Tyranids are here!

[Lord Hanaur]

Well, I don't even own a single one.  I just like building lists.  :D  

You do like doing that.  that's true.  i am going to have to beg Westrider to let me borrow his junk pile (read:  Tyranids) so i can play with them like LEGO's...and with each passing game, i will grow my LEGO construct stronger and more fearsome!  GRAR.  until finally it is winning tournaments.  And then i will cry from atop the mountain:  "LONG LIVE THE ABSENT MINDED PROFESSOR AND HIS CEASLESS PERSUIT OF THE MIGHTY FLUBBER!".  And they said it couldn't be done.  HA!

 

For the law of Lord Hanaur reads:  That which is awesome must be fielded.

[Guest]

Or two pennies!

Those weigh nothing...

 

Nickels fit perfectly in 25mm bases, though you can get washers that work just as well and cost less.

-Pax

[Gorgosaurusrex]

Those weigh nothing...

 

Nickels fit perfectly in 25mm bases, though you can get washers that work just as well and cost less.

-Pax

 

For some reason I assumed nickels would be too big (I didn't have any to test at the time I started gluing dimes from the change drawer). Thanks for the washer suggestion, I will try that.

[Lord Hanaur]

PLus you can stack the washers easier.  Chaos Raptors need washers.  Good lawd they are top heavy.

[PumpkinHead]

Quick question:   Since dominion is a blessing, if I cast it on turn 1, it will last until the end of turn 2, correct?

[AbusePuppy]

 

Tyranid Prime:  165

  Norn Crown

 

This is what pisses me off. For the same price, I can get a Chaos Lord on a Juggernaut with a Daemon Weapon a 4++ save.That guy is putting out ~10 S6 AP2 attacks on the charge. The Tyranid Prime doesn't even have AP5.

 

Friggin' Tyranid Prime.

[PumpkinHead]

Under Blessings: ... "unless otherwise stated, last until the end of the following turn." ...

 

I read this as saying it will last until the end of my next turn, not lasts until my next turn starts.

[WestRider]

That means the end of the following Player Turn, since it doesn't specify Game Turn. Because you cast Blessings during your own Turn, the end of the following Turn would be the end of your Opponent's Turn.

[PumpkinHead]

Ok, thanks.  I forgot about the distinction of player turn and game turn.

[WestRider]

My take on abusing the Firestorm Redoubt. This is at 1500, where it's kind of maybe barely viable, but that's what I mostly play these days. I suspect I could make it a lot more solid at 1850 or so.

 

Tyranid Prime, Norn Crown, Rending Claws, DeathSpitter
Venomthrope
Firestorm Redoubt, Magos Machine Spirit, Comms Relay
2x3 Hive Guard, Toxin Sacs, Adrenal Glands
2x10Termagants
15 Gargoyles, Adrenal Glands
14 Gargoyles, Adrenal Glands
2x DakkaFex
Biovore

 

Termagants go in Reserves, and the Comms Relay tries to keep them there. Redoubt gets placed at a sharp angle, or even completely perpendicular to the centerline, as far forward as possible. Hive Guard all Deploy within 8" of the nearest Access Point, with the Prime Joined to the 'Thrope nearby. First Turn, the Hive Guard Embark in the Redoubt, one Brood inside, one on the roof, while the Prime, Venomthrope, and Biovore try to stay hidden behind it. Fexen and Gargoyles just rush forward as fast as possible. Turn 2, the Hive Guard Disembark from the other end of the Redoubt, now possibly as much as 24" from their starting point without having had to Run. Prime and 'Thrope hop inside to spread their auras, and everything else keeps rushing.

 

I'm going to try to take advantage of the Hive Guard's reasonably impressive combat stats (2 S5 WS4 Attacks each, before the bonuses for Adrenals and Poison) to use them as a fairly rounded, "tactical" Unit, kind of like how I wish Tyranid Warriors could work.

 

It's a total gimmick, abusing the Building Rules about as far as I can see possible. If my opponent drops the Redoubt quickly, or Infiltrates up while going first and moves into it before I can, the whole thing pretty much falls apart, but if it doesn't, I think I can put some pressure on pretty quickly.

 

Also potentially hilarious to funnel the Gaunts through the Redoubt in The Relic, because that will let me get them all spread out past the one who actually grabs it, and they'll all have 3+ Cover, so I've got decent odds of having that one left to jump pack in the building with it on Turn 3.

[Guest Mr. Bigglesworth]

2 uber fragile troops not seeing this work :-(

 

Hive guard just not impressed but great since they can fire from behind redoubt with almost impunity.

 

Seems like you have a core for 1850 list.

 

Do you like new gargoyles?

[WestRider]

I've relied on IG Command Squads to be my Objective Holders. Just need to be aggressive enough with the rest of it to keep them busy. That said, the first thing I'd add to scale this up would probably be 10 more Gaunts and a Tärv.

 

Nah, the Hive Guard head out from the Redoubt to Charge. They should be just behind the Gargoyles on the way into the fray. I got them tangled up in some Combats last week and was really impressed, even without the upgrades. Also, I find they got more of a side-grade than a straight-up nerf, because a lot of times they're firing at stuff in Area Terrain or touching Cover, where it would have gotten a Save before. Pretty much makes the BS drop a wash.

 

I am still a fan of Gargoyles. They definitely got nerfed, but they're still fast as heck, and between the Adrenal Glands and even 6+ Poison, it's incredibly rare that there won't be something up there that they're a threat to. They're also awesome to spread out and go for a big Multi-Charge. I managed to force Blind Tests on 5 Units at once in that same game :)

[Guest Mr. Bigglesworth]

I see potential with gargoyles I see them as more just repurposed. I plan to use them. In regards to hive guard I don't see their value in combat, it would seem warrior squads would be better choice sense tri-purpose as troops/synapse/melee. you have used hive guard already I have not...

