New Nids Data Slate

[Raak]

CrossPosted thanks to the fellas over at the 40k Wrecking Crew forums:

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New dataslates

Incubator node
1 tervigon
3 termagant broods

Tervigon rerolls 1's when spawning

synaptic swarm
1 tyranid prime
3 tyranid warrior broods
18" synapse range

Skyblight Swarm
1 winged tyrant
1 hive crone
2 harpies
3 gargoyle broods
gargoyles have the endless swarm rule (when a unit is destroyed an identical unit is put into ongoing reserve on a 4+)
gargoyles also can control objective markers even if an enemy scoringh unit is in range of it

living artillery node
1 exocrine
3 biovores
1 tyranid warrior brood (must have biocannon)
All ranged weapons fired by models in this Formation have the Pinning special rule. In addition, models in this Formation that are within 12" of this Formation’s Tyranid Warrior Brood can re-roll the scatter dice when firing weapons with the Blast or Barrage special rule

Endless Swarm
3 hormagaunt broods
2 termagant broods
1 tyranid warrior brood
Endless Swarm


Skyblight Swarm - GARGOYLES Score even if your unit is within 3" of it.

2 people on FB have the rules and confirm this.  So you can deny while scoring with Jump Infantry fast attack units.  Yup Sweet.

Also Endless Swarm - 320 points for 6 additional  scoring units. That have the potential to come back after dying.  Yeah Tervigons are no longer must take because the cost for 2 tervigons buys this formation + upgrades.

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....So Corey, I'm guessing the rule will be no Data Slates at the monthly 40k tournaments, right?

 

...and Shae - tell me that doesn't raise your spirits just a wee bit. In 1 month I'll play you Chaos vs Nids. - I'll take Belakor and you take the new Rising Levithan thingiemaboper. #fungameWin

[huggies01]

No hopes raised. I hate this data slate. Tervigon is known by all that I hate that termagaunt spewing barf bag. Too many gargoyles to buy and paint. The wings take forever. Warriors are one of the most mediocre units in the dex. If I wanted mediocrity I would play marines. The artillery would be nice if the exocrine wasn't a 24 inch range. Endless swarm seems nice but, swarms are still completely ineffective even that many. Too easy to die. Even so these data slates have no right being in standard 40k. If people say these are good then they haven't played that many games. Remember I am the a hole. Ask Kevin. 

[Hobbitron]

I think the Skyblight Swarm is where the money is. Keep in mind our conversation from Thursday Shae. With that new formation, you can have 3 flyrants, 1 Hive Crone, 2 Harpies, 3 units of SCORING gargoyles, and 6 measly scoring units in troops. Those 3 units of Gargoyles can come in for a late game objective grab, especially at min size with adrenal glands. They would be able to move 16" reliably. That's 19" range for objectives. On the final turn of the game. That your opponent likely won't be able to respond to in time. It COMPLETELY removes their ability to camp an objective to contest it.

 

It also gives you 6 flyers, and an extra Flyrant beyond the norm. Quite a lot of painting yes, but honestly.... well worth it.

 

The other two worth mentioning are Endless Swarm for the same reasons as the gargoyles from above (there are just more). And the other is living artillery node. Though the artillery node is slightly less impressive. It's good, but I don't see it being as game changing as the two others.

 

One of the perks of formations, is they work outside of FOC. Which means that the artillery node is a fairly small footprint in points. And you can still take 3 more biovores, or 3 mawlocs, or 3 exocrines, or any combination thereof.

 

This is why I'm not a huge fan of dataslates. Those can give a pretty big swing to a game.

[Munkie]

Our local 'nid players seem to have reversed roles. I am intrigued.

[intrizic]

It's new dad delirium, once Shawn gets some sleep he'll come to his senses ;)

[huggies01]

It's not that I don't think it's good. It's too good. Just like playing Necrons in 5th, people won't want to play against it. I am just against apocalypse in 40k. Too much.

[Hobbitron]

Shaun

 

FTFY ;)

 

But seriously, the more I think about it the better the Skyblight swarm gets. Also the only formation to include 3 of the new $80 models. Coincidence? I THINK NOT.

 

Think about it as the person playing against the nids. There are three scoring units that can be used to not only deny you an objective, but to claim the points themselves despite you being on top of them. And if you kill the unit, there is a 50% chance for them to come back. That means that in any objective game, killing them in any turn other than 7 is dangerous because they can come back on and steal an objective. You are camping the 4 point objective with 10 scoring paladins? Well, F you, I get to claim it regardless. With 1 gargoyle. You can't kill the unit too early because they can come back, but you can't leave them alone since they can claim the objectives in your deployment zone. But the Nid player can send them into combats that might not favor them because hey, there's a 50% chance that they'll get them back.

 

Gives way too much control over the objectives game to the Nid player. It's sorta like jetbikes doing their crazy run on turn 5, but swap out mobility for stealing objectives, and not staying dead.

 

And then on top of that, there are 6 other scoring units, and 6 FMCs (maybe even more, haven't run the points) that are getting in your way.

 

If I were going to play a competitive game? That's my list. I'll write one up and post it here eventually.

[generalripphook]

I think it would have been cool if they had added some of those abilities to the codex itself instead of making them data slates. Those abilities would be so cool if they could be unit upgrades.

[VonVilkee]

So my question is how many times does that unit get to try and come back? Sounds to me like if the first roll is failed bye bye birdies. Seems like each destroyed unit gets to try but only once.

[white_devil]

So my question is how many times does that unit get to try and come back? Sounds to me like if the first roll is failed bye bye birdies. Seems like each destroyed unit gets to try but only once.

