peter.cosgrove

I see, the green checkmark was for the 150 and not the 300. ok. holdon

150 points 2x NISSE w/MULTI Sniper Rifle 34/68 pts & 3 SWC 2x AKAL Commando w/ Combi Rifle 22/44 pts 1x Knight Hospitaller Lieutenant w/ MULTI rifle38 pts 300 points (299) (above) + 2x NISSE w/MULTI Sniper Rifle 34/68 pts & 3 SWC 2x AKAL Commando w/ Combi Rifle 22/44 pts 1x Knight Hospitaller Doctor w/ Combi Rifle 37 pts I got the green checkmark on the ITS off the webpage army builder which I assume means it's legit/no warnings. I wasn't sure if you can mix/match 2 seperate factions.

If you have a list that has a trait you really want, but the list isn't good with deep strike, you use the drop pods to add deep strike to the list. A good example is Blood Angels vs Black Templars. Black Templars get to re-roll charge distance but Blood Angels have good melee traits. So if you don't want to muck around with how hard it is to get charge distance re-rolls from Blood Angels then you can build a Black Templars list and add Drop Pods.

Monday 6PM GG?

176, 177, 183, and anywhere where it says "Set up". "A unit must be set up and finish any sort of move as a group" "Many units have the ability to be set up" "Units that are set up in this manner cannot move or advance further" "When a unit disembarks, set it up on the battlefield" "When you set up a transport, units can start the battle embarked within it instead of being set up separately" "Create the Battlefield and set up terrain" "Before setting up their armies" "Models must be set up in their own deployment zone" "Set up the Daemon Prince within 6" of your character" The legion traits don't apply to the daemon prince, only infantry/bikers/helbrutes. And the sword/talon are, for all intentional purposes, exactly the same. Same str, same AP, only diff is damage, but the talons grant re-rolls to wound. And all in all they don't present a very real threat to even a Rhino. According to the stats it should take a Daemon Prince two turns to kill a Rhino. It's very odd. It has stats, except for the re-roll 1's on the aura, that resemble a helbrute. The exception is that the Daemon Prince is a character with under 10 wounds.

You know, the Daemon Prince is odd. You would think they would get more attacks or something. 189 points with wings/warp bolter. Granted hitting on 2's with re-rolls of 1. It's almost as if they want to force you to take the malefic talons. 17 damage in 6 attacks vs 8 attacks for 16 damage for Khorne. 7 Attacks for 14 damage + Smite for the other 3. The axe at S8, hitting on 3's with a re-roll and wounding on 2's. it's almost as if they deliberately said, We would rather you not be able to kill vehicles/models with T7/T8 with Daemon Princes.

A building isn't ruins, it's a building. Thing is, there isn't rules for buildings. There are rules for transports that don't move or may even be fixed to the terrain or map board. I would say that if two people are playing and would rather define something as a stationary unaligned transport then that piece of terrain needs to be clearly defined before the battle. And if the two players don't want to define it as either ruins or transport and would rather define it as scratch built terrain to gain eligibility for a cover save then that needs to be defined before the battle. The thing about transports is, if you take a look at all the stuff we talked about for the Nurgle Plague Tower, how well can you define a model or terrain piece that allows models embarked in it to shoot, be shot at, be assaulted and have enemy models to be placed on the transport. It's neither easy or simple. Sounds like the best option for what you want to do is to use the scratch built terrain rules in BRB to have a conversation before the battle about what you want the piece of terrain to be able to do. Remember that units that are set up on the battlefield count as having moved for all rules purposes, for example shooting heavy weapons. "Typically this happens at the end of the movement phase, but it can also happen in other phases". Other phases include deployment. The key words/term is "set up", as in "The player who finished setting up their army.." and "Before setting up their armies, both players roll off..." and "-such units must be set up on the battlefield during deployment, using the Concealed Deployment rules."

all my friends wonder why I don't like to go camping or hiking..

80$ for that? Looks awesome if it comes painted/put together. If I have to build it/paint it it's guaranteed to not be worth 80$ after I get done with it.

Here is how I define the difference between Cheese and Not-Cheese. Is it a model that the person has had since before 7E? Then it's not cheese to bring it. If someone is buying a new model specifically to put it on the board to win in casual play that's cheese. Kind of. Personally I prefer to see people get excited about cool models and really good painting of new models. I can't paint for beans so I really enjoy seeing what everyone can do. I would rather get tabled by really georgeous models than win against the kind of paint/basing that resembles the stuff I put on the table. We had enough with the whole 7E P2W structure. Now, separate from that is the points vs power level "cheese". Some units give added value for the same power level over other units that don't. A good example is Devastators/Havocs. The base power level for these units is essentially the same as their troop squad equivalent, however the power level allows you to bring 4 heavy weapons with no change to the power level as opposed to 2 weapons for the troop squad. Said added heavy weapons can triple the cost of the unit in points value A really good example of this is Thousand Sons Rubric Marines, for the same power level every Rubric can be given warpflamers, whereas that doubles the points cost for the unit. So at that point are the models WYSIWYG and beautiful? Then cool, for power levels/casual play that's awesome, but counts as? eh.. If you want to play-test a list then it really should be points rather than powerlevels.

