WestRider Posted July 30, 2020 Report Share Posted July 30, 2020 In fact, Autocannon turret with Lascannon sponsons was the only build possible on the first Predator kit GW did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mulgrok Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 Apparently Multi-melta is changing to heavy 2. That explains the points difference. edit: 3 devastator squads in drop pods with vulkan he'stan and an ancient for 30 multi-melta attacks rereolling everything... edit2: supposedly the half range bonus will be changed to damage D6 with a minimum of 3 damage. That would be in line with newer rules for other anti-armor weapons. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 1 hour ago, Mulgrok said: Apparently Multi-melta is changing to heavy 2. That explains the points difference. edit: 3 devastator squads in drop pods with vulkan he'stan and an ancient for 30 multi-melta attacks rereolling everything... edit2: supposedly the half range bonus will be changed to damage D6 with a minimum of 3 damage. That would be in line with newer rules for other anti-armor weapons. Please...no...just no. Space marines already have everything, they do not need more things. I mean seriously Aggressors alone are broken as it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 If multimeltas change to Heavy 2 they better also be paired with a massive increase in points as it would make it, statistically, a better anti-tank weapon than the Lascannon at the same ranges as the Lascannon and a faaar better one within it’s short range. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mulgrok Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 28 minutes ago, Ish said: If multimeltas change to Heavy 2 they better also be paired with a massive increase in points as it would make it, statistically, a better anti-tank weapon than the Lascannon at the same ranges as the Lascannon and a faaar better one within it’s short range. Are they getting increased range though? They might remain 24". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted July 31, 2020 Report Share Posted July 31, 2020 Here's the "Mathhammer" assuming a fairly standard Space Marine BS3+ versus a Leman Russ (T: 8 Sv: 3+):Lascannon Range: 48", Type: Heavy 1, Str: 9 AP: -3, Dmg: d6, Special: None; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 1.296 Current Multimelta Range: 24", Type: Heavy 1, Str: 8 AP: -4, Dmg: d6, Special: When resolving an attack made with this weapon against a unit that is within half range, roll two D6 when inflicting damage with it and discard one of the results; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 1.167 over half range, 1.49 within half range Rumored Multimelta Range: 24", Type: Heavy 2, Str: 8 AP: -4, Dmg: d6, Special: When resolving an attack made with this weapon against a unit that is within half range, a damage roll of 1 or 2 counts as 3 instead; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 2.333 over half range, 3.33 within half range. Yes, the Lascannon can reach out a further 24' than the Multimelta, which has always been the big tradeoff between the two weapons. One hit harder, but you had to get right up in their face. But with these rumored changes to the multimelta, it will be significantly outperforming the Lascannon at every range up to 24"... and on the newly reduced tables that everyone wants to use? Yowza. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mulgrok Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 I will have to stop speculating until the official rules come out. Not good to get excited over leaks and rumors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 Just let me be able to use the thundefire cannon, who's been collecting dust for the past 3 years, in my blood angels army. I refuse to add heretic chapters to my loyal vampires!!! ...space wolves are the only acceptable allies... 4 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkie Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 18 hours ago, Lyraeus said: Please...no...just no. Space marines already have everything, they do not need more things. I mean seriously Aggressors alone are broken as it is. When everything is broken, nothing is. Just everybody play exclusively space marines, and it's all fine! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mulgrok Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 Good thing I bought a box of ETB Aggressors and Redemptor recently. They are now out of print and sold out everywhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PourSpelur Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 1 hour ago, Munkie said: When everything is broken, nothing is. Just everybody play exclusively space marines, and it's all fine! If only they made a game, real similar to 40k that focuses on Marine-on-Marine battles... 😉 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munkie Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 1 hour ago, PourSpelur said: If only they made a game, real similar to 40k that focuses on Marine-on-Marine battles... 😉 If only... Maybe in another 10,000 years such a thing will exist. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 2 hours ago, Munkie said: When everything is broken, nothing is. Just everybody play exclusively space marines, and it's all fine! boring Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 22 hours ago, Lyraeus said: Please...no...just no. Space marines already have everything, they do not need more things. I mean seriously Aggressors alone are broken as it is. Yeah, they're great against knights, flyers, the awesome dreads from forgeworld, mortal wound spams, anything with -2 AP... Yeah, broken they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 3 hours ago, Munkie said: When everything is broken, nothing is. Just everybody play exclusively space marines, and it's all fine! The really annoying thing is that (minus one or two quirks that were addressed in Errata) the first Codex: Space Marines of eighth edition was a very well-balanced book... It was the Bolter Discipline rule, some of the supplements and the second Codex: Space Marines that turned them into monsters. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MexicanNinja Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 On 7/29/2020 at 4:11 PM, Ish said: Actually, it’s only the turret that matters. Sponsons are optional equipment, both in the rules and in-universe. Typically, the autocannon turreted Destructor gets heavy bolter sponsons to maximize its anti-infantry / anti-transport role and the twin-linked lascannon turreted Annihilator gets lascannon sponsons to maximize its anti-tank role; But Space Marines being all about tactical flexibility, it isn’t uncommon to make a jack-of-all-trades variant by swapping the sponson options around. (There also used to be a Leman Russ Annihilator, a twin-linked lascannon turret on the indestructible iron box we all know and love and/or fear. I miss it.) Pardon me, the correct way, and only acceptable way, to kit out a predator is with a flamestorm cannon turret and heavy flamer sponsors. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted August 1, 2020 Report Share Posted August 1, 2020 29 minutes ago, Ish said: The really annoying thing is that (minus one or two quirks that were addressed in Errata) the first Codex: Space Marines of eighth edition was a very well-balanced book... It was the Bolter Discipline rule, some of the supplements and the second Codex: Space Marines that turned them into monsters. Balanced? Ehhhhh Bolter Discipline was a great rule that helped Space Marines come from bottom tier and over paying for units to having just enough fire power to deal with hordes better. Everything after that however has been EXCESSIVE 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 Someone has leaked the stats for the new Space Marine gun-turret and the Ultramario Kart: This is probably the source of the rumored Multimelta changes we were discussing the other day. Current Multimelta has a Range 24”, Type: Heavy 1, Str: 8 AP: -4, Dmg: d6, Special: When resolving an attack made with this weapon against a unit that is within half range, roll two D6 when inflicting damage with it and discard one of the results; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 1.167 over half range, 1.49 within half range. Leaked Multimelta has a Range 24”, Type: Heavy 2, Str: 8 AP: -4, Dmg: d6, Special: When an attack made with this weapon hits a target that is within half range, this attack has a Damage characteristic of D6+2; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 2.33 over half range, 3.667 within half range. If this extends to multimeltas throughout the Space Marine range and not just the Invader ATV, then I can see almost no reason to ever use another heavy weapon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 37 minutes ago, Ish said: Someone has leaked the stats for the new Space Marine gun-turret and the Ultramario Kart: This is probably the source of the rumored Multimelta changes we were discussing the other day. Current Multimelta has a Range 24”, Type: Heavy 1, Str: 8 AP: -4, Dmg: d6, Special: When resolving an attack made with this weapon against a unit that is within half range, roll two D6 when inflicting damage with it and discard one of the results; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 1.167 over half range, 1.49 within half range. Leaked Multimelta has a Range 24”, Type: Heavy 2, Str: 8 AP: -4, Dmg: d6, Special: When an attack made with this weapon hits a target that is within half range, this attack has a Damage characteristic of D6+2; BS 3+ Total Damage versus a Leman Russ: 2.33 over half range, 3.667 within half range. If this extends to multimeltas throughout the Space Marine range and not just the Invader ATV, then I can see almost no reason to ever use another heavy weapon. There are leaks for the necrons as well but the space marines blow it all out of the water Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 If they had just left it at Heavy 1, it wouldn’t be a problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Ish said: If they had just left it at Heavy 1, it wouldn’t be a problem. For what the Multi Melta? Yea it would of been nice but not as good. The ATV's are stupidly cheap per wound and are fast and have good weapons. Its stupid right now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 The ATV basically has the same stats as the Attack Bike (W: 8 versus W: 4, but the PL [and presumably the point cost] is also doubled) and no one exactly breaks into a cold sweat when they see an Attack Bike on the table... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 1 minute ago, Ish said: The ATV basically has the same stats as the Attack Bike (W: 8 versus W: 4, but the PL [and presumably the point cost] is also doubled) and no one exactly breaks into a cold sweat when they see an Attack Bike on the table... Point costs are already released. They were released in the Munitorum book. They are 80 points for the Onslaught and 85 for the MM version vs 55 for the Attack Bike. 3 Attack Bikes for 2 ATV's. 16 wounds, 4 MM shots, 12 Twin Boltgun shots always vs 12 wounds 2 MM shots 6-12 Twin Boltgun shots always. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ish Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 Don’t forget the bolt pistols! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lyraeus Posted August 4, 2020 Report Share Posted August 4, 2020 4 minutes ago, Ish said: Don’t forget the bolt pistols! oh boy....more shots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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