JamesBeadle

I have Empire of the Blazing Sun and Covenant of Antartica that I am actively looking for ships to fill. I'd also be interested in groiund units for those armies or Prussians.

I'm sorry you stopped playing Sammy. If I recall that is how we met, and your fleet looked fantastic.

I'm looking forward to trying out 2.0 this Saturday. I will spend the next two days going over the rules, my Commanders edition rulebook just arrived.

Epic 40K was my introduction to the game. I used to have massive armies of each, but there wasn't ever anyone to play, and when I could find someone we always had to use my collections. I ended up trading it all off many years ago for 40K models. I wish that game had taken off, I loved runnig battalion level games. I started off my Warhammer career with the Adeptus Titanticus game. I ended up getting three of them in the end.

Yep, they had two this morning. I called in and reseved one (have it in hand now),and someone else grabbed the other. They are gone for now.

Bridgetown is closing, so I will not be able to get a codex there as I had planned. Anyone know if they are availible at GGames? I will call when they open, but I was just curious now.

Huh, these are cardboard?!?

Its not really a mater of judgement. I am sad, and I think that when things get priced so high in a every day man's hobby like this, my knee jerk reaction (and I think it is a common reaction) is to be upset at immorality of greed, however I would not defend that accusation against GW, Its an emotional response. In a way, it represents my own greed. Like everyone else here I love the hobby, and when it becomes unaffordable I am upset becasue I cannot buy the neat new toys that once I could. No, its not about judgment, its about loss. I don't want to be priced out. I think the wisdom I have been given here is that I should just update my books and not drool over new models so much. My objection to the knockoffs was legal. Even with its legality I am uncomfortable with it because it seems like stealing to me, so there is a moral component I admit, but I cannot judge others for buying if its not illegal (honestly I have tried not to judge anyone on this anyhow, but that is harder than most want to admit it is).

Thank you for posting this. I'd be interested if you come across more. This is a good start, but not enough to convince. Edit: In the article, the last paragraph appears to explain why buyers are not prosecuted, because it is too difficult. This does place the issue into the realm of morality, however it appears that it is not illegal to purchase knockoffs overseas and I will refrain from commenting on folks who talk about buying this way from now on. I admit that I hadn't read the article until just now.

Rcnjack, this is what the game night forum is for. :)

It boils down to it being legal or illegal Koyote. If you can demonstrate to me that this is not illegal, then I am not against it. Making your own stuff, for your own use, this is not morally ambiguous. All of this is going to become very much in the public eye when 3d printers become as ubiquitous as 2d printers are now. We all know that this will happen. At that point, as the materials to 3d print become cheaper, it will be easier and cheaper to scan and print model replicas than to buy a box of minis. I do not think this is a bad thing, though it might birth a new generation of anti-IP theft laws. Either way it does strongly suggest that our games will probably shift from large company IP's to shareware or even freeware miniature gaming generated by the community at large. Regardless, its the legality that is the issue for me. Were it not illegal, I would not have an issue with it. As it stands, I've not seen anything to indicate that this is a legal practice, in fact everthing I know about this kind of crime is clear that it is in fact a crime, and a major sticking point in US/Eastern commercial relations.

I'm beating a dead horse here however, and I apologize. Both my original topic and this one have been hashed out dozens of times. I was just feeling discouraged the other day when I ordered the book.

Its a false distinction. Its not about denying GW profits, I could care less about GW's profit margin insofar as they stay in buisness and their products remain affordable by my estimation. What matters is that hijacking intellectual property is stealing, and knowingly buying such property makes a person an accomplice to a crime. Once you buy something legitimately, it belongs to you. You may sell it, give it away as a gift, trade it, destroy it, or balance it on your nose. It's yours to do as you will. You may not make additional copies of it and then sell it, and making copies for personal use is a little more murkey. Things get complex there. Regardless, I do not see levels of grey in knowingly buying copied goods, its black and white. Sharing is also perfectly fine so long as hyou are not making replicas and giving the replicated product away. That ammounts to distribution of stolen property the moment it changes hands. This is not so difficult as folks want to make it out to be. We find, whenever someone really wants to do something that is illegal, all manner of justifications arise to convince themselves that it is acceptable to do as they want. This has ever been the case with man.