OF posesses a VERY large amount of terrain. In order to host OFCC/GG cups etc where the number of tables reaches 40-60 tables that means OF has to not only have the table boarding, the surface prep (mats/felting, etc), it also has to have all the terrain to make the tables worthwhile to play on thematically. Since OF hosts events where multiple systems are playing at the same time (Warhammer/9th Age/AOS/Infinity/Malifeaux/Warmachine/Blood Bowl/Shadowwars) it means having Lots of nice looking terrain and table prep available. 8E has, perhaps, caused a certain amount of consternation regarding terrain rules. Since 8E has dropped we have had 2 terrain days to conduct repair/replace/improvements on our existing terrain as well as personal efforts to add to our existing terrain with asthetic and thematic fashion and appeal. I would recommend that if you want to assist the overall efforts and to address your query directly that you come to our next terrain day, we still have large amount of unbuilt terrain and basing that can be built and painted up to better alleviate the 8E terrain angst.

Well, 3 things. 4 things. First, personally, if I was the opponent, knowing that the wings option is free on the Choas boon table I would just say, wow that's really cool, Oh ya? just give it wings dude, no worries. Second, The Ruins are really only supposed to be the current run of GW models they have for sale, That means that both the 2nd and 3rd floor are within 6" (The bulkheads are 2 3/4"). We've measured them and that fact actually came up last tue. Sure there's lots of terrain that are now OOP that have the 3rd floor higher on the base model, but those terrain kits are not on sale. For non-standard ruins you can have the conversation with your opponent to have each floor be a standard 3" vertical measurement. Certainly anything with a distance over 5" is going to be extremely difficult to use as terrain given some of the movements are 5". That's another challenge we have had given the terrain that OF has available. If you go WYSIWYG on non-GW terrain/OOP terrain this is one of the challenges players will face and should have a conversation about before the game. 3rd. If you have terrain set up in such a fashion that you are on more of a cityscape, hivecity, space hulky sort of thing where there are LOTS of vertical distances, then first remember that it's ONLY ruins that have that rule. The Battlescape, that tall refinery/pipeline thingy that came out during Shadowwars, etc etc, are not ruins, UNLESS you define it that way. Scratch built terrain, certainly you can have the conversation with your opponent. Bear in mind that pretty much everything that isn't "pre-defined" by the BRB is essentially hills even if they aren't. And that means the only real effect, since you don't get model eligibility for a cover save, is if you get full LOS blocking terrain pieces. the BRB defines a hill as "...raised areas that offer troops on top of them commanding views and fields of fire" So it really doesn't matter if it's a piece of foam with grass or a piece of plastic with railings, gantry's and raised walkways. The important bit for the game is "do you gain eligibility for a cover save". 4th. We've had this discussion on these forums regarding cover save, and we've had these discussions regarding OF terrain. Pretty much everyone is in the same boat. Almost every piece of terrain that everyone has (OF, game stores, personal use at home) really only qualifies as "hills". 8E, in it's simplified manner, seperates the esoteric conversation into two simple answers. "Does this piece of terrain make a model eligible for a cover save; Yes/no". So if there is a piece of terrain that should allow a cover save, but doesn't, because it's not 8E ruins, then there needs to be a pre-game conversation between the players, or possibly the TO needs to have a pre-event briefing regarding the terrain, etc, about how, if it should give a cover save it does so. One of the simplest manners of doing so, certainly a very comfortable manner of doing so, is to simply qualify a piece of terrain as "ruins". But it doesn't have to be that way because the rules actually says "scratch built terrain" as opposed to "hills". It may be, in regards to your query, that a piece of terrain makes models eligible for a cover save, but does not have the ruins rule regarding Monsters/Vehicles. That would make it scratch built terrain rules, which is fine and something to have a pre-game conversation about. BRB says "If you wish to incorporate such terrain features into your battlefields, you and your opponent will need to devise your own rules for them". Certainly, if a piece of terrain is WYSIWYG capable of allowing a vehicle/monster on it but is also WYSIWYG capable of giving a cover save then simply saying "this is scratch built, gives eligibility to a cover save" and leave it at that. In reality, unless it's a GW model it can't be "Ruins" anyway.

The Choas Boon table specifically says "set up" therefore the model would have to be placed on the ground floor. If it can't reach the ground floor the model would be removed.

because there isn't anything called deployment. It's called "set up on the battlefield". This edition GW really are using the 19th century concept of "logical English" Anything with Fly can end their move with their base on Ruins..

you never know, they might just require that blood angels have to be the entire list for red thirst to work. Which brings up an interesting point. I wonder if they will make Black Rage be also a detachment pure trait to work.

