoring units. There's probably a few others, but those are the key ones. They all look minor, but they really are game changers in tactical value. I had an opponent use their assassin as an objective holder, which hid out of TLOS all game and just took the objective. Assassins are small models and are easy to conceal - it was a very annoying objective holder. Now, obviously, as an objective holder only, the assassin is a total waste of points. But my point is that their in-game value has changed quite a bit and their toolbox function is now more broad. In that particular game, the assassin was more valuable holding the objective than it was attacking things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted November 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 The list I'm generally working towards is sort of a 'buff the blobs list' Hq -yarrick Hq - ccs with Creed and an Astropath Troops 1 - 50 man infantry platoon mostly minimal but with 2 separate heavy weapons teams, probably auto cannons or rockets, special weapons and krak, meltas on srgts Troops 2 - same as above Misc 2 ministorum priests - singing songs and being awesome Misc 3 mk2 primarus psychers Elites 5 wyrdvanes- yeah they are kinda dumb, but I have a ton of psycher ,models Heavy support 2 quad guns in a unit Wyvern and or manticore depending on points The plan basically involves surging the blobs around the map while spamming divination on them and screaming orders from CREED. I'm thinking 'forboding' along with the priests war hymns will significantly increase their survival. Cannons in the back to ruin days. I have no clue if it's viable, but it seems like a plan, at least Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted November 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 Oh, and depending on points Cotaez might jump in, too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 Creed is not good, in every sense. Yarrick is enough. My suggestion is go for a fighty blob with Yarrick to move up with and then a shooty blob in teh back to hold and shoot. Then get some conscripts to move up with Yarrick to screen or distract as needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted November 7, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 That sucks, I figured 3 orders and two warlord traits would be pretty useful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted November 7, 2015 Report Share Posted November 7, 2015 The thing you always have to remember with Guard is that your sh*t is fragile and will die to a stiff breeze.Three orders and two traits is great- 200 points tied up into a unit that dies to Bolters is not. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted November 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 Alrighty Here is direction I'm heading... +++ Maximum foot slog (1922pts) +++ ++ Astra Militarum: Codex (2014) (Combined Arms Detachment) (1872pts) ++ + No Force Org Slot (300pts) + Ministorum Priest (25pts) [Close Combat Weapon, Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Rosarius, War Hymns] Ministorum Priest (25pts) [Close Combat Weapon, Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Rosarius, War Hymns] Ministorum Priest (25pts) [Close Combat Weapon, Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Rosarius, War Hymns] Primaris Psyker (75pts) [Flak Armour, Force Staff, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Psyker Mastery Level 2 (25pts), Refractor Field] Primaris Psyker (75pts) [Flak Armour, Force Staff, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Psyker Mastery Level 2 (25pts), Refractor Field] Primaris Psyker (75pts) [Flak Armour, Force Staff, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Psyker Mastery Level 2 (25pts), Refractor Field] + HQ (210pts) + Commissar Yarrick (145pts) [bolt Pistol, Carapace Armour, Close Combat Weapon, Frag Grenades, HoC: Bale Eye, HoC: Power Field, Krak Grenades, Orders, Power Klaw, Storm Bolter] Lord Commissar (65pts) [bolt Pistol, Close Combat Weapon, Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Krak Grenades, Refractor Field] + Troops (1362pts) + Infantry Platoon (606pts) ····Heavy Weapons Squad (75pts) ········3x Autocannon Team (30pts) [3x Autocannon, 6x Flak Armour T, 6x Frag Grenades T, 3x Lasgun] ····Heavy Weapons Squad (90pts) ········3x Missile Launcher Team (45pts) [6x Flak Armour T, 6x Frag Grenades T, 3x Lasgun, 3x Missile Launcher] ····Infantry Squad (80pts) ········7x Guardsman [7x Flak Armour, 7x Frag Grenades, 7x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Guardsman w/ Vox-caster (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Lasgun, Vox-caster] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Platoon