How do YOU use Scout Sentinels?

[Gorgosaurusrex]

Greetings all,

 

I've just finished cleaning up and assembling my unit of three Scout Sentinels that I've recently acquired. Now that they have proper Valhallan pilots the time has come to choose their weapons!

 

I have everything I need to give them Autocannons and Hunter-Killer Missiles, which is the route I think I'm going to go. They can then outflank and hit some juicy side armor with 6 S7 and 3 S8 shots... Then they can die to Bolter fire.

 

My question is this - How do YOU like to equip and use Scout Sentinels? Do you outflank them with Autocannons as I will? Do you scout them forward with Heavy Flamers? I'm interested to see other people's opinions, as this is a unit I rarely see on the tabletop.

[fluger]

I think autocannons are about the best bet for them.  Be prepared to accept that they will almost assuredly underperform and die quickly.  I actually like the HK + AC setup (WestRider used this I believe).  It gives you a nice volley the turn you show up and isn't CRAZY expensive.  It's a decent distraction unit, they just suffer from being so fragile.  

[Guest]

They collect dust in my bits bin, along with most of my IG that hasn't been given the attention to convert into AM... (yeah, "converting" from IG to AM).

 

On paper, I like that the AM camonetting is less restictive than the previous incarnation.

[generalripphook]

I would either go autocannon route or missle launcher, that way you can kill squads that are blobbed up hidden out of sight or double out marines, get through armor and have some nice strength 8

[WestRider]

I prefer Autocannon/H-K, but sometimes I drop down to Multi-Lasers if Points are tight. They're definitely one hit wonders, but they can be useful to keep people's attention divided, and they definitely have the potential to put some hurt on Side Armour. If they do happen to survive their arrival Turn, they can also sometimes hide for Linebreaker.

 

Remember also that they've got pretty impressive range, so against someone who's pulling a Refused Flank or in Vanguard Strike Deployment, it can sometimes be best if they Outflank on the "wrong" side, well away from all those Bolters that would Rapid Fire them to bits if they came on in the middle of everything.

[VonVilkee]

I use them to look all cool and pretty on the shelf! also magnetize those weapons...

[AbusePuppy]

Autocannon is the "good" weapon; H-Ks are... maybe okay? I haven't tested them out, so I couldn't say for sure, but they seem useful for the alpha strike.

[Gorgosaurusrex]

I've already glued the Autocannons and Hunter-Killer Missiles, so it looks like they will be staying lol. They'll be included in my OFCC list so I can see how truly terrible they are!

 

Alpha striking from a flank is the main goal of these guys. The unit is only 150 points and has a ton of reach, so I expect them to (hopefully) kill something the turn they arrive then either die a glorious death or hide and try to snag an objective.

[WestRider]

Autocannon is the "good" weapon; H-Ks are... maybe okay? I haven't tested them out, so I couldn't say for sure, but they seem useful for the alpha strike.

At the very least, H-Ks are less bad here than on any other platform I can think of. I personally think they at least hit "decent" in this situation, but they're still overpriced.

[Chappy]

I use 3 Autocannon Scout Sentinels in my Catachans. They are great for getting ignored, moving down a flank, and getting side armor shots. And they are awesome in maelstrom as they run around getting objectives and linebreaker.

[Guest]

HKs are the weapon I want to like, but they always seem to under preform. Perhaps it's a perception involving the once per game aspect.

[WestRider]

HKs are the weapon I want to like, but they always seem to under preform. Perhaps it's a perception involving the once per game aspect.

Yeah, you need a bunch of them to really get a good impression of what they can do. That said, the Krak Missile profile is somewhat less impressive than GW seems to think, and pretty much everywhere you can get a weapon like that, it's overpriced.

 

For IG, there's a fairly easy comparison that can give a better impression of how they work out: 6 H-Ks cost the same as a single Infantry Squad with a Missile Launcher, which will likely average 6 shots per Game. There are obviously a ton of other variables in play, but I found that running a couple of ML Squads and a bunch of H-Ks together for a few Games gave me a pretty good feel for what I could expect from them. Takes a pretty big Army to get enough depth to make it work, probably ~2K.