This sounds like fun. Hopefully my rulebook will arrive soon.

If I cannot afford it from the manufacturer, that doesn't mean I am willing to buy stolen goods. I don't mean to be a jerk, but that is what those are.

Anyone have the BRB for a decent price? I could also trade some Orks instead if needed.

Yes Eben its this thread again, the only difference is that its I who started it. I think its great that folks still like and support GW, but we each have our tipping point. I love the game, and even bought the new rulebook as I menitoned earlier, but the doing so really had me thinking about the game. The hobby in general, like all other consumables, is getting more expensive, but GW is a leader in the pack. Either way the thread was just about my specific situation, and where I am at with it. I am getting priced out of updating my GW collections, and I am signifigantly invested, and it makes me sad.

You all make very good points, and most of them I have considered (except for the LH dividends observation, I'm as ignorant as can be about that stuff, I read your post but had nothing intelligent to add to it). I am not leaving the hobby, but for the first time ever I'm actually worried about it. I have a lot of models, I can play fine without adding more, but I did just buy the 7th edition book and the price hurt me. I sacrificed to get it, and that is what started me thinking. I have always defended GW in its price hikes, but now I'm just to the point where I have to really consider if it is defendable any longer. I am very unsure. Miniature gaming is my primary hobby, and Warmachine is my primary game, but with that said I own more GW games than I do PP games. All second hand, literally all of it. I do not work as I am taking an accelerated load in school (18cr/hr) and as I transition at the start of next year to graduate school, this is not going to change. I have a lot to paint, and that is what I like to do (playing is fun when I can spare the time). So in my original post I didn't give enough information. It is not cheap, even in comparing it to other hobbies you are comparing apples to oranges. If this game is unaffordable to me, a more expensive hobby is even more unaffordable. The observation, accurate as it may be, doesn't suddenly make GW games easier to access by being aware of it.

I have always been an advocate of GW, defending the price hikes as a nessisary evil, defending the hobby as cheap compared to other forms of entertainment, however I am now begining to doubt. I own three GW 40K armies, and four WHFB armies. I cannot support them, period. The only reason I own so many is that I amassed a lot early on when I had a really good paycheck, but that is unlikely to happen again in my lifetime and I have to be realisitic. I do not want to leave the hobby, this is not some dramatic farewell letter, and Eben can defend me in that I have always been a fan. The current prices of modes and particuarly books however is becoming overwhelming. Even without buying new models,the books are a burden. I think I may be getting squeezed out.

The old epic lancer was a quadruped.

I would like to buy the display cabinet from you. I could pick it up tomorrow, my wife has my van today.

Mia culpa, I only read up to page 4, so I find this reaction encouraging.

TW_Haines, you get a pass, of course. ;)

So I've had my head buried so deep into school that I have been out of the loop on this new edition stuff. I suppose it is my niavete showing, but it never ceases to amazing me how much negativity is involved in change. Charges of malicious wrongdoing, declarations of how the company doesn't care for its player base, and in the past many threats (by people who did and didnt) to leave the game for good this time. I see it in any game format that has a wide following and is subject to revisions (WoW comes to mind). People just hate change, but people also adapt and find ways to use the changes to their own benefit while getting anxious about how others might find better exploits. I realize we gamers are a competative bunch, but change isn't bad, and particuarly this change seems a really good thing to me. It really does open the door to allow folks to play as they wish, and it forces conversations on what you want to use and do not want to use. Talking to other gamers about your game is good. Games, at their root are social interactions. Whats not to like? I will also concede that I have not played ten games of 40K since I entered school, so my investment in 6th was very shallow. I don't have the attachment others do so I am free to snub the rest of you poor complainers and rise above into the clouds... with diamonds...

I was just about to offer you a room, then I realized that you said Everett and not Portland.