Kremmet

Gotta love that Deceiver especially in a comped event.

As do a very large amount of current armies. Not everyone is elves/WoC.

I've never played them without at least two Spellbreakers. If people want to cry about that, then they'll likely cry about anything as it's pretty basic for the mageless/speedless army.

Does he still have the 100 pts banner rule? I thought that was under Slayer King, something he definitely is not anymore.

Don't forget that my army maxes out at Ld 8! The trolls are a very fun unit to run and are more for that than effectiveness. That said, they are dead 'ard and extremely dangerous to try to fight around which is half the fun of a chaos list. I also view Bloodgreed as a boon about as often as a curse given how easy it is to bait a Ld 7 Frenzied unit. Ehh, I've been running Slayers in my dwarf armies since I started them. They're avoidable, sure, but they're also great at long bombing charges and counter charging monsters that get stuck into your lines. The first time I put them into my list I thought I was just adding a very iconic unit to a fun list, but the more I've played with them the more I've realized how good Slayers are. That is, as long as you fudge Deathblow into a usable rule.

Excuse me, but that's obviously a lie because Space Marines some on 32mm bases.

Doombull doesn't go with the the trolls, but the Gorebull does. The biggest problem with that unit is that they fail Stupidity more often than I would like to admit. I ran a very similar list at SPDM 4 and it did very well. Granted I didn't run stinky Marauders there, but the Herdstone Horrors weren't very helpful beyond scaring my opponents so I'm not super worried.

The BSB ET comp seems off to me with things like Blightkings and Glottkin being hit a little too hard while the mixed lists themselves suffer minor penalties at most. I know my LoC list scores a 14.8 with a not-so-soft list. That said, I think Swedish is pretty messed up in terms of competitve comp anyway and should be viewed more as a reason to put models rarely seen onto the table. This is my list so far (mostly stuff I painted up for the last Sparkle Party and things I want painted for the next one): Doombull: Armour of Destiny; Arabyan Carpet; great weapon; Mark of Tzeentch 360 Sorceror Lord: Talisman of Preservation; Charmed Shield; Level 4 Wizard; Lore of Metal; Mark of Tzeentch; Disc of Tzeentch 365 Exalted Hero: Talisman of Endurance; Enchanted Shield; Dragonbane Gem; Mark of Tzeentch; Daemonic Mount; Battle Standard Bearer 220 Gorebull: Blackened Plate; Gnarled Hide; shield; Mark of Tzeentch 209 Chaos Chariot 110 Chaos Chariot 110 28 Chaos Marauders: Mark of Tzeentch; shield; light armour; Marauder Chieftain; musician; standard bearer 310 5 Ungor Raiders: Mark of Slaanesh 35 5 Ungor Raiders: Mark of Slaanesh 35 Chimera: Regenerating Flesh 245 5 Chaos Trolls: additional hand weapons 190 Chaos Giant: Giant of Khorne 210 2,399 points

Sigmar's Blood basically set up all the stuff that happened in ET Nagash with Mannfred and friends.

Actually, by pure RAW, you do both. The one is not hitting per say, but instead causing a separate effect which is an automatic hit on a friendly. Basically, if you rolled a one, you'd hit somebody else and then reroll due to ASF which may cause another one and another hit.

New...Clanrats? Seriously? Rumor has it that the elf release has no models because it originally wasn't going to happen. Sure the elf models released this edition are dynomite, but the whole book centers around a model that was created in the early 90's which lends credence to the rumor (that and the rules being completely bonkers overpowered, but that's more like a Tuesday at GW rather than an indication of a rush job).

No it isn't. Even that specific Twitter account later talks about how the picture is in WD 50.

I imagine in space.

Yhetees are considered "bad" because they're a relatively expensive shock unit with no protection other than a -1 to be hit. The just don't match up well against small arms fire and considering the three best BS-based armies also have permanent rerolls to-hit against them, they just aren't well off. They're also nowhere near as good as Fast Cav as really they only have the Swiftstride part which more efficient units in OK also have access to.

I wouldn't call a six wound 4+ AS monster "one of the most durable monsters in the game" especially given that it's 250 points. Sure they shrug off cannon hits better than most, but that is only one of the reasons people shy away from big monsters this edition. These guys are no better at shrugging off other monster killers such as Poison, don't have the mobility to escape threats (ie no Fly), and are possessed of rather mediocre damage output. Again the model is a cool one and they definitely aren't going to be an albatross for the army, but intimating that they're a great army buy is going too far considering what ogres as a whole are good at.

