New FW cuz money

[InfestedKerrigan]

 

 

 

Magaera type Knights are most often used as shock assault units, breaching the most heavily defended enemy positions, while shrugging off heavy weapons fire and self-repairing even devastating weapon strikes in a few minutes. To aid in this role it is armed with a complex lightning cannon, using focussed electro-magnetic beams to vaporise infantry and blast apart armour.

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/M/Magaera.pdf

 

395 pts Questoris Knight Magaera 4 4 10 13 12 12 2 3 6

 

Blessed Autosimulacra

If a vehicle has suffered Hull Point damage at the end of the controlling player’s turn, roll a D6. On a 6, one lost Hull Point is restored.

 

Lightning cannon 48" 7 3 Heavy 1, Rending, Large Blast (5"), Shred

Phased plasma-fusil 24" 6 3 Salvo 2/3 

Reaper chainsword - D 2 Melee

Rad cleanser Template 2 5 Assault 1, Fleshbane, Rad-phage

Hekaton siege claw - D 2 Melee, Wrecker

 

Rad-phage: A model which loses one or more wounds to an 

attack with this special rule and survives has its Toughness 

value reduced by -1 for the rest of the battle.

[VonVilkee]

Yay lots of knight variants

[pretre]

And that one is convertable!

[AbusePuppy]

So striking slower than a normal Knight (I2), but otherwise just as good in CC; significantly better guns (AP3 large blast, AP3 secondary), and its Ion Shield makes it functionally immune to shots from the chosen direction thanks to the -1/-2 Str. All for 20pts over the cost of a normal Knight, and you've got a small chance of recovering an HP each turn. Pretty dang good, I'd say; the only real disadvantage is that it can't be part of an Adamantine Lance formation.

[VonVilkee]

Still experimental on the siege one tho so I expect changes

[scottshoemaker]

What I like is that it's on a standard chassis! Conversion time!

[pretre]

What I like is that it's on a standard chassis! Conversion time!

Exactly what I said! I don't like the lancers because it is unlikely I can kitbash one. This one though? Hells yeah!

[Frowbakk]

Better against infantry and close combat vs buildings, but lower S shooting....  I think I'll wait for the version with Plasma or Volkite Cannon.

[Burk]

that is sexy...never wanted a knight before...but now....hmmmm

[galahad911]

lol wait, so criminally undercosted knights aren't good enough, so let's give them a better shield and multiple shooting weapons for 20 more points!

 

Are Oh Eff Ell

 

GG Forgeworld!!

[VonVilkee]

Actually I've been wondering if we are playing knights right or not, the whole 45 degree firing thing could prevent charges and stuff... Starting new thread.

 

Edit: browser crashed ate my topic, be a few while I reorganize my thoughts...

[AbusePuppy]

Keep in mind that the 45 degrees only applies to fixed weapons. As a Knight's arm-mounted weapon typically has a much greater degree of rotation, their "vision" will tend to be a lot larger.

 

 

lol wait, so criminally undercosted knights aren't good enough, so let's give them a better shield and multiple shooting weapons for 20 more points!

 

The newest of the two does give up I4, which is rather important, and its main gun is noticeably worse than either of the "basic" Knights (two less strength, two worse AP, and no Melta rule or one less strength, one less shot, and no Ordnance rule.) Its secondary gun is obviously better, but not by nearly enough to make up, and the add-on weapon is very short-ranged  and basically just a Heavy Flamer most of the time (for 25pts.) Purely in a vacuum the two new Knights are probably better than the standard ones, but their inability to be taken in numbers or as part of an Adamantine Lance formation significantly limits how much use they'll see.

[galahad911]

Keep in mind that the 45 degrees only applies to fixed weapons. As a Knight's arm-mounted weapon typically has a much greater degree of rotation, their "vision" will tend to be a lot larger.

 

 

 

The newest of the two does give up I4, which is rather important, and its main gun is noticeably worse than either of the "basic" Knights (two less strength, two worse AP, and no Melta rule or one less strength, one less shot, and no Ordnance rule.) Its secondary gun is obviously better, but not by nearly enough to make up, and the add-on weapon is very short-ranged  and basically just a Heavy Flamer most of the time (for 25pts.) Purely in a vacuum the two new Knights are probably better than the standard ones, but their inability to be taken in numbers or as part of an Adamantine Lance formation significantly limits how much use they'll see.

 

 

7 strength with rending and shred isn't good enough? The secondary gun is actually meaningfull, where the stubber really isn't. 24" range with a 12" move on a model that wants to be aggressive isn't short ranged, much less very short. A lower strength twin linked flamer that if you take a wound your unit get -1 toughness. Yeah, just a heavy flamer. smh

 

And you completely ignored that the damn thing is considerably harder to hurt with shooting. Yeah, because that clearly doesn't matter. /sigh

 

So, again, clearly better than it's point cost to begin with. A roughly equal main gun, a vastly better secondary gun, a rad flamer, and better AV against shooting for 20 more than already too low? Sure, why not?

[AbusePuppy]

7 strength with rending and shred isn't good enough? The secondary gun is actually meaningfull, where the stubber really isn't. 24" range with a 12" move on a model that wants to be aggressive isn't short ranged, much less very short. A lower strength twin linked flamer that if you take a wound your unit get -1 toughness. Yeah, just a heavy flamer. smh

 

And you completely ignored that the damn thing is considerably harder to hurt with shooting. Yeah, because that clearly doesn't matter. /sigh

 

So, again, clearly better than it's point cost to begin with. A roughly equal main gun, a vastly better secondary gun, a rad flamer, and better AV against shooting for 20 more than already too low? Sure, why not?

