The New Dwarf Book

[Munkie]

Not as assuredly, no. MRoBalance only works on a 4+ now but has the sane cost and same effect. Not worth it, IMO. They still have RoSpellbreaking and it's not a master rune so you can have several in an army. If you take 2x RoSpellbreaking it acts like the Spelleater Rune of olde. Runesmiths no longer add dispel dice just for showing up. Then there's the MRoValaya which gives a further +2 to dispel attempts and dispels RiP spells on a 3+ at the start of the magic phase.

So they've got some options, but no longer will they be able to sit on a magic phase until the wizards say "uncle."

[MexicanNinja]

Most buffs and/or debuffs are hexes and augments.  If the rune only dispells RIP spells then it's piss against the augments and hexes that rule the magic phase.

[Munkie]

Yeah, but you'd use +4 to dispel or Runes of Spellbreaking in those situations. Cancelling Fiery Convocation before you take another clutch of str 4 hits is cool.

 

They still have the strength modification vs. armor save.

 

Unfortunately not. It's worded all weird and has parentheticals in the middle of the rule and whatnot, but if you read it again, you'll see it. They always wound on a 4+, but their str doesn't change. It then goes on to say use their strength (and modifiers like Resolute and GWs) to modify the armor saves. As the 4+ to wound isn't actually modifying the strength, it's not relevant to the last bit.

 

I do like your use for slayers though, that's how I used them in the last book. Little road blocks. It might be worth upgrading one to a giant slayer to challenge big nasty characters--if'n you've got the points. It stops them right in their tracks.

[Iraf]

I think large 40+ units of slayers will be relevant now too. Basically the enemy will take a str 5 attack for every wound they do to the slayers, and the slayers will still have their full compliment of attacks.

 

I too like the 5 man route though.

[MexicanNinja]

I don't think the 5 man route is sufficient.  Too many fast cav and skirmisher units have ranged attacks to just make them useless.  I will assume that the attack they receive from dying is only in close combat, correct?  They will be easy points for your opponent, if so.

[Brick Bungalow]

I really hope to tune a list that includes a full block of slayers. The models add so much character the army. 

 

Irondrakes seem neat but I'm concerned about the short range. I guess you use them to defend an obstacle or garrison them in a building? What's the effective strategy to maximize their chances of getting shots off?

[Darthweasel]

Looks like the book, for the way I like to play armies, has the same problem the last one did*;

1) they are minimum 25% slower than the next slowest army and in many cases 40% or, against cavalry, even more, meaning the opponent determines point of contact and who is involved in the festivities the slayers are worse than useless, they are free points for the opponent as anything slow enough to get caught by them can shoot them down before they get to it
2) 1 attack per model = fail unless you can choose the combats

3) Slayers, with their max 6" move when not charging, are going to get shot down or flat out avoided by anything they could threaten.

 

Slow army, pedestrian number of close combat attacks, I will go flip through a book and hope it changes my mind, but the slayer thing alone is so disappointing I went from planning to pick up a book yesterday and play them next Saturday against one of my brother's Dark Elves to thinking the Dwarves are staying on the shelf unless/until another book is shelved.

 

An army that maneuvers slowly, is too expensive per model to be able to take units large enough to control space, and cannot put out enough attacks in a short enough time to swing a combat just isn't all that exciting. I really hope people use the book better than i would and prove me wrong because it has been a long wait for this one.

 

 

 

* All comments should be construed as including the idea "for my play style", other play styles will get varying mileage. I tend to like compact, maneuverable armies that can withstand and deal out a decent amount of punishment. I also play Orcs and Beastmen but have been trying to put together a High Elf list for about 6 months now and have yet to find one that fits my style. No need adding another one to the list at the exorbitant price the books are now...please, convince me I am wrong, I am trying to find a reason to buy the book and have not been able to talk myself into it yet.

[HeroZero]

So we are of the conclusion that:

 

Dwarves castle up, shoot things on approach, then try to hold the line and grind them down?

 

Dwarves can still ruin a magic phase hard.

 

Dwarves still are reaction based army that uses gyro copters and artillery to choose combats.

 

So all in all. Exactly as GW sees dwarves playstyle

 

* and no dwarves are not the slowest. TK win that trophy.. never marching outside of the magic phase is dumb.

[dkieft]

Derk,

 

The Immune to Psch ability is cast on all friendly units within 24 inches. The extra armor is a single unit within 24". The directed damage attack is one unit within 24 inches.

Got my book. Hey Raindog, looks like the armor rune is actually usable across the entire battle field. That opens up some nice options got protecting a far flung unit.

 

Also, it does appear to be mobile as it does not state that it is stationary. While it is terribly slow, moving up a bit should give those 24" spells a nice reach as needed. Also, taking two would be pretty brutal, but that is really expensive and maybe not worth it.

[dkieft]

Okay, I take it back. I found a roll for slayers. In units of five, they are perfect darts. You have to kill them all to get by them, and their death low ability lets them punish anything trying to blow by them. I can see 2-3 drops at 60 points each. They can easily die from a charge of fast cav, but with GW attacks, they can 3-4 of enemy with them.

It looks to me that each slayer gets to choose GW or two weapons... so your first rank gets to have 2 attacks while the second rank gets GW strength bonues.

