WestRider

OK, this is kind of a disorganized mess, but here goes: My personal feeling is that the power level in general has gotten to the point where it's causing balance issues. I'm seeing more Games than ever before that are basically over by the end of the first turn at the latest. Sometimes it's obvious just from comparing Army Lists, but even in Games that have been more or less Mirror Matches, it's often the case that whoever goes first can do enough damage that the Game is basically done after that first Turn. The removal of Full Reserves and reduction in practical value of Cover contribute to this as well. I've also seen far more tablings in the year and a half that 6th has been out than in the 14 years that I played 40K before that. It used to be a rare occurrence, a sign that someone had seriously screwed up or been badly outmatched. Now it's just a thing that happens. And there are so many variables now that horrible mismatches can happen even without trying. Even when actively trying to avoid them. My regular Opponent and I have been moving more and more toward powerful and Competitive builds, because the mismatches are often far, far worse when we try to keep things casual. Even when two Armies are on nominally about the same power level, it gets really easy for things to get all rock/paper/scissors, because there are so many things that you absolutely have to have dedicated counters for, and so many Armies can't get all those counters without highly refined lists that ignore huge swathes of the Dex. Part of the problem is that most of the power increase has been focused on new Models and Units, while the old stuff stays pretty much where it was. So a terrible Army is at about the same power level that it was in 3rd Ed, but the best Armies in 3rd weren't that much more powerful, while today the difference is great enough that it's not even worth putting the Models on the board to play the Game. Even at higher levels, these kinds of mismatches happen far too often. Over at 3++, one of the things SirBiscuit mentioned when talking about restrictions for the Feast of Blades was that they had Players coming up and handing in results sheets 20 minutes after pairings were called, because it just wasn't worth actually playing out the foregone conclusion. What's the point of paying to travel to major tournament if the Games aren't even worth playing? And all that is without including Escalation, which introduces a whole new level of alpha strike power and need for hard counters.

I was responding particularly to this bit: My point being that those Units require ~400 Points worth of firepower to remove in one go, no matter the source. Any different firepower Unit that can clear those out quickly is going to cost that much. There is no "different route" that's going to be significantly more efficient.

First off, Dominion, the Crown, and the Warlord Trait just boost Synapse. SitW happens to have the same base range, but it's not the same thing, and it doesn't get expanded by things that affect Synapse range. Secondly, it only affects the Psyker himself. Even if you've got that Librarian down to Ld4, his Unit takes Ld Tests on the highest Ld in the Unit, which is still going to be 8-10 in most cases. It really is pretty much just Psychic Defense.

@Pax: You're missing the point: Things in this game are tougher than you think. There are tons of things that take 15+ Missiles to drop, regardless of the cost of their platform (Typhoons are actually pretty reasonable in this regard), and unless people are really going back to MSU, overkill isn't nearly as much of a problem as you might think.

Plenty of stuff needs that much firepower to drop it. 10 TL Missiles+5 Heavy Bolters doesn't even drop one full Tactical Squad in 5+ Cover on average. Leaves 8-12 or so left from a 30-strong Gaunt Brood, assuming ~3 Hits per Frag Missile. Doesn't quite kill a Tärv with FNP and 5+ Cover. Barely averages stripping 3 HP from an AV12 Vehicle with 5+ Cover.

Fexen are all individually upgraded. For most of the other Units, Weapons are upgraded individually, but Biomorphs have to be bought for the whole Brood.

Even after the nerf, I think Hive Guard are worthwhile. They've got good range for Nids, and ignoring LoS+Ignores Cover is really nice for flushing out those fragile Scoring Units that like to hide in lower levels of Ruins or other places where even Barrage can't get to them. Plus, there are a number of hard targets that can also pick up good Cover Saves, and having some Ignores Cover of our own that doesn't have to wait until Turn 3 to hit is pretty nice. @Bro G: The Exocrine looks solid, and the Hive Crone has a lot of potential. The other builds for each kit are mediocre to failtastic, but I think they might be worth picking up for those. If you don't have Warriors already, they look like their role as Backfield Synapse/Objective Campers has become more important. I mentioned above that I think Hive Guard are worthwhile, and Tyrant Guard are absolutely essential if you're running a Tyrant on foot. None of them are "must have"s, but I think you can get value out of any of the new kits.

If you could beat old Nids, you should be able to beat new Nids. Targeting Synapse first is now more useful, and the specific distribution of MCs will be a bit different, but the basics of beating the Dex haven't really changed. Do watch out how you clump up, because there are now two Units (Mawloc and Exocrine) that can throw around AP2 pie plates in different ways.

Also means the Tärv can't be Warlord, so Fluger's first list there doesn't work.

