Haemonculus Covens

[pretre]

Furthermore, duplicates of the same formation are still the same formation.

 

Imagine you replace 'this formation' with the name of the formation. That should help.

[fluger]

It *does* say detachment.  So, at most, one could put two different units with freakish spectacle (one from Corpsetheif and one from the regular Covenite Coterie) within range to get a -2.  

 

FINE

[Guest]

I still think leadership penalties aren't as impressive in this edition. Terrify got nerfed and psychics not longer need leadership to pass (or fail) psychic tests. Most of the weapons that wound against leadership are gone. A good chunk of the DE leadership affecting weapons don't even even work against ATSKNF....the list goes on.

 

Most of the time, -1 leadership is the same as +1 to your assault results.

[Lord Hanaur]

It *does* say detachment.  So, at most, one could put two different units with freakish spectacle (one from Corpsetheif and one from the regular Covenite Coterie) within range to get a -2.  

 

FINE

Correct and the force has three Detachments.

[Lord Hanaur]

I still think leadership penalties aren't as impressive in this edition. Terrify got nerfed and psychics not longer need leadership to pass (or fail) psychic tests. Most of the weapons that wound against leadership are gone. A good chunk of the DE leadership affecting weapons don't even even work against ATSKNF....the list goes on.

 

Most of the time, -1 leadership is the same as +1 to your assault results.

well...  what about pinning weapons?  not so much Dark Eldar since they took pinning away from Mandrakes (for no reason, dang it) and gave them soulfire or whatever it is.  But LD penalites can play real big on pinning.  Perhaps theres a way to synergize...

[WestRider]

They also took Pinning away from just about everything else that had it. I do like the idea of a DeathLeaper Assassin Brood alongside a Living Artillery Node or something, tho.

[Guest]

well...  what about pinning weapons?  not so much Dark Eldar since they took pinning away from Mandrakes (for no reason, dang it) and gave them soulfire or whatever it is.  But LD penalites can play real big on pinning.  Perhaps theres a way to synergize...

Pinning weapons are nerfed in a few ways.

 

Not only does pinning now grant bonus cover saves (a few editions, I know), but it also can be remove prematurely. Check out that Zealot rule. If a pinned unit (gone to ground) gains zealot and they immediately lose the pinned status.

 

So, marines/scouts get shot a bunch by your sniper weapons, go to ground in ruins, get an awesome save against your pinning sniper weapons, and then they get to fire at full BS when a chappy joins the unit. They can even charge.

 

The BT even have a character that grants Zealot in a 6" bubble.

[Lord Hanaur]

Well its something to look into.  Pinning was one of my favorite rules.  Any soldier whose been in live combat knows what thats all about.  A ton of my friends from the Gulf have talked about getting pinned down and having to wait for help to get out.  nerve racking.

 

Anyways not to get too deep on that but Pinning taken away from snipers was a real surprise.

[AbusePuppy]

Yeah, Pinning being removed from its two signature weapon types (Snipers and Barrage) is pretty bizarre. Pinning is actually a very powerful effect when it works, since it pretty much "kills" the unit for a turn, but with so many units in the game having universally high Leadership and/or immunity to Pinning, it ends up being less valuable than it could be.

[Lord Hanaur]

Sure unless you have Freakish Spectacle!  Or Markerlights that augment it (oh dang, gone also) or you have Horrify and Terrify at your disposal.  Or if you're an AP 3 Sniper (took that away too?  Lame.)  And the list goes on.

 

Pinning was suuuuuper viable.  Tau still have some access to it and its a few other spotty places.  But the Barrage one in particular...  I mean think about it.  Wouldnt you get the hell down if those shells started falling from a 155mm gun?  Ho man.  I'd be investing in Black and Decker stock right then, cause Im gonna need me some shovels

[Lord Hanaur]

Pinning weapons are nerfed in a few ways.

 

Not only does pinning now grant bonus cover saves (a few editions, I know), but it also can be remove prematurely. Check out that Zealot rule. If a pinned unit (gone to ground) gains zealot and they immediately lose the pinned status.

 

So, marines/scouts get shot a bunch by your sniper weapons, go to ground in ruins, get an awesome save against your pinning sniper weapons, and then they get to fire at full BS when a chappy joins the unit. They can even charge.

 

The BT even have a character that grants Zealot in a 6" bubble.

 

Hang on...  I dont have a book but...  Zealot doesn't make you fearless.  So you make all checks when youre a zealot (well most of them) but if the check has ALREADY happened then what good does a zealot bubble do?

 

Maybe I didn't read it right.  I'll look when I can get to a book.

[AbusePuppy]

One of the FAQs addressed the issue- if a unit that is Gone to Ground becomes Fearless, Zealot, or any of the other "can't be pinned" conditions (including having a bike/MC in the squad, etc) they immediately lose GtG status.

[generalripphook]

Could you use that to let your guys GtG then next turn move the bubble up and boom they exit GtG

[Guest]

Could you use that to let your guys GtG then next turn move the bubble up and boom they exit GtG

Yeah, it's a nifty one. That said, special character IC is 185pts base and is basically a PA chappy in stats. It's probably not a viable plan, but a decent way to supplement an existing plan.