When you set up on the battlefield it has to be legal. Any model that can't be set up on the battlefield legally is removed.

uh, well, no. unless BA are going to require the entire battleforged army be BA for the redthirst. 3 detachments in ITC. That's why 3 HQ.

Ok, built a list with current points. Going to expect a price diff which I can hopefully adjust to. 7 Squads Assaults with 2 meltas. 3 Squads Death Company with 5 Plasma Pistols Lemartes / Captain w/ Jump Pack and Combi Melta Primaris Psyker 4 Squads Ratlings 6 Squads Scouts w/ BP/Combat Blade (SGT's W/ Combat Blade/Chainsword. This list means either Lemartes or the CPT will need to start on the board, but trying to squnch in a 3rd HQ for the points is difficult.

For the record I think a system where the obj "caches" being put in place after deployment and a minimum of 6+D6 inches away from any models and scoring points for obj each player turn will be a better system.

I just played my "technically" first game with BA in 8th Edition. I had done some playing with them before now, but this time I built the list with the new codex in mind. My first challenge was balancing the number of units on the board at the beginning of the first turn against the units in deep strike. This is not anything new, 6th Edition brought this into play. I found myself making the same choices I made in 6th, which was to take really cheap infiltrating units (Scouts/Ratlings). Since I was planning on bringing DC in threat density and at least 16 melta guns on Assaults it meant bringing a LOT of scouts/ratlings. I accidently brought 13 units on the board vs the 12 units I had in jump pack deep strike. The scouts are going to be REALLY powerful units. Their deployment rule is very nice since they can be deployed almost anywhere on the board. With the scouts and the ratlings it is very much possible to attain TBC on deployment locking out all deep strike outside of the enemy deployment zone on turn 1 if your opponent wins first turn. I outfitted the scouts with BP's and CC's for the 2A, which meant very cheap Troop units. Should they get the Red Thirst (which I can't see them NOT getting) they are a potent first turn assault unit to lock down enemy shooting. The ratlings are the cheapest snipers in the game with infil rules hitting with sniper weapons on a BS3, and the shoot and scoot rules are extremely handy to gain double movement when necessary. I think that with a bit of care it's possible to bring cheaper sniper units than ratilings with the expectation that you will be camping them in your deployment zone, maybe 2 units, possibly 3. Something to look at. Especially if you can get non Auxilla sniper units with the cadian re-rolls. In the BA attachments I brought 8 Assaults with 2 meltas and 3 DC squads with 5 Plasma Pistols and Lemartes. I ended up using a Primaris Psyker as the 3rd HQ choice for the BA detachment, which meant no chapter trait however I wasn't playing with any chapter traits so it was a moot point. My opponent was playing Tau and had first turn. His first turn of shooting took out most of my scout squads. ATSKNF is hugely important to maintain a unit on the board My first turn, dropped in all the meltas and plasma pistols, camping Lemartes in with the 3 DC squads for the charge re-rolls. The melta's did their job killing everything I had set them up against to kill. Made the mistake of killing the one thing that was within 9" of the DC/Lemartes blob with overcharged Plasma pistols so they couldn't get a charge in AND I lost 4 DC from plasma pistol overcharge (I didn't bring a captain or lieutenant for the re-rolls to hit, which I could have done if I had taken a closer look at the list). I was able to get 2 squads Assaults in the charge however. My opponents second turn. He fell back the units my assaults had charged and he killed more ratlings/snipers who had objective control as well as killing more of the DC units. The 6+ FNP on the DC, I didn't get 1 roll off for so the DC guys died in droves, however Lemartes 9 LD meant the remainder of the DC was unfazed. My 2nd turn, got all the melta's into double tap range and continued to compress the remaining Tau units into his deployment zone. I missed a LOT of melta shots but got all the assaults in. Without the Red Thirst the combats were typically even. Game ended 2nd turn due to time, final score 11 to 7. Some thoughts/concerns. Rolling a full on BA jump pack list takes a LONG time. Granted it's always taken a long time but knowing your list/units really helps to make the game smoother. Plan on your opponent gaining first turn. I had 25 units which is typical for a BA assault list.

I think we got what we needed. The interesting thing is that the pre-proceeding discussion regarding the next league has kind of the same "cache based" mechanic to track wins/tactical decision making as the cache system I reworked from shadowwars. edit that to say I don't think there is a need to continue the beta test. Thank you all for playing, we had a very good set of constructive discussions regarding how an almost pure "objective based" game league could work and the associated problems with it.

I actually built a landraider JUST for gating, but GK are TOO expensive for me to field.

I'm new to it. the cards match the models. And I think 3d terrain would be better all round, but probably need to keep it in a 2x2 or somesuch until you get enough models in the roster to warrant a bigger sandbox.

no? Ah, there is a league discount if you buy GW stuff on wednesdays. So if you want to buy anything with a discount go on wednesday. And it looks like we will be in the wow clubhouse on saturday.