The way I read it, if the first shot misses, you skip the rest of the attack resolution, and jump straight to where you get d3 Spore Mines regardless of how many Biovores were firing.

Assault Grenades work on a model-by-model basis. Pg.61 specifies that "Models with Assault Grenades..." You've been nerfing yourself on LOS. It got FAQed so it worked on 2+ for Tyrants and Guards. Automatic is better, but it's not that big of an improvement. Well, unless you roll 1s like I do when you're on your last Wound ;)

But Shrouded affects the whole Unit as long as at least one Model has it. They do actually work, for a wonder. I need to proxy a Hive Crone or two and try them for a while. They're potentially in kind of an awkward place, with the limitation to two shooting attacks per Turn, along with their fragility. But if I can generally get rid of all the Missiles before they're in position to Vector Strike, part of that problem goes away.

Yeah, that's better. Still obviously Dread parts, but now they really look like they've been ripped apart and completely repurposed by some mad Mekaniak.

Well, there's always the converting a Fex to look like a giant Stealer approach: http://thetyranidhive.proboards.com/thread/19519?page=1

This is a very rough draft, so it's incomplete and the Points are pretty random and there are probably other issues, but Alpha Legion: - Chaos Lords/Sorcerers with Marks no longer unlock Cult Units as Troops. - The Alpha Legion are masters of attacking from multiple angles and luring their enemies into traps with feigned retreats. All Models with Veterans of the Long War gain the Live to Fight Another Day special Rule: Models with this Rule double their Initiative when attempting to escape from Sweeping Advances, and can Run, fire at full Ballistic Skill, and/or Charge as normal on Turns when they Regroup. Furthermore, all such Models who do not have the Bulky, Very Bulky, or Extremely Bulky special Rules gain Infiltrate. Warlord Traits: 1: Stealth for Warlord 2: Acute Senses for all Outflanking Units 3: Furious Charge for Warlord and Unit 4: Princeps of Deceit, as Main Rulebook table 5: Re-roll Reserves 6: Shock Tactics: Once per Game, declare at the start of the Shooting Phase. Select one Unit within 12" of the Warlord. That Unit's Shooting Attacks gain the Pinning and Blind special Rules for this Shooting Phase. Artefacts: - The Cloak of Mists: Character gains Shrouded. 50 Points, does not replace a Weapon. - Backstabber: S: User, AP2, Wielder is not bound by the requirements of Champion of Chaos to Issue or Accept Challenges. 25 Points. - The Alpharius Gambit: The first time the Bearer is slain, by any means, roll a d6 at the start of your next Turn. On a 1, the Bearer is dead. On a 2+, remove a randomly selected CSM Character in your Army from play, and place the Bearer within 3" of the removed Character's location, with d3 Wounds remaining, tho no more than the Bearer's original Wounds. 35 Points, does not replace a Weapon. - The Blade of Deceit: S; User, AP3, Rending, Wielder is WS10. 30 Points. - The Hydra Blade: S: User, AP3, Daemon Weapon, roll 2 dice and take the highest for the number of attacks generated by the Hydra Blade. If the sum of both dice is 4 or less, treat it as a 1 on a normal Daemon Weapon. 40 Points. - Spirit of the Hydra: Every time the Bearer loses a Wound, add one Attack to his Profile. This remains even if the Wounds are regained by some means. 15 Points, does not replace a Weapon.

They also need to be able to take upgrades that actually help them, you know, Assault. Gimme an option to put cheap Power Weapons/Fists on basic squaddies, and then we'll talk.

I've tried to make them work a few times, but they're just too expensive. GW persists in thinking that a BP/CCW is worth as much as a Bolter, even tho they've buffed the latter repeatedly over the last couple of editions while the former has gained little. I think they also overvalue the Jump Packs themselves. It feels like the packs are priced as tho everyone gets the Raven Guard buffs.

I like the Flamer Pod Squad better for Dark Angels, because the Sergeant can pick up a Combi-Flamer as well in that Dex for an extra Template on the drop.

If your Opponent hides Cypher behind a rock, you take advantage of the fact that he's playing 200 Points down, and has -1 Ld on his Warlord. You should be able to leverage that into at least a couple of extra VPs.

PM Sent.

And mine will show up next Wednesday, according to the Tracking, even tho I got a shipping notification on Tuesday. What are they sending these by, Pony Express?

And look: Flesh Hooks aren't Rending anymore. Guess that was game-breakingly powerful :P

At 2K, you've got enough Points to pick up Flesh Hooks for the Warriors as well. Or slap some better gear on the Prime, or maybe just fill in with a few more Hormies.

And why I really wanted MTC for Gargoyles. I lose more of those little bastards to tree trunks than enemy fire, some games :P