Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Get ready to compare all six of your weapon trait icons to each target's four armor icons, next add up all your half-hits & double hits, then discuss the after-armor saving rolls . . . but don't worry there's no toughness and we all get proofread-free slightly-playtested faction rules at once! And if you think I'm kidding about that new attack sequence - think again! Oh, and I forgot to mention for all you Spess Marhreen players out there the privilege & joy of replacing all your terminator models with primaris . . . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Personally, I'll be looking forward to the 8th & 9th archives on wahapedia/battlecribe. 😜 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottshoemaker Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Didn’t bother to watch the video. Im assuming they’ve adopted a less is more concept like one page rules. Good for them! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 15 minutes ago, scottshoemaker said: Didn’t bother to watch the video. Im assuming they’ve adopted a less is more concept like one page rules. Good for them! LOL, not exactly . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 I just want to play a game with my toy soldiers that doesn’t involve a rule book, a faction supplement, a campaign supplement, an errata document longer than the original rulebook, a deck of game cards, a deck of faction cards, fourteen different types of ”adjective points” that get spent during gameplay, and having to pay $60 for each of the above. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Yup, and the end of editions are much more balanced that the beginning of them. That's why I'll just be relying on the digital archives of 8th/9th. Lots of depth, well balanced, but totally static. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 What’s weird to me is how many people are freaking out at the idea of removing toughness from the game. I’ve thought that the three part sequence (roll to hit, roll to wound, roll to save) was unnecessary since at least 3rd… In the much more granular, pseudo-roleplaying style of RT/1st, the distinction between resisting damage due to armor or due to inherent durability was useful. But there were a couple dozen models on the table, total, back then. Now there are often over 100 per player. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Yeah, I actually like Toughness but I'm not upset about that going away. What is unappealing is the ridiculous number of weapon and armor trait interactions - combined with the new glancing/regular/penetrating/critical hit types. Again they had the opportunity to simplify but added more complexity than they removed. And don't even get me started on the unnecessarily complex casual vs competitive datasheet & upgrade classifications . . . -1 damage was already simulating the armor absorption. Classifying all weapons as either anti-infantry or anti-vehicle would have been sufficient to fix current issues. But you can't sell $200 of new books unless you overhaul everything and give the new models all the kewl rules. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 I’d already pretty much decided I was done with Warhammer 40,000; I’ll keep my models around, but I’ve got no desire to buy more for the game… BattleTech and Oathmark are probably going to be my only minis focus for the foreseeable future. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 12, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Looking forward to Oathmark too! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewgeddon Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 I mean, I guess I'm pretty excited about going back to an Indexhammer state. I kinda feel I keep giving 40K chances and GW keeps letting me down, lol. But I got my models, so I can always play some Indexhammer (8th or 10th apparently) or OPR, and between 9th Age and wanting to spend time with Underworlds / Warcry / Epic Armageddon / Warmaster I've got more than enough mini games to keep me busy. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 WH40k has never been my favorite GW game, even when I was a lot more actively into it and playing once or twice a week (and lately it’s been one or twice a year); WH40k was always just the game I collected armies for because it was the game everyone else was playing. I’ve got more than enough Adeptus Custodes to field a massive army and no real desire to add anything to the collection I currently have. (Maybe some of the big FW vehicles… But I don’t desire them strongly enough to pay FW prices!) I’ve got a cardboard box in my closet labeled “2020 Space Ork Project” that I started gathering things for in 2019 and never really started. Maybe I’ll revisit it someday. I’ve got a large Palanite Enforcers gang for Necromunda; GW no longer supports WHFB, Epic, or BFG; I find Frostgrave to be more fun than Mordheim (which is also unsupported) or WarCry; and the LotR game just never seemed to catch on (and I’d rather play Oathmark). I’m basically just… done… with GW. The author for Oathmark has said that he’s done with the game for the foreseeable future, although more supplements might come eventually. It’s wholly “miniatures agnostic” so if I ever feel the need to start a new project, I don’t have to worry about compatibility. BattleTech is getting a lot of attention from CGL these days, with new models and new books but the models are just redesigns of classic pieces and the “new” rule books are largely just revisions to the layout and formatting of the rules that have been, more or less, finalized since I was in elementary school. They also officially do not care if players use the miniatures they sell, third-party minis, 3D prints, or cardboard cutouts. The gameplay is also strategically and tactically deep, without being mindlessly complex for the sake of complexity. Necromunda remains interesting to me almost solely due to the effort @scottshoemaker puts into the campaigns he runs. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrewgeddon Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 23 minutes ago, Ish said: GW no longer supports WHFB, Epic, or BFG; I find that company support is largely overrated, but that's just my opinion. I love new models as much as the next person, but "GW support" seems to mean FOMO box sets and buying book after book these days. Totally happy to play community run versions of these games instead. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 12, 2023 Report Share Posted March 12, 2023 Oh, don’t get me wrong, I don’t want a constant fire-hose of new, newer, newest like GW pushes for WH40k and AOS… But I’d still like to see the some of books on the shelves at their stores, most of the models available for sale on their website (even as limited stock or back order only items), and the occasional mention in their house magazine and social media channels. Instead of GW’s longstanding practice of Trotsky’ing their old game’s completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Glacius Posted March 15, 2023 Report Share Posted March 15, 2023 I'm done chasing 40k editions. I have my models. I'm good. I'll play whatever, but they aren't seeing another dime of my money towards rules or codices. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 15, 2023 Report Share Posted March 15, 2023 3 minutes ago, Brother Glacius said: I'm done chasing 40k editions. I have my models. I'm good. I'll play whatever, but they aren't seeing another dime of my money towards rules or codices. If they offered the “digest” size rulebook that they’ve included in the last couple starter sets and a barebones “digest” codex for $20-30 USD each… then maybe, maybe, I’d buy one. But asking me to fork over $60 USD for a textbook size rulebook that is 75% reprinted non-rules content from the last nine editions, $50 for a codex that is 90% reprinted non-rules text from the last eight editions… and a sub-faction supplement, a campaign supplement, a (only somewhat optional) tournament rules pack… and cards… and tokens… and other cards… and… and… I’m sorry. But, no. I’m a free market capitalist to be sure, I don’t begrudge a company wanting to make a buck, but this just isn’t the sort of way I want to participate in this hobby. Back in WH40k Second through Sixth Editions, I could get the main rulebook and one codex and that was all I needed. The rules cost less than $50 and the codices were under $30. I know inflation has occurred, but the prices have risen far ahead of inflation. Yeah, yeah, hobby gaming is a luxury item. It’s not a necessity… But for a fraction of the cost GW expects me to pay, I can get a heck of a lot more mileage out of Catalyst, Osprey, etc. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Glacius Posted March 16, 2023 Report Share Posted March 16, 2023 Don't forget one page rules. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted March 16, 2023 Report Share Posted March 16, 2023 Still haven’t gotten around to trying OPR. Keep meaning to… 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salty Monkey Posted March 16, 2023 Report Share Posted March 16, 2023 1 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2023 I can't get behind OPR because they arbitrarily made everything too much the same. Every faction has the same access to psykers, FNP, rending, no strats, etc No reason to play one faction over the other. Also they weirdly do everything in 1s or 3s. No 2 or 4 wounds, AP, damage etc. 40k would be a happy level of complexity if they didn't keep adding new layered rules just to sell more books/models. Because you'd only have to learn it once instead of starting over every few months. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tao Tsê-Mung Posted March 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2023 Or just make the single change of removing rerolls . . . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stoobert Posted April 2, 2023 Report Share Posted April 2, 2023 Wait - we’re at 10th Edition already? I thought we were at 8th still. << crawls back under a rock with my Sphess Maureens still on 25mm bases>> 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted April 4, 2023 Report Share Posted April 4, 2023 I really rather like this direction for the game… I’m just really apprehensive that the game will remain as streamlined going forward. I was really happy with Eighth Edition when it launched too. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Glacius Posted April 5, 2023 Report Share Posted April 5, 2023 Wow, with those stats, it would take forever for two squads of termies to off one another with shooting. It will take 81 storm bolter shots to score 54 hits, which result in 18 wounds, where three will fail on average, killing one terminator. Why are bolters feared again? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted April 5, 2023 Report Share Posted April 5, 2023 Well, I mean, boltguns are meant to be anti-infantry smallarms and terminator armor is meant to make one-man into a walking tank who is all but immune to anti-infantry smallarms… So this seems reasonable to me. Run the numbers for those to squads powerfistin’ each other in the face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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