Command Squad (61pts) ········3x Guardsman w/ Sniper Rifle (6pts) [3x Flak Armour, 3x Frag Grenades, 3x Sniper Rifle] ········Guardsman w/ Vox-caster (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Lasgun, Vox-caster] ········Platoon Commander (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Orders, Power Axe (15pts)] Infantry Platoon (756pts) ····Conscripts (120pts) ········40x Conscript (120pts) [40x Flak Armour, 40x Frag Grenades, 40x Lasgun] ····Heavy Weapons Squad (105pts) ········3x Lascannon Team (60pts) [6x Flak Armour T, 6x Frag Grenades T, 3x Lascannon, 3x Lasgun] ····Heavy Weapons Squad (90pts) ········3x Missile Launcher Team (45pts) [6x Flak Armour T, 6x Frag Grenades T, 3x Lasgun, 3x Missile Launcher] ····Infantry Squad (80pts) ········7x Guardsman [7x Flak Armour, 7x Frag Grenades, 7x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Guardsman w/ Vox-caster (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Lasgun, Vox-caster] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Infantry Squad (75pts) ········8x Guardsman [8x Flak Armour, 8x Frag Grenades, 8x Lasgun] ········Guardsman w/ Grenade Launcher (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Grenade Launcher] ········Sergeant (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Power Axe (15pts)] ····Platoon Command Squad (61pts) ········3x Guardsman w/ Sniper Rifle (6pts) [3x Flak Armour, 3x Frag Grenades, 3x Sniper Rifle] ········Guardsman w/ Vox-caster (5pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Lasgun, Vox-caster] ········Platoon Commander (20pts) [Flak Armour, Frag Grenades, Laspistol, Melta Bombs (5pts), Orders, Power Axe (15pts)] ++ Fortifications and Stronghold Assault (2013) (Fortification Detachment) (50pts) ++ + Fortification (50pts) + Aegis Defense Line (50pts) Created with BattleScribe (http://www.battlescribe.net) Quote Link to comment Share on other 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Nathanvoodoo Posted November 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 The conscripts are supposed to have a commissar too - putting my points at 1947 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Hanaur Posted November 9, 2015 Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 I've started down the path of collecting and painting a new Guard army- However, one thing playing 40k has taught me is that despite how shiny some models may be many are simply not worth owning. So, my question is, what are some highlight units in the guard? What are the most tried and tested tactics? Best lists? I'm intending to build out a bit of a hoard of infantry, a couple of primaries psyches to throw around buffs, possibly CREED, void shield and a few jumbo cannon type things in the back field. I'm not terribly interested in too many tanks, but if it's necessary to round out the list I'm also not opposed. Chimera, or Taurox? Is Yarrik really all that? Gimme the scoop. I want all the opinions. 40 Guardsman (Add weapons to taste) + 3 Psykers+3 Priests = good vendettas = good (and kinda necessary for anti-air anyways) Wyverns = wow Deathstrike Missile Launcher: when it goes off its tremendously impressive! Gotta be able to hide it though. So... Maybe only one. The tanks and War machines otherwise can all be useful so its harder once you get down into them but I personally think the Eradicator and Punishers have definite positive places in the list. Ignores cover can be so great and the Punishers sheer volume with Pask aboard is really something. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted November 9, 2015 Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 I really don't like the heavy weapon teams on their own. I think putting them in a backfield blob is a better choice. Easier to put orders on them since they should have a Ld buff from an IC or something. The ignores cover order is just AMAZING. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
galahad911 Posted November 9, 2015 Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 In this edition, shooting firepower has risen so much that roughly 150 AM wounds is really only likely to hold out for a few turns. When opposing armies are commonly throwing out 100 or so strength 6+ shots a turn and you really only have those heavy weapon teams to do anything outside of melee, it seems to me an army like this is just going to take it on the chin just about every game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nathanvoodoo Posted November 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 9, 2015 Who the hell is throwing 100+ s6 shots a turn other than eldar?!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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