 

They still have the strength modification vs. armor save.

No they don't. It specifically states that they use there actual stat (with modifiers) to determine armor penetration... no bonus for "upping" Strength to the 4+ level like you used to get.

[dkieft]

Something else I noticed that I did not see mentioned... Unless I missed it there is no longer a penalty to Flee and pursue! This is huge!  That penalty basically meant that dwarfs were on the losing end of any flee/pursue action... which left more enemy's rallying and returning to battle (or at least no VP) and more dwarfs that had a bad round being completely wiped out (handing out VP like candy).

 

Along with the new bonus's (Sheildwall, Runesmith bonus's, etc) this will actually make a pretty big difference over the course of a battle...

 

I hope to give them a spin tomorrow, I'll report back after.

[ratrek]

I'm seeing something different. What I'm seeing is an army that can push a lot more then they use to.

 

+1S on the charge is saucy and rewards going for the charge instead of sitting back. Then the bonus to parry if you get charged is a nice bonus if you go for the charge and miss.

You can spam out Gyro's and get half of them Vanguarding to be really annoying.

Rangers are rare, so you can nab two Scouting dwarf units.

Miners are still cheap if you want Ambushers.

If you want to stick it on the BSB you can jam 4 Strollaz runes in an army. That's potentially 4 Dwarf combat blocks getting a 12" move to start the game. That's hawt. Yeah, you can't charge with the Anvil anymore but no one expected that to stay since all magical charges are being removed as the book gets done.

 

Magic shut down isn't nearly the same even if you load up with Vallawhatever. Yeah you can still eat spells with the rune but you can't use the rune of luck anymore with it so it's a straight 50/50 to eat it. Little risker. And the Master rune of Balance is a 4+ roll now instead of a autosteal. So there's certainly more risk then there was with the last book.

[dkieft]

Another thing with magic is the runesmiths having magic resist. This isn't huge, but it can save one is 6 dwarfs from magic missles and most direct damage spells. As a 60 point character giving that plus armor piercing... they are pretty much a must have in any large unit.

[Munkie]

I really hope to tune a list that includes a full block of slayers. The models add so much character the army. 

 

Irondrakes seem neat but I'm concerned about the short range. I guess you use them to defend an obstacle or garrison them in a building? What's the effective strategy to maximize their chances of getting shots off?

I like that slayers can take master rune of flight on their axes now. Spendy, but that and 2 runes of might makes a pretty fun missile for whacking big beasties.

 

I actually really like irondrakes. I didn't notice at first look, but their guns are not move-or-shoot. So their effective range is 21", which isn't bad at all. I think they'll work nicely as a mobile flank protector. Not only do they have the guns to threaten just about everything, but they've also got the stats and armor to be able to outfight most flanking units. And with Quick-to-fire and the dwarf crafted special rule, nobody wants to charge them from any distance.

[Munkie]

Edit. Friggin double posts

[Brother Glacius]

The irondrakes are an excellent unit. Very tough, very lethal, you just can't ignore them. Stick in a runesmith to give them MR. Their low BS though will prevent them from doing too much, but the potential is there.

[dkieft]

So I just realized that the Runesmiths armor piercing boon goes to the models in the unit... this means that it effects missile weapons along with melee. Handguns, pistols and drake guns already have it so there is no gain there, but armor piercing would work on Crossbows. Might be fairly useful in some builds as an option.

[Munkie]

Oh nice! I think I'd lean toward qarrellers anyway. I like the extra range over armor piercing.

[dkieft]

Oh nice! I think I'd lean toward qarrellers anyway. I like the extra range over armor piercing.

I tend to do a unit of each. The Quarrelers are great against low armor (5+ish) targets and the extra range is spectacular, while the thunderers are better against the higher armor. With the smith though the quarrelers can do that job... if you spend the excess points...

[Gunnerson]

I like the book so far and made up a list or two. The only really disappointing part to me was the Anvil.

 

Observations

Anvil changes troop type to War Machine. Unless I am mistaken War Machines auto loose characteristic tests. Thus any poop characteristic test auto kills this 290 point no wargear unit. If you put any runes on the Runelord this 1 character is double to triple the points of any war machine out there aside from a stank.

 

I would be willing to try out the Anvil because I feel overall it has been slightly improved and a tad more balanced and better to play against but its just too many points to auto die to from a spell...

[Brick Bungalow]

Oh, do dwarf warmachine crews retain unbreakable? That saved my bacon quite a few times. 

[Iraf]

I like the book so far and made up a list or two. The only really disappointing part to me was the Anvil.

 

 

Observations

Anvil changes troop type to War Machine. Unless I am mistaken War Machines auto loose characteristic tests. Thus any poop characteristic test auto kills this 290 point no wargear unit. If you put any runes on the Runelord this 1 character is double to triple the points of any war machine out there aside from a stank.

 

I would be willing to try out the Anvil because I feel overall it has been slightly improved and a tad more balanced and better to play against but its just too many points to auto die to from a spell...

the Anvil was a warmachine in last book too, except for the special character Thorek.

[Iraf]

Oh, do dwarf warmachine crews retain unbreakable? That saved my bacon quite a few times.

they are Stubborn, so close to Unbreakable.