Sure the local direction of one day events over two day in WA affected the results a lot, but the real killer for the 2014 season was GottaCon's fantastic turnout. Glad to hear you're changing the formula to not kill anyone's chances for missing the "big party" of the year.

I've liked all of them so far. Looks to be an absolutely killer kit.

@dont panic: I'm still going to have to disagree there. Sure you more commonly see Butcher+Slaughtermaster combo in Ogres due to the Maw tax, but Firebellies still show up quite a bit in competitive play (especially after the rise of elves). They're an amazing buy only reined in by how dumb the Maw tax is design-wise. Mornfang are an absolute blast to play and are relatively easy on the wallet given how large the models are. I've had good experiences with them in a wide variety of setups such as two units of two, three units of three, and one unit of four with the Dragonhide Banner. Ogres like to abuse their mobility to win games and have the added bonus that any non-gnoblar unit can be added to a combat for devastating results.

I like a lot of what I'm reading here because people understanding the weaknesses of dwarfs makes me hapy, but the idea that static dwarf lists are the ones that do well in uncomped affairs is a little off the mark. I spent most of last year playing dwarfs and the only events I went to were uncomped. Not to push my own skill or that this small sample size makes a sizable impact on public opinion, but I did very well with a dwarf list focusing mainly on combat with war machines as my only shooting (1xcannon, 1xGrudge, 2xOrgan to be exact). This style of play seems to be coming into its own as people realize that dwarfs work best as an MMU army while still having a fair amount of personal flair open to them. The problem is that this does not extend to Gyros and war machines if you're looking to make anything competitive.

Yeah, Firebellies are widely considered a very powerful unit so I'm not sure where you were getting that they're weak. In fact, a fun thing to do with them is just run 2xFirebellies and no Slaughtermaster/Butchers at all. It frees up points for fun things like Tyrants and since OK have access to such powerful anti-magic abilities it doesn't really hurt them all that much. I strongly disagree with MN's ideas on the Stonehorn due to its large size (a detriment on the table) and fairly small damage output for a monster in that price range. The model is excellent and I'm not saying it's garbage or anything, but I wouldn't take one unless I was purposefully paring down my list/was really interested in painting one up. I agree with the assessment of small Bull units. They act a lot like chariots in other armies allowing for redirection, chaff deletion, and a nice flanking force. I love running them in my MSU OK list as they strongly compliment the rather shooty focus of the rest of the list. Just make sure you keep them cheap as you'll bleed chaff points way too quickly otherwise.

Ehh, something would have to go really wrong for most any list to not be able to close with this. Dwarfs really aren't that hard to balance when you're trying to win consistently against good players as their lists need combat balance to actually function, but it is very difficult for most opponents to recognize how a proper dwarf list works due to how foreign they are from the central point of the game especially in the current edition. I must say that I really like this list. The small Quarrelers aren't really a unit I subscribe to as they're an easy target for points without bringing much of anything to the table, but otherwise it seems like a very entertaining and well thought out affair. If anything it definitely shows how much dwarfs benefit from Swedish.

Wait, you're talking about the old model right?

The problem with copter comp is that dwarfs only have them for anything that's not MV3 infantry. Yes they are very powerful, but the comp from a purely competitive standpoint could be a little lower given that it's for something entirely irreplaceable due to army design. As for Grugni, I've never played dwarfs as a gunline (and I question those who do). It is an absolutely fantastic rune to get your troops up the field without suffering too much molestation especially when you're running Slayers. The 6" bubble is problematic for protecting guns to be sure, but it's just fine for those 3-4 units that dwarfs need to be combat ready (and likely the only units in the army at all).

You don't need a cannon as you're running a Grudge Thrower, but getting accuracy on it is going to be important as the engi is better off helping the Organ Gun. I'd drop a copter at least as you really don't need three especially with the Vanguard in the list and I'd strongly suggest running Rune of Grugni over anything else on your BSB as you're otherwise easy pickings for small arms fire. As for the comp thoughts overall, remember that Swedish strives to punish tournament trends more than anything. There are plenty of over/under comped units that simply are seen too much/little and therefore get the rating they do. Copters are one of those things (although I personally think they comp way too high considering there isn't even a close alternative in dwarfs). As for Organ Guns not being worth their points, that's a pretty bold statement. Even without an engineer and just rocking Accuracy you're looking at an incredibly small footprint death machine. They are well worth every penny (and really the only reason to field a dwarf engineer).

Correct.