godswearhats Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 TL, DR: US Masters, we have to decide how to send 10 people from the PNW to next year's event. Hi all, If any of you listen to Garagehammer, you may have heard that the Pacific Northwest is getting their own region for the 2015 US Masters. While it's still not 100% clear exactly what states will be included, Washington and Oregon are definite, and it looks like Idaho (and probably Alaska) as well - it may even include BC. If you don't know what the Masters is, I encourage you to check out the WargamersUSA website, which is the official forum for the tournament - it's basically a way to figure out who is the best player in the US. What does this mean? Well, first off it means that the US Masters next year will be bigger! There will be two more regions (Mountain and I think South East) and each region will be bringing 10 players, which gives a total of 80 people. It also means that our region has to find a way to select the 10 players that we'll send to the tournament in early 2015. Secondly, I'm going to be taking on the role of Chairman for the PNW region for the first year. This means I'm going to be coordinating the selection process, making sure we pay the requisite fees and voting on any ballots that the US Masters committee puts out (such as what comp system to use) - representing the views of players in our region. I'm going to be assisted by Paul Garbe, who helped me lobby the US Masters folks so that we could get our own region. Why did we do this? Primarily because it was very hard for us to be part of the West Coast region and participate in the tournaments in California to reasonably stand a chance to qualify (just due to distance) for one of the 10 regional spots. Thirdly, each region is allowed to select its own way of figuring out those 10 players. However, the one requirement is that there are at least three 2-day / GTs involved in the selection process. It doesn't mean that GTs are the only criteria, but that they must form part of the tournament circuit used to decide who goes. The rationale behind this is that if you are sending players to a 2-day GT that represents the best players in the country, they should have participated in a few before they get there! Each region is using a different way to qualify. Some are giving automatic spots to anyone who wins one of their GTs. Some are using a system that uses a rankings calculation, and some have a hybrid approach. Other ideas include having some number of the top 10 picked this way, with others qualifying via "grinders", or to have an invitational of the top X players and the top 10 from that tournament go through. The South selected their best 8 players and added in their best sportsman and best painter. Some food for thought. We're already almost a quarter of the way through the year, and we've had a few tournaments already, including the Black Sheep Brawl, SPDM 2 in Seattle and GottaCon in BC, so I'm keen to iron out our selection criteria as quickly as possible. I wanted to start this thread to let everyone know that qualifying has become a lot easier, and to ask for your opinion on how we should conduct qualifiers. The 2-day events that I know of are: Black Sheep Brawl (Feb) OFCC (Sep) Sparkle Party Death Match 5 (Oct) There are also at least three 2-day events in BC that I know of, which is another reason I'm open to including those folks in our region. At the moment, we're allowed to count their tournaments if we want to, but the US masters is only open to US residents (something that will be put to the vote next year). If there are more events that I'm not aware of, please let me know! I'm not convinced that scores should be decided purely on 2-day events, but they should definitely play a part - I know there are plenty of good-sized one-day events that I'd like to include as well, if we can find a workable system. I'm also open to running a 2-day tournament in the second half of the year to give more opportunities to players. Some of the side benefits of this effort will be to help create a greater sense of community in our wider area, as well as finding a central point through which we can coordinate tournament dates - I for one would love to attend more tournaments, but there's been a number of occasions where the dates have collided or been just one week apart which have prevented me from going to both events. So, to get to the point (finally!) we need to choose a way to send our top ten. Willing to hear any and all ideas and opinions and I'll be on the site here every day to comment on anything people have said. I'm likewise posting this thread on the Dimensional Cascade forum, to get the same feedback from the Seattle / WA folks. If anyone knows of a site for Idaho or Alaska, please let me know. Thanks, ~gwh (Aidan) 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil_bryan Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Great timing! I have a call later today with one of the organizers to discuss Ordo's possible involvement. Also, OFCC is in September this year. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godswearhats Posted March 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Great timing! I have a call later today with one of the organizers to discuss Ordo's possible involvement. Also, OFCC is in September this year. :) Could have sworn that I typed September. I even have the page open showing me the dates ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veskit Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 The Wet Coast GT (www.wetcoastgt.com) is in June and has 40+ people (hoping 60 this year) in Burnaby, BC, Canada also GottaCon (www.gottacon.com) just finished a few weeks ago and had 48 people in Victoria, BC, Canada - wet coast is hosting their results so you can find them here: http://www.wetcoastgt.com/results/gottawhfb2014 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Veskit Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Kippersmelee is also a BC one in Nanaimo, BC... we like our 2-day tournaments ;) www.kippersmelee.ca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 AWESOME, we are finally in! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sergentzimm Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 This is fantastic. I would love something like this to grow over to the 40k side of things as well. Any system that would be results oriented over popularity contest would be my vote. It gets harder to include the outlaying areas, such as the east side and us up here in Bellingham, just merely because we can't make it out to all the events as easily. I guess I would want to see maybe a slot distribution based on results and location as well. Kind of like the all star game where one area gets a slot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godswearhats Posted March 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 The whole point of the Masters is to try to grow the community, so I feel like we should be finding ways to help areas like Bellingham and Spokane to run their own tournaments and thus get the ability to qualify that way. I for one would be happy to travel to these places to play. Regardless of how the players are decided, it will be data that decides them, not popular vote or anything similar. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godswearhats Posted March 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 Veskit: Thanks! I'm aware of the BC events (I was just up at GottaCon!), so we'll definitely need to decide how best to proceed with the stuff across the border. There's a vote currently going to the Masters committee to see whether we can allow people who live in Canada to participate in the US Masters, or whether we only allow results for US residents. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sergentzimm Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 The whole point of the Masters is to try to grow the community, so I feel like we should be finding ways to help areas like Bellingham and Spokane to run their own tournaments and thus get the ability to qualify that way. I for one would be happy to travel to these places to play. Regardless of how the players are decided, it will be data that decides them, not popular vote or anything similar. Fantastic! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunnerson Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 I would hate to see the OFCC and the BSB shift away from a friendly format and become ard'boys style as a result 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burk Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 I would hate to see the OFCC and the BSB shift away from a friendly format and become ard'boys style as a result there is 0 chance that OFCC's team event would. however, we are doing thursday friday events now too.... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mojoslayer Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 You asked for input so here it is. SEND ME! :) I think the first place of the two day events should qualify you to go, the rest of the spots should be filled by a single event called PNW masters. Anyone who finishes in the top 5 of a two day 20+ person event, or the top 2 of a one day 20+ person event or finishes first in a 10+ tournament would compete in a two day masters event to fill out the rest of the roster. Eventually a player ranking system would be a fantastic way to select players, but for this year and maybe next year the above would work well in my opinion. Best of luck to you figuring this out, I hope you have fun doing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeaverBeliever Posted March 14, 2014 Report Share Posted March 14, 2014 I would hate to see the OFCC and the BSB shift away from a friendly format and become ard'boys style as a result I think I speak for the rest of the Black Sheep guys when I say that we'll be sticking to our style of tournament (equal parts paint, sports, battle and narrative). However, if it draws more competitive folk, then we'll have to see how that works out. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvos Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 I would hate to see the OFCC and the BSB shift away from a friendly format and become ard'boys style as a result I would like to point out one simple principle that needs to be said. Involvement in a tournament circuit does not mean that you can not have a "friendly format" first of all. Just because sportsmanship may not be a scored election or primary requirement in an event, it does not mean that you are going to run into a "Win at all costs" environment. These are all events put on by Ordo Fanaticus or clubs affiliated with them. The Pacific Northwest self-polices their player-base and events to eliminate that form of behavior. Also, a "no comp" style events do not mean you are going to run into ultra competitive or win at all cost players. It just means players have the freedom to bring whatever they choose to the event including things like Special Characters and so forth. I wish to break this mentality that if you have a "no comp" event that it means you are going to encounter aholes. That really isn't the situation, after all you will be playing against Ordo members so what is the concern? 