VonVilkee

Problem I've found over the years is that fantasy is more gentlemanly if you will. It has been my experience that on the whole fantasy players show more sportsmanship than the same cut of 40k players in an area. Dunno what it is but that has been my takeaway for awhile now, part of the reason I don't push to hard to integrate... Maybe it has something to do with the guns...

Jim said this to me long ago and I think it is spot on. Your army list is the sportsmanship you show before the game. To me this means I would be willing to swap armies with anyone across the treble from me and try to beat what I use with what they brought. Keeps me honest, I also find it the easiest easy to explain our local meta...

Hey! Not everyone I said I'll play and didn't give any reservations :P

Also who is arguing? I'm trying to come to a compromise so that we can both be on the same page for a rather complicated game. Again you want to play raw? I'll pull out the old books and throw down.

Fixed charges is a huge problem for this edition. I actually pulled out the book [i have it (I did proxy some Games way back and play the book a bit ;)] and started looking... Leaping gives the beats/cavalry charge, without changing their unit type. This doesn't help hormies at all currently, as a beast charge is the same as every one else you do get extra attack distance which is cool but not worth The points. I'm looking at ways to give you a longer dependable charge distance with leaping. Rules as intended... Charge lengths are not fixed right now and nothing has a double charge any more. Beasts just move faster, one thing I didn't catch originally was that hormies were already beasts. Like I was saying let's look at the rules you want to use and see which ones don't sink up well and why. Leaping seems to be the only one. Further options cuz I want you to get outta the raw here as we will be playing deep in rai. Leaping options I'd like to try: Ignore 12" charge keep support range (nerfiest and personally my least favorite, everything could charge 12" as a Max charge range currently) Eliminate all rules current and give them remove casualties when charging at the end of the fight sub phase after all attacks have been struck (changes their use drastically but allows them to be that assault into terrain the book has always been missing and you can still try longer charges as your closest model will be the closest even after over watch) And I new one I just thought of steal swift strider from fantasy! Roll an extra D6 for charge distance and discard the lowest (this would cancel out the penalty for terrain, remember hormies are fleet as well and would get rerolls, this should give really long charges statistically) Failing that I'd be willing to roll the whole game back to 4th ed I still have all the books. No more premeasure and them you can have your fixed charge distances

Problem with that is we would have to get rid of premeasuring, etc. We'd be using the new unit type rules, vehicle rules, flyer rules etc. Based on this the rule book would need to Clown some things. Premeasuring only really works if charge ranges are random. This in turn changed beasts from moving 6 with a random single d6 run, and 12 inch assault to now 12 inch move with 2d6 rerollable (separately charge range). Leaping is the odd thing other wise New rules are better statistically. So like I said main rules would need to Clown for actual playability. Powers stats etc can totally come from the codex. If a rule refrences a universal we use current printing. Best way to make this work is to change the game as little as possible to begin with. Write a list and document the specific instances a rule in your codex is replacing a main rulebook, which should Clown in your opinion and why. Balance is not unit by unit it is army holistic you will be getting cheaper MCs that are really good, decent bs venom cannons that while glance only will still strip hull points fast, and other goodies. Also I said general rule, not iron clad of doom. You already agreed no fixed charge length and remember beasts auto get fleet for the rerolls Edit also I'm only talking big rule book, I don't want to reference the new nids book in any way if we are playing the old school one, if we can help it... These are just an opening frame work so we can find oddities to start translating

All the things!

General rule of thumb for this in my opinion is main book rules Clown your codex, then figure out the crazy doesn't mesh with something stuff. And Brad I was thinking the same thing! I totally miss my old school deamon Prince that I made simply by pointing out the gifts that matched to the random roles from the original rogue trader book I have! (scampers off to see if he still has the papers...)

I'll play! I could prolly bring out my orks...

There will also be a zukuphaust (spelling edit stukka zu fass) variant that will make a great Manticor... Off to find a picture to attach. Found

My attend attendance looks confirmed! Yay zombicide!

What if leaping simply allowed any model slain by over watch to be removed at the end of the phase instead. Could prolly extend this to any casualties during an assault phase in which they charge...

I totally think consistency is key, leaping makes them beasts... Course what does that leave for raveners to do? Stand in for leaping warriors!:P

This is coming around again, I made some edits.

See by saying beasts they get a 12" move and fleet. They charge just like everybody else at that point. If that doesn't work so hot maybe over watch isn't removed until after the charge has been completed but just before blows are struck. Would allow you to stay spread out more but still make longer charges... The pile in move would still have to make contact for you to be engaged and strike tho... With pre measuring there is no way fixed charge lengths are acceptable.

Yeah I'm totally cool with the 2+ on the tyrant, yeah 10 pt hormies deserve to just be beasts. with sixth giving a pile in the extra bit about that could just be ignored.

Just count leaping as the new hormie rule (additional run and fleet right?). Don't take 2+ save on carnies and you should be fine... Allot of the issues you can just avoid in list making that is ultimately why I said go for it I trust you to make the list fun!

I tracked it just fine, and actually really liked it thematically Also as far as I'm concerned drop the crone and harpy into that book.

Yeah and the complicated gun is based on critter carrying it... That part people used to complain about.

Truth brother! I like 6th ed rules but some of the older dexes could be really fun in the current frame work. Don't think it could be any worse than some of the broken things now and you would have the proper attitude towards list building... I'd totally play it.

So where we at on this? I'm in need of those shoulder pads to keep my termies consistent...

Still means you have a trygon instead of additional flying monstrous creatures... I am finding it somewhat entertaining that everyone one decried the nids faults at launch and how they couldn't cope with certain things... Now they have ways to cope and it its omg!

Are you sure the gargs can use the hole? Thought it dictated what units could use it?

Also I'm thinking a fail on that 4+ means bye bye unit... It ain't destroyed so it doesn't go back into ongoing reserves it really was eliminated.