 

Tyrant guard are amazing in combat but need a tyrant to unlock.

 

I like warriors and plan to use them, I just wish they survived longer like they did in 4th. 90 points for a min troop squad not bad. Against tau decent choice since a lot of str 7 and 6. No cover save but decent mount of wounds. Iontide will of course have trouble with them. Warriors not a competeive choice but a ok choice for friendly games.

[Guest Mr. Bigglesworth]

Damn double post, sorry. Might as well use it.

 

The crown seems better and better the more I read, 40 points does seem hefty but you are adding 12" more control, 36"+ diameter is a lot of board control. My initial though was a tervigon, but a prime or tyrant does seem like a better candidate as you want it located more center to utilize the 18" radius.

 

Miasma cannon should be 5 points more and large blast instead of small. Or 5 points cheaper same. I don't see it being 15 points better than barbed.

 

I am thinking ymgarl factor on walking tyrant, charge forward first turn armor save +1 turn 2 charge, that +1 save would make a world of difference to get in range. The extra stregnth on charge turn 2 hopefully to prevent winning then next trun armor save as most things won't last 2 turns.

[galahad911]

Damn double post, sorry. Might as well use it.

 

The crown seems better and better the more I read, 40 points does seem hefty but you are adding 12" more control, 36"+ diameter is a lot of board control. My initial though was a tervigon, but a prime or tyrant does seem like a better candidate as you want it located more center to utilize the 18" radius.

 

Miasma cannon should be 5 points more and large blast instead of small. Or 5 points cheaper same. I don't see it being 15 points better than barbed.

 

I am thinking ymgarl factor on walking tyrant, charge forward first turn armor save +1 turn 2 charge, that +1 save would make a world of difference to get in range. The extra stregnth on charge turn 2 hopefully to prevent winning then next trun armor save as most things won't last 2 turns.

 

Unfortunately, the factor is only on the assault phase. :/

 

At the start of every Assault phase, a model with the Ymgarl Factor must alter their form

into one of the three listed below. The bonus gained lasts until the end of the phase. The

same form cannot be chosen in two consecutive turns.

 

Until the end of the phase being the issue. Doesn't mean anything when you're getting shot at.

[AbusePuppy]

Gargoyles are really good because they are fast and can force a TON of Blind checks onto the enemy, letting subsequent assaulters hit the enemy on 3s. They don't solve the issues with scoring, though, and compete with the FMCs for space.

[Guest Mr. Bigglesworth]

Darn I read that before, I don't why I forgot that. Man for points should last. If it lasted it would still be too many points but I would be willing to try.

[AscentStudios]

OK. This is the first, actually useful, insightful, balanced article I've read on Instinctive Behavior (WARNING: length rivals War & Peace):

 

http://www.3plusplus.net/2014/01/understanding-instinctive-behaviour-synergistic-relationships-within-the-tyranid-army/

[InfestedKerrigan]

Nickles work awesome.  They're perfect size, will stay using your modeling glue and are perfect weight.  Although, you're looking at $9.00 in nickles with 180 gaunts.  As if the models weren't expensive enough as it is.  

 

The problem I have with the Crones is aesthetically, the gun in it's mouth.  I don't like guns on bugs.  I'm more of a Starship Troopers/Star Craft type guy.  Raveners at least have it in their chest plate, and that I can deal with.  I could see using Ravenors with wings as Shrikes with shooty weapons.   

[Brother Glacius]

Just started to read that article, and already the author is making a huge assumption about timing with no support whatsoever. He claims that you come in from reserves before testing for synapse. It could just as easily be argued that you check at the start of your turn, just like it says to, and then when reserves come in, they don't have to check, just as it says. But instead, he makes a huge leap and claims that this:

 

“At the beginning of each of your turns, all Codex: Tyranids units with this special rule that are outside of the synapse range of any friendly Synapse Creatures (see below) must take a Leadership test unless they are: engaged in combat, falling back, have gone to ground or arrived from reserve this turn.”

 

changes the timing of the check until after reserves have arrived. Sorry, but no. And that happens at the start of the article. Right there his credibility is shot and the rest of the article is ignored.

[fluger]

Bro G, IMO, his reasoning is sound.  

 

However, his list is illegal, since, as we discussed earlier, a Tervigon cannot be a warlord.  

[AbusePuppy]

Since arriving from reserves and testing Synapse both happen at the same time (start of the turn- along with casting Blessings/Maledictions and several other things) the active player gets to choose what order they occur in. That's straight out of the BRB.

 

Taak makes a number of other rules mistakes through the article, but that much at least is accurate.

[Brother Glacius]

No, his reasoning is not sound. That rule clearly states when synapse has to be checked. It then lists units that are exempt. He's taking that and trying to adjust the timing. That isn't sound at all.

 

When does it occur: At the start of the turn

Who does it affect:  any that are outside of synapse range unless...coming in from reserve.

 

You can't take that "coming in from reserve" and decide that it now changes the timing of synapse check.

[fluger]

Bro G, he already references the part of the FAQ that states if two things are both supposed to happen at the same time, the player gets to choose the order.  

 

I'm not going to say his argument is air-tight, but I can see where he's coming from.  

[WestRider]

Part of the problem is that he takes the statement that IB doesn't apply on the Turn that a Unit arrives from Reserves, and then decides that this must be because of timing reasons, rather than realizing that it's simply because the Rule says it doesn't regardless of what order things are resolved in.

 

@Mr. Bigglesworth: The extra cost for the Miasma Cannon is because of the duality with the Template Mode, for when you get up close or need Overwatch. It's actually one of the Bio-Artefacts that I think is reasonably costed.