I have the rules.  They consistently come back.  After describing that they come back on a 4+ it states: "...roll a d6 as above if they are subsequently destroyed."

 

Too powerful.  There is a reason dataslates/formations are not allowed at national-level GTs.

[VonVilkee]

I have the rules.  They consistently come back.  After describing that they come back on a 4+ it states: "...roll a d6 as above if they are subsequently destroyed."

 

Too powerful.  There is a reason dataslates/formations are not allowed at national-level GTs.

But if they fail the roll to come back they aren't destroyed... Little bugs are easy to eliminate, most things will crush you first time out but the nuance on the cons is the trick to figuring it out. I'm not disputing that it is prolly the best of the bunch, but when the book came out every one decried the nits as once synapse is gone they cannot score effectively... Wouldn't this still apply?

[Fix]

And of course those gargoyles or gaunts coming back into play could come right out of a Trygon hole, couldn't they?

[huggies01]

Gargoyles have hunt meaning the best of the behaviors. 1-3 goes to ground. Meaning parked on the objective they get a cover save. So you have to kill them all. They don't test when they enter from reserve. Also 180 for a full unit of 30. But the gargoyles aren't the best. It is the culmination of what other units you take to help them. 

[VonVilkee]

Exactly, a bunch of gargs continually running at an objective could be fun, depends on support.

 

Also the gargs have to make it within 3" of that objective... Just cuz they Clown don't mean they have it...

[PumpkinHead]

If you assume a list something like:

Flyrant w/ TL Devs

Flyrant w/ TL Devs

venomthrope

3 warriors w/ barbed strangler

3 warriors w/ barbed strangler

Crone

Crone

dataslate: skyblight swarm

 

That comes out to 8 FMCs and 5 scoring units.  3 scoring units which can deepstrike and hold objectives no matter what, plus if you kill them there is a 50% chance they will come back next turn and 2 synapse units to hold back objectives and help cast that all important synapse web.

 

I like the warriors for back up synapse just in case my 3 tyrants die an untimely death.  Though I am toying with the idea of using genestealers in the backfield with an ADL to help give them cover and they can go to ground...

 

I am not saying this is a friendly list by any means, heck I would almost call it straight Dbag. But this is what I expect to see soon.

[Raak]

Also the gargs have to make it within 3" of that objective... Just cuz they Clown don't mean they have it...

 

I know... but once they gain the 3" proximity and have, effectively, a 4++ to re-spawn, infinitely can't they just sit there and then nothing can move them off?

 

Note: I am not arguing rules. I'm just trying to learn them :)

[PumpkinHead]

I know... but once they gain the 3" proximity and have, effectively, a 4++ to re-spawn, infinitely can't they just sit there and then nothing can move them off?

 

Note: I am not arguing rules. I'm just trying to learn them :)

 

The gargs go back into ongoing reserve, so they wont come back for a turn.  So the whole unit needs to die and then come back.  Either via board edge or deepstriking.

[Raak]

The gargs go back into ongoing reserve, so they wont come back for a turn.  So the whole unit needs to die and then come back.  Either via board edge or deepstriking.

 

Ahhh. I see now. Thank you!

[VonVilkee]

Also I'm thinking a fail on that 4+ means bye bye unit... It ain't destroyed so it doesn't go back into ongoing reserves it really was eliminated.

[Hobbitron]

Also I'm thinking a fail on that 4+ means bye bye unit... It ain't destroyed so it doesn't go back into ongoing reserves it really was eliminated.

Which means you're no worse off than you were in the first place. You aren't paying extra points for those gargoyles. They're the same cost as every other gargoyle out there. But 50% of the time, they will end up back on the table. And between wings, Trygon Prime, and Lictors, they have a lot of potential to end up deep into the table. Objectives don't move, so if you deep strike a trygon within 21" of an objective (hint, you can't scatter more than 12") then deploy within 12" of the 5" hole, 3" to claim, min 1" run then Gargoyles can get to it and claim it in 1 turn. The only way to protect it at that point is to bubble wrap it or put something impassable (land raider? But I don't think they're quite big enough to do it if I just assault it). Or being able to wipe the unit to a man before the game ends (and if you do so there is a 50% chance that they can just do it again).

 

Endless Swarm is a pretty stupid rule. It has too much potential to be a big swing.

 

Also, finally the Trygon hole can be USEFUL.

[VonVilkee]

Are you sure the gargs can use the hole? Thought it dictated what units could use it?

[Hobbitron]

Are you sure the gargs can use the hole? Thought it dictated what units could use it?

 

Any unit that is in reserves. That's part of the key of why it sucks though, it it's reserves. Not Deep Strike. Usually it's more frustrating than anything, but in this case... it's good.

[VonVilkee]

Still means you have a trygon instead of additional flying monstrous creatures...

 

I am finding it somewhat entertaining that everyone one decried the nids faults at launch and how they couldn't cope with certain things... Now they have ways to cope and it its omg!

[Hobbitron]

The problem is that it's a Dataslate. If you compare barebones codexes to one another, Nids will struggle against the top tiers. Granted, everyone but the top tiers struggle against the top tiers. If Dataslates level the playing field then that's awesome. But they don't. Instead they make the game more unbalanced than they were without them. And since many tournaments aren't allowing them..... they'll make for some fun casual play, but has no impact on more competitive settings. So getting a boost (even if I think it's a bit big of a boost for one particular formation, the others are more reasonable or just terrible) that won't impact where people really want to see things be more competitive is like a slap in the face. I don't want to bring that formation out against people because it would make for bad games. But, the place I do want to bring it (competitive tournaments) won't allow it.

[PumpkinHead]

I believe you have to be infantry to use the Trygon's tunnel.