 

The more practical use is a chappy which starts a turn in a transport, then moves and disembarks to join the unit that needs the GtG status removed. Base chappy is way cheaper and is for most SM armies.

[WestRider]

Could you use that to let your guys GtG then next turn move the bubble up and boom they exit GtG

Some Tyranid Players like to use this for Genestealers. Infiltrate and then move up close in Terrain, GtG when shot at, then bring up a Synapse Creature so they can still get the Turn 2 Charge. Too many things that can go wrong with it for my taste, but rules-wise, it's legit.

[Guest]

Some Tyranid Players like to use this for Genestealers. Infiltrate and then move up close in Terrain, GtG when shot at, then bring up a Synapse Creature so they can still get the Turn 2 Charge. Too many things that can go wrong with it for my taste, but rules-wise, it's legit.

 

Aren't stealers still 5+ armor? Flamer bait...

 

I suppose if opponent lacks flamers, and infiltrate does grant a wide deployment after knowning where the enemy is...still.

 

I agree with your reasoning.

[WestRider]

Yeah, that's why I say there are too many things that can go wrong with it.

[Lord Hanaur]

Ha!  An intricate overly complicated plan?

 

Tea please!

[Lord Hanaur]

Also, side note:  I ate a Wave Spam army with the Coven.  Sneaky guy castled up (he went first), but then used Eldrad to move three of his units and split em up.  Pretty good plan.

 

Fortunately, I more or less just deployed the Wracks and hid them, so he spent his first turn mostly moving to get at them.  Shot some up, I meaneuveres a little and he shot them again.

 

Round two I got most of my reserves on, Talos killed a hull with Haywire from behind, not that it mattered which side it was I spose.  Grotesques jetted up the center.  Wracks hopped into their Raiders and jetted up.  

 

Round 3, the Waves and his heavy tanks had nowhere to really run to that mattered so they tried to end the Raiders with Grotesques in it and did but I was fortunate and Jink bounced the non-Shield shots which did absorb enough of his fire, so he couldnt really hurt the dudes inside.  Still it was enough to knock out the Raiders.  the few surviving Wracks were free to act.  On my turn, since he moved away from the Talos, They shot another Wave serpent dead and then multicharged the guys who came out last turn and this turn.  The grotesues bounced towards opposite sides of the board and multiassaulted.  The Wracks just basically held serve and took up valuable real estate in case the Wave hulls decided to come there way and prepared flamage for their contents but it became unnecessary.

 

In turn 4 he conceded.  His WraithKnight did slam into my larger unit of Grotesques in turn 4 but by then it was about all there was of consequence and they were considered "Turn 6" on the chart (Eternal Warriors) so...  killing them probably wasnt going to happen anyways but he gave it the college try.  Flesh gauntlets tore the Wraith Knight apart and I didn't play my bottom of four.

 

The battle field looked as if we had played two separate battles at the end because the disparate parts of his force (which he split up to kill the wracks and hopefully end me turn one) were kinda far apart to start.  He, I am sure, was assuming his range would allow concentration of high str fire power anyways and that was true.

 

The key to victory was the Wracks.  Those small units were relatively easy to hide on this board and so even though they did not do a ton in terms of damage, their STRATEGIC value was high in essentially wasting the enemies advantage turn one.

 

Just another report from the front.  The Claw shooting was cool.  Definitely like those TL Haywires.  Even though he can Jink me, it's far from a guaranteed.  I hit all five times the first time and hit four the next.  You're only asking lady luck for a little bit of help at that point. 

 

His heavier tanks (I think they were forge world?  I didn't recognize them.  Void Hunters?  I forget what he called them, to be honest) might have made things interesting for a while longer if he had continued on, but it was a route and we called it.

[Guest]

Warp Hunters, if falcon sized. Hull mounted cannon looking thing.

[Lord Hanaur]

Warp Hunters, if falcon sized. Hull mounted cannon looking thing.

Ah.  The same.  I just could not forthe life of me remember what they were called.

[Lord Hanaur]

Also, here's the battle report againsty the Armoured Fist:

Coven v Astra Militarum Armoured Fist

[Guest]

Also, here's the battle report againsty the Armoured Fist:

Coven v Astra Militarum Armoured Fist

Did you get to face the only astra player that has no anti-cover aside from orders? All those chimeras and just heavy bolters, it seemed. Amazing.

 

Anyway, does seem like that talos unit is a great punisher for armies without legit deathstar units. Just kept munching them away.

[Lord Hanaur]

Did you get to face the only astra player that has no anti-cover aside from orders? All those chimeras and just heavy bolters, it seemed. Amazing.

 

Anyway, does seem like that talos unit is a great punisher for armies without legit deathstar units. Just kept munching them away.

I faced the guy who said "Hey face me". 

 

As for what he had?  He had two command squads handing out orders as often as possible.  So he used every order that made sense at the time.  He did also have a few  Heavy flamers on the chassis, plus the dudes inside

[Guest]

I faced the guy who said "Hey face me". 

 

As for what he had?  He had two command squads handing out orders as often as possible.  So he used every order that made sense at the time.  He did also have a few  Heavy flamers on the chassis, plus the dudes inside

Didn't mean to belittle, just surprised. Every chimera I've put together has a hull heavy flamer. All the artillery have them too. They just threaten so much better. Not so useful on the ordnance russes, though.