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMGraham Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 The whole point of the Masters is to try to grow the community, so I feel like we should be finding ways to help areas like Bellingham and Spokane to run their own tournaments and thus get the ability to qualify that way. I for one would be happy to travel to these places to play. Regardless of how the players are decided, it will be data that decides them, not popular vote or anything similar. I'd be more than happy to spearhead something in Bellingham. I've got experience running organizing largish (20, 30 and 40 participant) 2-day Malifaux tournaments, and Fantasy is having an upsurge in the local community. If you'd like, drop me a PM and we can discuss what would be required to be a qualifier. FWIW, I love the Pacific NW wargaming community, and see it as very distinct from CA. Glad it's getting recognized as a separate entity, and thanks for your work on this! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godswearhats Posted March 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 Lots to digest here. Some thoughts: Every event I've seen the PNW involves a strong paint and sports score. Makes sense that qualifiers would also include those. I think the luck of the dice can affect things too strongly for one event to be a good qualifier. Also would not like to reward someone who won a single event and then didn't participate in the community the rest of the year. I don't see much explicit comp in the area, and tournaments seem to still be very balanced. Didn't Wood Elves just win (or almost win) BSB? :-) Comp here is implicit and/or scenario based. People play to have fun with others who think the same way. Agree that PNW has its own identity. In many ways, I see us as gamer nirvana :-) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 The cool part about is that each region gets to decide what the qualifying factors are. It doesn't have to be based off who is always winning with the hardests lists out there. I love our formats and we should continue to use those as qualifying factors. It will force people tyring to use "our" events as a gateway to have to adapt to our community. We promote strong bonds through sportsmanship above all other things, this is something I take pride in. I love that we can all come together and play friendlier games I know I can be rough at times, but heck, I still love this community and wouldn't leave it for another one. I will say that I have to agree with one thing. If you place 1st in an event, you should get an invitation. If none of you have watched the masters coverage, there does need to be some competitive representation. However, the south region did some great things by sending the 1st place winners as well as seleceted individuals who would represent the region and not themselves on the table. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drak Posted March 15, 2014 Report Share Posted March 15, 2014 from what I've read about the masters events the term "beer-hammer" is used often. this type of reference encourages me to believe our friendly, sportsmanship and hobby focus found in the existing PNW events would fit right in with what other areas of the nation are doing. having just played in bsb. a new qualifying event for the current west coast qualifier, I didn't feel like bsb and it's comp and attendance was anything that we as a community wouldn't support and get behind for a future PNW region events. having the freedom to establish our areas entry requirements is a huge plus! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ioscode Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 I think the method that mojoslayer posted would be a good approach, though to slightly adjust it we might want to auto-invite to the masters 1st and 2nd place of our 3 GTs, and the top 4 from the invitational. Maybe for this year, the GTs in Canada could just be included for granting invites to the invitational tournament. Seems like Canada has a large enough scene that they might be their own region in later years. (Maybe the US Masters could become the American Masters). Regarding the OFCC - Considering the nature of this event, primarily that it is team based and not really matched in an individual way, it might not be a good candidate for qualifying individuals for the masters. I'm not sure how big the OFFO is going to be, but maybe that could be a qualifier instead? Maybe you and evil_bryan have already talked directly about this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godswearhats Posted March 18, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 I think I may have got my tournament names mixed up, having not attended either (yet!). As for the scoring and ranking, we are 99% there with a system that we're pretty happy with for this year, so I'll be sharing it in the next few days. We've taken into account the feedback that we got on this thread, as well as from others in other locales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swan-of-War Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 OFFO needs to be renamed the MO FO' 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sylvos Posted March 18, 2014 Report Share Posted March 18, 2014 OFFO needs to be renamed the MO FO' We are actually calling it the OFCC Fantasy Open. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
godswearhats Posted March 19, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 19, 2014 Yep, and I've finally got it straight that it's a one-day event, and that the two-day event is a team tournament (and thus would likely be mathematically difficult to include as a qualifier). Btw Sylvos, thanks for all your Battle Reports and Tactica about Wood Elves - very helpful to me when I was getting started :-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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