WestRider Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Nah, man, because then you need to make a fox Telion and a badger Chaplain and a rooster Librarian and... ;) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 Hmmm...Okay, so started looking at that BA codex. As much as I like the SW, I think the BA suit my needs more than the SW do. A bit annoying, as I do really like that SW book. Deal is that I've got a bunch of SM models that I can't field in the current DA book (like Scout bikers), and I've got a few RT space marines with things like Hand Flamers or apothecaries with bolters, which I really want to field and can't in the DA or SW books. Most of those SW models I really like, would require purchases I don't want to make. Sad, but true. BA also have really practical army options Their relics are very practical, too. They also have that HQ dread which is not an special character, so I don't have to feel weird running SW characters in my non-SW army. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 Work in progress, but I think it's coming together. I think my install of battlescribe is faulty and I need to uninstall and reinstall. Lion Warriors (Flesh Tearer's) Strike Force HQ Librarian Dreadnought (Relic Extra Armor, Heavy Flamer) 175pts -Dreadpod 50pts Apothecary (Relic Jump Pack, Relic Bolter, Melta Bomb) 100pts Troops Tactical Squad (5, Heavy Flamer, Sarge with BP+Hand Flamer) 90pts Fast Attack Razorback (Las/Plas) 85pts Subtotal: 500pts DA Detachment: HQ Undecided And GK Detachment: Also Undecided For starts, a good chunk of the point of the BA is so I can field a few RT models and some conversions that the other armies can't field....The bolter apothecary and the BP+hand flamer sarge are old RT models that really want to see the light of day. Same with the Las/Plas Razorback. I've got this dread conversion in mind where he's got a lance, so the libby dread is in there for that. Allows me to field the dreadpod too. That BA relic jump pack is a super cheesy addition to a DS unit, as it forces my opponent to only be able to snap at them when they arrive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
generalripphook Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 Why do you always have so many detatchments? Seems like a lot of wasted points in taxes to have so many. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted July 11, 2015 Report Share Posted July 11, 2015 Yeah, multiple detachments only really works when you're not having to take a lot of bad units to get where you're going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why do you always have so many detatchments? Seems like a lot of wasted points in taxes to have so many. Huh? No, I field lots of detachments so I can field more obscure or enjoyable models. That is the entire point. I very much like the variety, and very much dislike repeating units in my army (though I do spam units when fielding proxies, as it's a kindness to my opponent so we can keep track of things easier). And 3 formations is nothing. I really want to run 5 or 6 (GK, DA, another marine, AM, one of the admechs, and an assassin, plus a fortification in the mix), but it seems excessive, especially as my armies aren't fully painted at the moment. PS: My Tzeentch Daemons are very much a 1 or 2 detachment army, but are coming very along very slowly (mostly related to model acquisition). I think the Imperium being with lots of allies is very fitting and fluffy, while Tzeentch Chaos Daemons make more sense with maybe 1 ally, but probably going it alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 On a side note, battlescribe is working great now that I removed it and reinstalled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 12, 2015 Report Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why do you always have so many detatchments? Seems like a lot of wasted points in taxes to have so many. Yeah, multiple detachments only really works when you're not having to take a lot of bad units to get where you're going. But yes, agree with both of you that multiple detachments can be very taxing on both points and logistics. Didn't mean to be dismissive of your constructive comments. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Still piecing things together. Here, DA Command Squad (5, 5x Grav guns, Sacred Standard) 200pts. Spendy and questionable, but I'm tinkering with the concept. Standard makes the unit relentless, so they have the full 15 shots after they emerge from a drop pod or transport. That's BS4, so 10 hits and 6.66 ap2 wounds against MEQ (and wraithknights). Target would still get invulnerable, cover and FNP saves, so things like wraith knights probably won't die outright, but it would be enough to Concuss the wraithknight, allowing another unit to more easily defeat it in melee. Now I could lose 25pts by switching to combi-grav with no losses on the drop, but the kicker is that the DA have that improved overwatch BS, so the grav would be pretty awesome if charged. So cost debates hinge on whether the unit is to function in a suicidal role or one that lasts (which would require further point increases, like storm shields for the unit at +50pts). And yet another option would to take grav pistols instead of the grav guns, which would lose 35pts since I wouldn't need the standard. That said, I'd go from 15 shots to 5 shots and 6" less range.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Consider also adding a Tanking Character if you want them to last. Possibly with a Combi-Grav of their own. This is something else I've been thinking of doing with the Master from my Battle Company. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Consider also adding a Tanking Character if you want them to last. Possibly with a Combi-Grav of their own. This is something else I've been thinking of doing with the Master from my Battle Company. DA don't really have very good tanking IC options. I mean, we've got FNP and 2+/3++, but no eternal warriors and no cheap IC access (like wolf guard battle leaders). Seems iffy via the DA codex. If I'm just looking for a guy with a 3++, may as well go the SS route for the command squad. Now, I could add Draigo, or something like that, and make a monster unit, but I'm not sure it's worth the points. As this unit is already equal in cost to 5 DW knights, once you add a drop pod. It is notable that my first read of the Sacred Standard missed that it only applies to DA models. So I can't add outside ICs to benefit from the standard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Though on subject with the DA relentless banner, there is another approach with the Eye of the Unseen, allowing re-rolls with get's hot weapons. Not quite what it does, but you could use it for a command squad with lots of plasma to that effect. Would be very DA-like, to feature a unit with loads of plasma. You could technically stack the banner and the eye, but that's 75pts of upgrades that don't do anything.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Company Master can't tank against the really heavy stuff, no, but if you give him Artificer Armour, he can really help against massed fire. And like I said, I'm thinking about this in the context of the Battle Company, where I've got a Master sitting around anyhow that I don't really have a great idea for what to do with. Since I've got him anyhow, paying another 45 Points (SS, Artificer, Combi-Grav) to make that Squad last significantly longer seems like a pretty decent investment. Maybe another 15 to get an Apothecary in there. I want to like the Eye, because Preferred Enemy is a pretty awesome ability, but 40 Points is really steep for it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Company Master can't tank against the really heavy stuff, no, but if you give him Artificer Armour, he can really help against massed fire. And like I said, I'm thinking about this in the context of the Battle Company, where I've got a Master sitting around anyhow that I don't really have a great idea for what to do with. Since I've got him anyhow, paying another 45 Points (SS, Artificer, Combi-Grav) to make that Squad last significantly longer seems like a pretty decent investment. Maybe another 15 to get an Apothecary in there. I want to like the Eye, because Preferred Enemy is a pretty awesome ability, but 40 Points is really steep for it. The Eye would be viable with plasma guns INSTEAD of the banner. Especially if going with a full combi-plasma squad of 10 members (like vets). 20 plas shots, 3 (or so) overheats, normally 1 dead marine, eye would both remove that and give you 2 more hits. That said, plasma is way less effective against things like wraith knights. Eye also has no value regarding get's hot if the weapon is already twin linked (like plasma talons). Though if fielding multiple factions/detachments, the Eye works with joined units, while the banner does not. Apothecary can't take any weapons in the DA codex, so you indirectly lose grav shots by taking that apothecary. Might still be viable, but's adding more points to a small squad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 If the Eye were 20 Points, there would be places I could go for it, but anywhere it's worth 40, the volume of fire is either overkill or inefficiently applied. Yeah, you probably saved one dude from overheating there and got another couple of hits, but anything that the difference between 14 and 16 Plasma hits matters, you should probably be shooting with something else instead. I was looking at it for things like Guard Blobs, and it never worked out any better than than the extra benefits available by putting a Divination Psyker or a Wolf Priest or something in there instead. I've seen the upgrade thing argued both ways. If you can choose the order you take options, you give a Veteran a Grav Gun, and then upgrade him to an Apothecary. I believe there's some contradiction that arises if you can't choose the order, but I don't recall what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 If the Eye were 20 Points, there would be places I could go for it, but anywhere it's worth 40, the volume of fire is either overkill or inefficiently applied. Yeah, you probably saved one dude from overheating there and got another couple of hits, but anything that the difference between 14 and 16 Plasma hits matters, you should probably be shooting with something else instead. I was looking at it for things like Guard Blobs, and it never worked out any better than than the extra benefits available by putting a Divination Psyker or a Wolf Priest or something in there instead. I've seen the upgrade thing argued both ways. If you can choose the order you take options, you give a Veteran a Grav Gun, and then upgrade him to an Apothecary. I believe there's some contradiction that arises if you can't choose the order, but I don't recall what it is. Regarding the Apothecary, I think it's pretty clear. GW is pretty consistent within that DA book regarding the use of the word "any model may take..." Versus, "Any Veteran may take..." As for the order of upgrading models to get extra wargear on characters without wargear access, that one is very fishy. As for the Eye of Night, I'm really not fully advocating it. I think prefered enemy can be very strong, especially with get's hot weapons and LBSF's full BS overwatch. Given that plasma ususally wounds on 2s, the prefered enemy re-roll to wound is pretty strong too. 40pts is a lot, though, I totally agree. On a side note, I think the CAD is probably better than the DA Demi-company (or lion's blade strike force) most of the time. It's just an army flexibility thing, especially if your event limits your number of detachments. Those new DA scouts are pretty amazing too, and the one's in the lion's blade strike force lose objective secured.