InfestedKerrigan Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Thats the point though i want a wrightknight lol How bad is a Single Wraithknight when there are multiple Knights on the table? Like was said, just go light on the other things that are perceived as being OTT Aged Eldar Cheese. Give GW your money and use the models that make you happy. Hate every mother[big bad swear word]er that gets in your way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 How bad is a Single Wraithknight when there are multiple Knights on the table? Like was said, just go light on the other things that are perceived as being OTT Aged Eldar Cheese. Give GW your money and use the models that make you happy. Hate every mother[big bad swear word]er that gets in your way. Still think that if more eldar players bring the questionable weapons and units, the more likely the community will adapt to them. They'll be really brutal at first, so the attitude of the eldar players is more important than their lists. The advantage they have over the Manticore is that they are AP3 and I can get two in the slot instead of one. Obviously, I'm paying more for that, but it's nice. Manticore is obviously better at hitting vehicles by dint of better S, and, on average, it gets as many shots as my two basilisks at a cheaper price point. It's also easier to hide it. That said, the Basilisk is really good at a few things, namely, going after artillery which it wounds on 2s and gets rid of their armor save. This is nice for dealing with things like the thunderfire cannons. Additionally, the AP3 and high strength AND long range is nice for going after things like Broadsides or Wraithlords. It's not a TERRIBLE gun or platform, it's just overpriced for what it does. Were they 100 pts each, I think they'd be about perfect, but that extra 25 points really hurts them. Really, the thunderfire? That's the very unit I think of when I decide AGAINST the basilisk. S6 barrage against the side armor 10 with 4 blasts. Huh. Are you fielding a squadron or two units of 1? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted April 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 What doesn't table you, makes you stronger... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 What doesn't table you, makes you stronger... That is, exactly how I build lists and play armies.... May have to add for signature. EDIT: changed it for the member "title". Thank you very much. Love it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Really, the thunderfire? That's the very unit I think of when I decide AGAINST the basilisk. S6 barrage against the side armor 10 with 4 blasts. Huh. Are you fielding a squadron or two units of 1? Even just one hit from the basilisk should kill a thunderfire, if both are "hits" then I can almost guarantee it dies. Thunderfire has poor odds of killing a basilisk in one shot (FYI, I run two in one battery). Assuming all 4 hit, which isn't too difficult, they only have about a 22.2% chance of getting an explosion result and they should knock 2 HPs off the tank. Also, if the thunderfire is shooting at my tanks instead of my big blobs of guys, that's a win for me. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted April 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Why would that be difficult? Your post made it clear that it is not Codex: Eldar by referring it to Codex: Eldar Craftworlds. From Black Library: ABOUT THIS CODEX Codex: Craftworlds presents the ancient and mysterious Eldar of the craftworlds. Long ago the Eldar ruled the galaxy, but were undone by their immense hubris and fell into decline. Now they fight for survival, a handful of world-ships scattered across the stars. Inside you will learn about the long history of the Eldar, their heroes, gods and Paths. You will also find a stunning showcase featuring the impressive Eldar range of Citadel Miniatures, as well as a comprehensive army list allowing you to forge your craftworld Eldar collection into an unstoppable warhost in your games of Warhammer 40,000. Emphasis Mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugarlessllama Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 How bad is a Single Wraithknight when there are multiple Knights on the table? Like was said, just go light on the other things that are perceived as being OTT Aged Eldar Cheese. Give GW your money and use the models that make you happy. Hate every mother[big bad swear word]er that gets in your way. Well I guess it would depend on how they run those multiple Imperial Knights. If I knew I was going up against a Wraith War Host, I would consider bringing three Knights in the Adamantine Lance formation. One of the Knights would be auto-upgraded to Seneschal, which would give it a 3++ Shield, and WS 5. I would also mark one of the Knights and state that it is "Gerantus" which would give it a 3++ shield, WS 5, and It Will Not Die. The Formation would allow both of them to re-roll failed saves. That might be sturdy enough to give the Wraith War Host some trouble. But over all, I really think the the new Eldar codex is going to be very hard on vehicle based armies. It will be interesting to see how it deals with horde, and elite infantry armies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 @Pretre: you quoted the GW web site as if cannon.... Well I guess it would depend on how they run those multiple Imperial Knights. If I knew I was going up against a Wraith War Host, I would consider bringing three Knights in the Adamantine Lance formation. One of the Knights would be auto-upgraded to Seneschal, which would give it a 3++ Shield, and WS 5. I would also mark one of the Knights and state that it is "Gerantus" which would give it a 3++ shield, WS 5, and It Will Not Die. The Formation would allow both of them to re-roll failed saves. That might be sturdy enough to give the Wraith War Host some trouble. But over all, I really think the the new Eldar codex is going to be very hard on vehicle based armies. It will be interesting to see how it deals with horde, and elite infantry armies. I still think Imperial knights should be 0-1 in events which limit LoWs. If you don't limit LoWs, then I have no qualms with the imperial knight armies. If imperial knight armies start having trouble, there are loads of ways to buff them up. Typically knight lists are barely trying to make their super heavies broken. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted April 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 @Pretre: you quoted the GW web site as if cannon.... Canon. Also, I did no such thing as that statement isn't part of the in universe background. I did quote it as an example of what the name of the Codex was though. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Canon. Suppose the GW phone support is now an Official FAQ? EDIT: I am totally teasing here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Even just one hit from the basilisk should kill a thunderfire, if both are "hits" then I can almost guarantee it dies. Thunderfire has poor odds of killing a basilisk in one shot (FYI, I run two in one battery). Assuming all 4 hit, which isn't too difficult, they only have about a 22.2% chance of getting an explosion result and they should knock 2 HPs off the tank. Well, given that the Thunderfire is inevitably sitting inside cover that has been reinforced, it seems pretty unlikely that you will actually kill it in one volley. Even assuming you manage to land both pie plates so that they cover the two models in the squad, breaking through the 3+ cover save that it has is gonna be tough- you're only averaging slightly more than one wound. Meanwhile, the Thunderfire landing all four hits on a Basilisk has VERY good odds to get a Stunned/Shaken result, which essentially takes it out of action and your chances of having a save against its hits are essentially zero. Also, if the thunderfire is shooting at my tanks instead of my big blobs of guys, that's a win for me. Pretty sure the Space Marine player says the exact same thing about your Basilisk hitting his tough backfield artillery rather than his squads. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted April 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Suppose the GW phone support is now an Official FAQ? EDIT: I am totally teasing here. The reason Phone/E-mail support is not generally considered official is two-fold: 1) There's no proof of an interaction that can be shared. 2) The interaction will often be reversed the next time anyone contacts them. With published information on a website, these two problems generally don't exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fluger Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Well, given that the Thunderfire is inevitably sitting inside cover that has been reinforced, it seems pretty unlikely that you will actually kill it in one volley. Even assuming you manage to land both pie plates so that they cover the two models in the squad, breaking through the 3+ cover save that it has is gonna be tough- you're only averaging slightly more than one wound. Meanwhile, the Thunderfire landing all four hits on a Basilisk has VERY good odds to get a Stunned/Shaken result, which essentially takes it out of action and your chances of having a save against its hits are essentially zero. Pretty sure the Space Marine player says the exact same thing about your Basilisk hitting his tough backfield artillery rather than his squads. Sure, assuming the thing's in ruins, no prob. But, yeah, in 5+(4+ reinforced) cover makes 4 hits with the Basilisk have just under odds of killing the artillery piece. Yes, stunning/shaking the bassy is virtually as good as killing it. Most space marine players don't actually put a lot of squads on the table for me to shoot at. :( Can you talk to them about that? Moar tacticals please? Or stop spreading those bikers out so I can hit more than one per shot? Can you put out an article on Frontline or 3++ advocating that tactic so I can get more mileage with my basilisks? As I said, they aren't good, I acknowledge that, I'm just polishing a turd here. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sugarlessllama Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 @Pretre: you quoted the GW web site as if cannon.... I still think Imperial knights should be 0-1 in events which limit LoWs. If you don't limit LoWs, then I have no qualms with the imperial knight armies. If imperial knight armies start having trouble, there are loads of ways to buff them up. Typically knight lists are barely trying to make their super heavies broken. Well is the Imperial Knights are being used as a LoW, then sure I think a limit of one would be fine. However, the Imperial Knights are an army all of their own; so to prohibit an entire faction from events is a little heavy handed IMO. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Well I guess it would depend on how they run those multiple Imperial Knights. If I knew I was going up against a Wraith War Host, I would consider bringing three Knights in the Adamantine Lance formation. One of the Knights would be auto-upgraded to Seneschal, which would give it a 3++ Shield, and WS 5. I would also mark one of the Knights and state that it is "Gerantus" which would give it a 3++ shield, WS 5, and It Will Not Die. The Formation would allow both of them to re-roll failed saves. That might be sturdy enough to give the Wraith War Host some trouble. But over all, I really think the the new Eldar codex is going to be very hard on vehicle based armies. It will be interesting to see how it deals with horde, and elite infantry armies. Gerantius can not be part of the lance formation. He is unique and never referred to as a knight errant or paladin. He is equipped like an errant but is in fact a forgotten knight... I'd also question the auto upgrade as the formations are fixed this one is a bit iffy cuz of the codex faq changing the wording of the regular knights detachment. I'll give you the auto upgrade for now but it is tenuous at best. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AbusePuppy Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Taking a Knight as your warlord (even when part of an Adamantine Lance) automatically grants him Senechal status, and the bonuses that come with it. The FAQ is very clear on that point. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne_Cobbb Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Jet bikes go over terrain. Jesus Christ. Hey pax. imperial knight models are made of plastic. (Just want to see how he can find a away to disagree ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne_Cobbb Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 duplicate post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne_Cobbb Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 bangs head on wall and throws phone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pretre Posted April 27, 2015 Author Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 bangs head on wall and throws phone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne_Cobbb Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Between computers. Hate having to use my phone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jayne_Cobbb Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 phonewhy the crucifix does it keep double posting? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VonVilkee Posted April 27, 2015 Report Share Posted April 27, 2015 Taking a Knight as your warlord (even when part of an Adamantine Lance) automatically grants him Senechal status, and the bonuses that come with it. The FAQ is very clear on that point. Yeah the faq completely changed the way the imperiAl knight warlord happens. Like I said I'd give it without blinking but I'd watch out for Gw fixing it. I believe their intent was to allow the warlord if you took three knights from their selections (forge world and codex) not the formation the raw clearly allows it but I doubt it will last long. Typical GW oversight of the wording. Time is vague I know it has been this way for awhile but few actually play primary imperial knights and those that try get allot of flak... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AgentP Posted April 28, 2015 Report Share Posted April 28, 2015 *DELETED* 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romans832 Posted April 28, 2015 Report Share Posted April 28, 2015 A full day off and no Codex read... shame on me... oh well, 3 hours with my little nephew well worth it in this sun! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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