 

The Lightning Cannon is significantly worse than both the standard main guns for all the reasons I mentioned; Rending and Shred are nice little touches, but they don't even come close to making up for firing half as many shots or rolling half as many dice for penetration. It's hardly a bad gun, but it's certainly worse than the guns on the other two and on a 400pt unit a single large blast that doesn't even cut through Terminator armor is not all that impressive.

 

The Plasma Fusil is better than the Stubber, but not by an amazing amount. Stubbers are 36" and thus actually have better reach, even if they are significantly worse at killing things- but killing targets is not really the job of the secondary gun; it's almost always getting used to give you an additional charge target, and in that respect killing things with it can actually be detrimental. How stupid will you feel when you shoot and kill three models and put yourself out of assault range?

 

The Rad Cleanser has Fleshbane, which is nice (wounding on 2s rather than 3s like a HF would), and every once in a while you'll hit a multiwound model and they'll fail their armor save against it and they'll be -1 Toughness. It'll be cool when it happens, but it will very rarely happen and you have to pay extra for the Cleanser so I don't consider it a big deal.

 

The -1/-2 Str on shots against the Ion Shield is good, definitely. It makes "batter down the door" a nigh-impossible strategy against the Knight, although to be honest that's not really the best way to kill them anyways (as you want to be bypassing the shield whenever possible.) But comparing them to the Adamantine Lance, who get to reroll their Shield saves, I'd call it significantly worse; -1Str on a meltagun or Haywire or Destroyer hit isn't going to do anything, but rerolling your invuln sure will.

 

I already said that it was better than a normal Knight in my first post; I'm not disagreeing on that front. FW is just as bad as ever at choosing point values for their units. However, the inability to be part of the formation is a pretty big deal, and that's why I don't think you're going to see a ton of them on the field- you can't field either of them as a solo Knight and if you're bringing multiple Knights you really want ot get the bonus of the Lance.

[VonVilkee]

Keep in mind that the 45 degrees only applies to fixed weapons. As a Knight's arm-mounted weapon typically has a much greater degree of rotation, their "vision" will tend to be a lot larger.

 

 

 

 

The newest of the two does give up I4, which is rather important, and its main gun is noticeably worse than either of the "basic" Knights (two less strength, two worse AP, and no Melta rule or one less strength, one less shot, and no Ordnance rule.) Its secondary gun is obviously better, but not by nearly enough to make up, and the add-on weapon is very short-ranged  and basically just a Heavy Flamer most of the time (for 25pts.) Purely in a vacuum the two new Knights are probably better than the standard ones, but their inability to be taken in numbers or as part of an Adamantine Lance formation significantly limits how much use they'll see.

Yeah, but the Melta version doesn't have a stubber on the gun, you only get a 45 degree left or right.

 

The other stubber is hull mounted and a decent way up. I'm just wondering if those things could be used to out play the Knight and if people are even realizing that some infantry could almost force it to back up to charge them. As the main gun wants to point at something more valuable target wise most of the time.

[InfestedKerrigan]

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/CERASTUS_KNIGHT_ACHERON.html

 

Cerastus Knight-Acheron 415 pts

ws4 bs4 s10 F13 S12 R12 I4 A4 HP6

Wargear

• Acheron pattern flame cannon - Hellstorm 7 3 Ordnance 1

• Reaper chainfist with an inbuilt twin-linked heavy bolter - D 2 Melee, Machine Destroyer (reroll 1s on Destroyer table)

• Ion shield - 4+ Directional

Flank Speed - Run 3d6 instead of shooting

 

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Downloads/Product/PDF/A/Acheron.pdf

[fluger]

Whoa.  

[WestRider]

I am really liking all of the Cerastus Knights so far. Now I just need to win the lottery :P

[BrainFireBob]

You notice that you can field all- and I mean, all- of the FW Knights in their own Knight army. I think the language "May not include more of Knight <BLANK> than other kinds of Knight in your army" does not mean what they think it means. Two Acherons, one Lancer, and one Castigator is a legal force.

[AbusePuppy]

That template is brutal and will easily clear out then only thing Knights don't kill super-efficiently (masses of MEQ infantry.) For 40pts over the usual, that's a really strong addition.

[InfestedKerrigan]

You notice that you can field all- and I mean, all- of the FW Knights in their own Knight army. I think the language "May not include more of Knight <BLANK> than other kinds of Knight in your army" does not mean what they think it means. Two Acherons, one Lancer, and one Castigator is a legal force.

 

You almost have it.  In order to field that second Acheron, you'd have to have a second Lance AND second Castigator to make it legal, as far as a single detachment goes.  

[InfestedKerrigan]

People have been saying for years they want affordable titans.  GW/FW has responded ad nauseam.  :D

[AbusePuppy]

Is $150-200 per really "affordable" when you need at least three of them? I mean, the Dreamforge Leviathan is $50 less and arguably a better kit (and certainly quite a bit larger.)

[BrainFireBob]

You almost have it.  In order to field that second Acheron, you'd have to have a second Lance AND second Castigator to make it legal, as far as a single detachment goes.  

That's actually debatably vague.

 

"Cannot have more BLANK than Knights of other types"

 

Ok, I have 2 Acherons and 2 Knights of other types , which is my point. By their statement, totally legit to have 2 Acherons, 1 Lancer, and 1 Castigator.

 

EDIT:

 

See, I think their assumption is that you are using the GW Knight. If you don't, then yeah, my example should work.

[InfestedKerrigan]