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 No argument that Preferred Enemy is strong. Just that this is an inefficient way to get it. If I want Preferred Enemy Plasma, I'll run Skitarii. They get it just for selecting my Warlord. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 No argument that Preferred Enemy is strong. Just that this is an inefficient way to get it. If I want Preferred Enemy Plasma, I'll run Skitarii. They get it just for selecting my Warlord. Ah, then I agree. Though you can't attach a skitarii IC to that DA command squad, as the skitarii lack ICs.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Yeah, there is no "good" way to get it into a lot of Units, since there are few ICs with it. Ulrik is the only one I can think of off the top of my head who just straight up provides PE, tho regular Wolf Priests let you pick a Unit Type, and there are a lot of Armies where that will do you almost as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 13, 2015 Report Share Posted July 13, 2015 Yeah, there is no "good" way to get it into a lot of Units, since there are few ICs with it. Ulrik is the only one I can think of off the top of my head who just straight up provides PE, tho regular Wolf Priests let you pick a Unit Type, and there are a lot of Armies where that will do you almost as well. To be fair, those wolf priests are pretty spendy, too. 110pts base. 105pts for a libby with the eye, though the two are rather different ICs. Though, again, I agree, there really aren't a lot of good units that really need preferred enemy enough to justify the high cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 15, 2015 Report Share Posted July 15, 2015 Still tinkering. I am building units, but nothing I'm certain I'll field in anything but apocalypse. I did switch over to the Concecrators paint theme (4th or 5th switch in paint since this thread started....) for my DA, as their fluff just matches my army too well (almost entirely metal models, most are RT or other early editions of models). So, for other finds/options. First, probably not too viable, but I made an interesting find in that the DA Interagator chappy can take a power fist in addition to their existing two weapons. This means that I could potentially field 3 weapons on the same chappy IC, which would mean I could retain a bonus attack while gaining a ranged weapon like a combi-bolter. Second, and again iffy, is that the DA melee and ranged weapon tables for PA models require a "melee weapon" instead of the more traditional chainsword or close combat weapon requirement. So I could swap out the corzius arcanum, force sword, or even a servo arm, as these are all listed as melee weapons. Somewhat iffy if the servo harness' weapons can be swapped, but it's pretty clear the stock servo arm is a melee weapon and could be swapped. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 More or less a joke list, but here's my "free crap list" Lion's Blade Strike Force (DA) Demi-Company #1 -Chappy -tact squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -tact squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -tact squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -Assault squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -dev squad (5) --Dedicated Razor Demi-Company #2 -Company Commander -tact squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -tact squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -tact squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -Assault squad (5) --Dedicated Razor -dev squad (5) --Dedicated Razor Aux Scouts -Scouts (5) Archangels Sanguine Wing (BA, Exterminatus book) -Vanguard Vets (10, jump packs, 10 power weapons) -Vanguard Vets (10, jump packs, 10 power weapons) -Sternguard (10, 10 combi weapons) -Stormraven Total: 1795pts of target 1850pts. Included is 550pts of free razorbacks, 100pts of free combi-weapons, and 300pts of free power weapons, for a total of 950pts of free gear. I've even got 55pts to kick around. And I'm only using 2 detachments.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 This is quite a challenge to paint on a small shoulder pad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Bones of Baelsor ...15 points Dreadnought, Death Company Dreadnought, Furioso Dreadnought or Librarian Dreadnought only. A Dreadnought equipped with the Bones of Baelsor counts Crew Stunned results from the Vehicle Damage table as Crew Shaken results instead. Furthermore, penetrating hits caused by Tyranid bio-plasma, bio-plasmic cannons or venom cannon weapons on a Dreadnought equipped with the Bones of Baelsor are treated as glancing hits instead. The Executioner’s Hood... 5 points Librarian only. The bearer of the Executioner’s Hood is unaffected by the Shadow in the Warp special rule. :laugh: From the Archangels and Fleshtearers rules in Exterminatus. I find these funny, because they are tyranid specific buffs, which is such a low blow, as they nerf areas where tyranids already struggle.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestRider Posted July 16, 2015 Report Share Posted July 16, 2015 Nah, those nerf Nids in areas they don't even bother anymore. The Dreads are gonna get Glanced down by TL Devs, and I think most Nid Players have already forgotten that SitW even has a Game Effect :P The really amusing thing to me is that a DC Dread pays just as much for the Bones as any other, despite already being completely immune to Stunned results ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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