[Gorgosaurusrex]

I really want Hunter-Killers to be good, but they really aren't. I think they are passable on an outflanking unit as they will always get to fire before getting destroyed, but they really shouldn't be 10 points each.

[fluger]

The problem is that the points values in 40k are so arbitrary and have no basis on actual utility.  For instance, why is a HK missile the same point at BS3 as BS4 or on a outflanking capable unit compared to a normal one?  

[Guest]

The problem is that the points values in 40k are so arbitrary and have no basis on actual utility.  For instance, why is a HK missile the same point at BS3 as BS4 or on a outflanking capable unit compared to a normal one?  

In 7th, I noticed that GW seems to be standardizing the cost of the weapons, and lowering the cost of the base models. In theory, the cost of the BS3 or BS4 is paid in the base model, as is the special rules like outflank. I think that's the intended logic.

 

Anyway, outflanking itself, means at least one less turn on the table as a model deployed normally. That's one less shooting phase. That, to me, the cost of outflanking by itself. Model also counts as moving when they arrive, so 6" move means that if you want that BS 3 or 4, you can only snap with a normal speed vehicle arriving from outflank.

 

I do still really want a scout unit where every member can take HK missiles. One use missiles are very "scouty" in nature.

[InfestedKerrigan]

In 7th, I noticed that GW seems to be standardizing the cost of the weapons.

 

In the 16 years I've been playing, I've pretty much always viewed the weapons as having a standard cost.  7th edition doesn't have [big bad swear word] to do with it.

[fluger]

In the 16 years I've been playing, I've pretty much always viewed the weapons as having a standard cost.  7th edition doesn't have [big bad swear word] to do with it.

 

I remember different common items having different costs depending on the unit.  For instance, in the 4th edition Ork Dex, 'eavy armor cost different points for different HQs.  Stuff like that.  

 

In general though, it's always been that way.  

[InfestedKerrigan]

Yeah, true enough.  Back when ICs were paying a different price in the Wargear section.  I guess mentally I don't consider ICs the same in relation to the rest of the units.  Otherwise, PW, Meltas, ML, etc all feel like the same price to me.  

 

But it still isn't anything to do with 7th.  It was going from 4th ed to 5th ed that we saw that change, wasn't it?  

[fluger]

IIRC, early 5th codexes still had different costs for similar things.  

[InfestedKerrigan]

Are we talking about an Eldar Flame Thrower compared to an Imperial Guard Flame Thrower, or are we talking a Dev Lascannon vs a Tact Lascannon?

[fluger]

Dev and tactical yeah.  I could be mistaken though, happens a lot.  

[WestRider]

Are we talking about an Eldar Flame Thrower compared to an Imperial Guard Flame Thrower, or are we talking a Dev Lascannon vs a Tact Lascannon?

Both. For a while there, IG (for instance) had significantly different Points Costs for various weapons than Marines did. And during the same time period, Devs and such paid more for their Heavy Weapons than regular Squads.

[BrainFireBob]

Deliberately, because to quote Overfiend AC "Two is more than twice as good as one." True of flamers, not so true of most DEV weapons.

 

Yeah, H/K are overpriced most times. Worth it on things like Vindicators (add it and a storm bolter, and you go from 100% change of losing the battlecannon on weapon destroyed to 33%), possibly on Sentinels.

 

That said, one of the first Apoc games I played, I was badly burned by a buddy who took H/Ks on everything that could; and who alpha struck the ever-living hell out of me with their "unlimited range" profile during his first shooting phase.

[fluger]

It wasn't uncommon during 5th edition mech spam fest to put an HK on every rhino/razorback and just try and alpha strike to victory. 

[AbusePuppy]

For a very specific kind of list, yes, I think it was mostly only BA that did it, too, since they had the Fast vehicles to actually use that extra weapon on all their Razorbacks.